640 3 point not working

[Buffalo Pete]

New to us 640. Tractor 3 point operated fine this past Fall & into the winter. It sat for 2 weeks, and the lift won't budge anymore. Doesn't even try. Now........rightfully so, the weather has been below freezing the past couple weeks. Oil level on the transmission dip stick is in range, and looks like oil. I am suspecting some water in the oil someplace, but am also wondering about the pump losing it's prime? Any other places I should be looking?

 

[Sean in PA]

Hi, and welcome.

First off, the transmission, hydraulic reservoir and rear axle are 3 separate compartments on that tractor, so the level and quality of the oil in the transmission has nothing to do with the 3 point hydraulics working.

Second, the transmission on a 640 did not have a dipstick, but it is possible that the transmission fill plug has been replaced with one that does. The hydraulic sump for the 3 point system does have a dipstick, it is on the left side of the tractor, near where your left foot is when you're sitting on the seat. The pump could be losing its prime, or there could be water in the system that has frozen.

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

New to us 640. Tractor 3 point operated fine this past Fall & into the winter. It sat for 2 weeks, and the lift won't budge anymore. Doesn't even try. Now........rightfully so, the weather has been below freezing the past couple weeks. Oil level on the transmission dip stick is in range, and looks like oil. I am suspecting some water in the oil someplace, but am also wondering about the pump losing it's prime? Any other places I should be looking?

Are you engaging the PTO Lever? Did you try both DRAFT CONTROL and POSITION CONTROL? Pump not losing prime. You need to invest in these three manuals : 600/800 Operator's Manual; 53-59 MPC; and the I&T F0-20 Service Manual and read religiously. Here is a page from the OEM Manual on Lubrication Points and Schedule. Start here if'N ya wanna be a Ford Tractor Owner.

Tim Daley (MI)

 

[showcrop]

one of the most basic rules of trouble shooting is to try the easier potential causes first. This can save you hours, even days. It would be extremely unusual for your 640 to not have oil in the hydraulic housing. it gets there through a combination of daily condensation and lack of work generated heat to drive it out. Given that you have had two weeks of below freezing temps it would be very unlikely that the water has not frozen.

 

[Eman85]

I'd warm it up somehow, might have ice in the hydraulics.

 

[Sean in PA]

Are you engaging the PTO Lever?

Tim, are you confusing a 640 with an earlier 9N/2N//8N? The NAA and newer model tractors all have live hydraulics, meaning that the pump is being powered whenever the engine is running. No need to engage the PTO.

 

[showcrop]

one of the most basic rules of trouble shooting is to try the easier potential causes first. This can save you hours, even days. It would be extremely unusual for your 640 to not have oil in the hydraulic housing. it gets there through a combination of daily condensation and lack of work generated heat to drive it out. Given that you have had two weeks of below freezing temps it would be very unlikely that the water has not frozen.

That should have read "water in the hydraulic housing"

 

[JMOR]

Tim, are you confusing a 640 with an earlier 9N/2N//8N? The NAA and newer model tractors all have live hydraulics, meaning that the pump is being powered whenever the engine is running. No need to engage the PTO.

It can happen to any of us from time to time..............he is probably more whizzed at himself than anyone here.

 

[Buffalo Pete]

Hi guys - - this is the pump on my 640. Still can't get any response out of the 3 point. 40F today, so any ice should have melted. Cracked the drain plugs on all 3 chambers of the rear end. Oil, not water, instantly flowed. Running the tractor slow and fast, but no prime. Found some information to pressurize the the rear end with an air hose in the dip stick hole to push oil into the pump. Will be trying that tonight.

 

[showcrop]

Hi guys - - this is the pump on my 640. Still can't get any response out of the 3 point. 40F today, so any ice should have melted. Cracked the drain plugs on all 3 chambers of the rear end. Oil, not water, instantly flowed. Running the tractor slow and fast, but no prime. Found some information to pressurize the the rear end with an air hose in the dip stick hole to push oil into the pump. Will be trying that tonight.

Unless your 640 is inside at 80 degrees one day is not going to melt the ice.

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

Tim, are you confusing a 640 with an earlier 9N/2N//8N? The NAA and newer model tractors all have live hydraulics, meaning that the pump is being powered whenever the engine is running. No need to engage the PTO.

Yes, Sean, you a correct sir. This is what happens when you don't sleep... On a steroid for my Autoimmune Hemolytic Anemia, Cellulitis/Low Hemoglobin, and Lymphoedema, and is causing insomnia, weight gain, high glucose, water retention, and battling cardio/AFIB issues. Now it appears I have a high potassium count, high BUN CREATINE count, and kidney pain. Two steps forward and one step back or is it vice versa...

Tim Daley (MI)

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

New to us 640. Tractor 3 point operated fine this past Fall & into the winter. It sat for 2 weeks, and the lift won't budge anymore. Doesn't even try. Now........rightfully so, the weather has been below freezing the past couple weeks. Oil level on the transmission dip stick is in range, and looks like oil. I am suspecting some water in the oil someplace, but am also wondering about the pump losing it's prime? Any other places I should be looking?

Let tractor warm up about 15 mins then try system. Oil will be a murky/milky white if contaminated with water. If water is present, the cold temps may cause it to freeze and prevent system from operating. That is a big problem so ya gotta then determine why is water getting into the system.

Try to raise the Touch Control Lever Quadrant fully in 'UP' position and leave it alone. After 1-15 minutes if 3-PT doesn't rise up, you have a problem. Draining old oil and replacing with new probably won't do anything so you'd then have to get into the system directly. There are NO QUICK-FIX/BAND-AIDS/EASY FIXES to solve problem. Consult your manuals.

Tim Daley (MI)

 

[Buffalo Pete]

Greetings all - - - we were able to get the tractor in a slightly heated garage for a few days. Drained the oil out. Should have been about 9 quarts of oil, but about 12 quarts drained out, and it was loaded with water. Put the new oil in, but it took a while till the pump picked up its prime, but now, all is well. We also found a hole in the casting under the seat, in an area that would easily collect water. The hole was about 1/2" diameter and not something drilled. Kinda like a rust hole. This hole was cleaned up and packed with JB weld. All's well at this point. Thanx for your help all !

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

Greetings all - - - we were able to get the tractor in a slightly heated garage for a few days. Drained the oil out. Should have been about 9 quarts of oil, but about 12 quarts drained out, and it was loaded with water. Put the new oil in, but it took a while till the pump picked up its prime, but now, all is well. We also found a hole in the casting under the seat, in an area that would easily collect water. The hole was about 1/2" diameter and not something drilled. Kinda like a rust hole. This hole was cleaned up and packed with JB weld. All's well at this point. Thanx for your help all !

Should not warm up system to melt ice- not logical. How is the water getting into the system is what I'd be looking at first. Is the tractor setting outside uncovered when not in use? Yes? Harbor Freight has tarps, get one. When the water freezes and you start up the tractor and try to move it without a warm-up you risk cracking the hydraulic pump base and now you have a big problem. JB Weld ain't gonna fix that effectively. 1/2" diameter hole is pretty darn big if ya ask me. Whatever.

Your Mileage may vary...
Tim Daley (MI)

 

[John P.]

Hi guys - - this is the pump on my 640. Still can't get any response out of the 3 point. 40F today, so any ice should have melted. Cracked the drain plugs on all 3 chambers of the rear end. Oil, not water, instantly flowed. Running the tractor slow and fast, but no prime. Found some information to pressurize the the rear end with an air hose in the dip stick hole to push oil into the pump. Will be trying that tonight.

Wow, I don't think I've ever seen a 640 still wearing a vane pump!