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harbor freight saw

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Joe W.
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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 3:36 pm    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Yes, Barnyard, I'm with you. I bought a Harbor Freight 10" sliding miter saw about 4 years ago and it does everything I need it to do. I have a hobby that uses 2x8's, 2x6's, 1x12's and other 1x boards that the HF sliding saw handles with ease. It cost me around $87 and it's perfect for my needs.
 
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BarnyardEngineering
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 4:55 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

rustyfarmall wrote:
Harbor Freight was originally called Harbor Freight Salvage. Lots of merchandise gets damaged on the boats from China. Insurance pays off, and then HF bought it from the insurance company. So yes, in the beginning everything Harbor Freight sold had previously been rejected.


Even then the "Salvage" part was BS.

Month after month, year after year, the catalogs would come in the mail, and it would be the same stuff every time, just like now. If you don't have limited stock on anything, and different stock each month, you have a regular supply. You are not salvaging anything.

"Salvage" was just a fashionable way to present the image that they were offering the customer a good deal. They dropped "Salvage" when they decided a more upscale image would help sales.
 
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rustyfarmall
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 6:51 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

BarnyardEngineering wrote:
(quoted from post at 05:55:19 05/19/17)
rustyfarmall wrote:
Harbor Freight was originally called Harbor Freight Salvage. Lots of merchandise gets damaged on the boats from China. Insurance pays off, and then HF bought it from the insurance company. So yes, in the beginning everything Harbor Freight sold had previously been rejected.


Even then the "Salvage" part was BS.

Month after month, year after year, the catalogs would come in the mail, and it would be the same stuff every time, just like now. If you don't have limited stock on anything, and different stock each month, you have a regular supply. You are not salvaging anything.

"Salvage" was just a fashionable way to present the image that they were offering the customer a good deal. They dropped "Salvage" when they decided a more upscale image would help sales.


You are probably correct, but I still refuse to ever darken their doors again.
 
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kcm.MN
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 7:56 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Well, here's my main gripe about HF, as well as other similar sellers - it's the selling of low-cost products that are manufactured under little, if any, quality control. I first saw this on my visits to Finland way back....gee, about 3 lifetimes ago it seems! I noticed that ALL of the tools over there looked like the same style and quality as the tools I'd see in the HF catalogs. ...This was in the early-to-mid 90's, by the way. My friends there said they used to be able to buy quality tools, but the new Chinese tools were so cheap, that people just stopped buying them.

Well, guess what?? Same thing finally happened here in the good ol' USofA. It started small, and HF was at the forefront. I did not realize this at the time - you know, wearing blinders and all. So over a period of just a couple of decades, China was able to overwhelm the amazing great name of American tools, American quality and American made, and eventually there were simply too many people who didn't have the money (OR were too tight) to spend for quality tools that would keep their neighbors and countrymen employed. It started small - at first, just cheap tools outlets. Bigger names in other industries got the great idea of being able to keep building here, but get many of their parts from "there"; companies like Compaq, for example (D@^^N YOU ECKHARD PFEIFFER!!). Anyway, the pattern grew. Too many stockholders and too many CEO's/CFO's were seeing a way to slash their costs and put more money in the books. ''I was Assy Line Supervisor for a while for one of Compaq's vendor companies and, the General Manager we had there in Houston was originally from Canada. Smart man - VERY smart!! BUT....he liked to make things look good on the books! I went to him one day and broke it all down, pointing out that even though it "looks" good on the books, it's still costing the company more money. But he didn't care. ...I didn't stay there long. He thought of employee safety about as much as he thought about being honest with the company's money.

Anyway, as more and more people started buying the el cheapo Chinese tools, the horrific vulgarities over lousy quality began to fly. However, these same people kept buying the cheap junk, which just kept the cycle going. Before too many years, American companies that had always built with quality began to be forced to either jump on the bandwagon or sink. However, there simply was not any quality control to be found in China at the time. So at first, they tried hiring Chinese people to work as quality control. That's like taking a farm boy who has never even seen a TV before and plopping him down in front of a bunch of computer parts and telling him to build a computer. It just didn't work! So, our companies started sending people over there to "oversee" the quality control workers there. Well, that wasn't quite the answer either, as they still did not really know/understand the point of it all. Their approach to it all was this way: To build as much product as you can, as cheaply as you can, and then deal with the rejects later. That was the Chinese way of keeping costs down, and it worked - it was able to overthrow the greatest and most amazing industrial nation on the face of the Earth!!

Now, many of the Chinese (and other countries, like Philippines, India and others) are beginning to really understand the way quality control works, although there are still MANY old-school there who still follow the "build-'em'fast-and-cheap" way of thinking. Many Americans have sent their own people oversees, at first to train in the other folks - you know, the natives there. And, if you wanted to keep your job, you ended up a long ways from home and had quite the long carpool for getting back for your kid's graduation, or for a funeral. That big bus from there didn't get the best gas mileage of all, carried LOTS of people with little elbow room, and had wings! Shocked But, that was the result of "Downsizing", and many folks took the job overseas out of far of losing all that they had invested in that company - 401k, employee ranking, accrued vacation time, etc. Still, many employees were forced to make cutbacks in those areas as well, all trying to keep their job.

Now let's advance a little further - next rung of the ladder (downward) is where we're at now. China and other countries now do most of their own quality control, while the fewer employees needed here just QC check a sample of the product now and then. Still, there are manufacturers there that are still old-school and DO fill that void in the marketplace for people who just want to buy the cheapest item they can get their hands on.....and it's a huge piece of the pie to be sure!!

Look, I have nothing inherently against China or the Chinese, but what their el cheapo methods did to our engineering and manufacturing society is, IMO, reprehensible!! But what's done is done and there is no going back. Disposable "everything" is here to stay!! Why buy expensive tools and let your employees abuse the heck out of them? Why not just buy the el cheapo stuff, and figure the costs into every job? Why build things to last when technology WILL be passing it up sooner rather than later??

Well, I'm a die-hard kinda guy who still believes in quality product REGARDLESS of where it hails from! I've all but given up on the USA being at the top of that list. I'd like to believe that some day that the terms "high quality" and "pride" will return as terms that describe how we make things here, but I've got my doubts. Don't think I'll live that long in either case anyhow.

As for those of you who still "like" buying from places like HF, more power to you!! It's a free country, and I believe that everyone has that right, and I'd fight to the death to support that right!! .....Just don't ask me to fight for having our government and laws outsourced as well. That's where I'd have to draw the line.

******************

NOTE: Sorry for the blog here, but this thread sort of built a fire inside me and I had to turn the heat down a bit. ...Which I'm afraid might also have turned the heat UP with some of you. Again, I write this NOT to degrade anyone or their buying habits, but simply explaining how we got here and "my" personal feelings on that subject. I'm writing this off the cuff, so no proof-reading and no going back to make little corrections that may sound better, so please do expect mistakes on my part. I'm not perfect - just ask my wife!! If you feel offended by reading this, please accept my most sincere apologies, as no offense is meant.

signed,
The Management (of this little hole-in-the-wall, anyhow) Wink

...Ok, ok...the wife is The Management; I'm just the hired hand! *lol*
 
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Stephen Newell
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 8:14 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Isn't it amazing the people that don't buy Harbor Freight tools seem to think they are an authority on their tools. Personally I've been replacing name brand tools with Harbor Freight tools for my home remodeling business and have found their tools to be equal or exceed the quality of name brand tools. I think probably the majority of the tools I have now come from Harbor Freight. Like any tool company they have a few selected items that don't measure up but Harbor Freight will take the tools back you don't like with no questions asked. Over the years the tools I've taken back I could probably count on one hand.
 
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rustyfarmall
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 8:35 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

CVPost-Stephen Newell wrote:
(quoted from post at 09:14:30 05/19/17) Isn't it amazing the people that don't buy Harbor Freight tools seem to think they are an authority on their tools. Personally I've been replacing name brand tools with Harbor Freight tools for my home remodeling business and have found their tools to be equal or exceed the quality of name brand tools. I think probably the majority of the tools I have now come from Harbor Freight. Like any tool company they have a few selected items that don't measure up but Harbor Freight will take the tools back you don't like with no questions asked. Over the years the tools I've taken back I could probably count on one hand.


I own quite a few tools that are going on 50 years old. Name brand, made in the U.S.A. A bit worse for wear in the cosmetics, but every bit as functional as they were when brand new. I still have the Weller, dual heat soldering gun that I recieved as a gift way back in about 1966 or 1967. It still works. I still use it.

The folks who think that Harbor Freight stuff is just as good simply have not lived long enough to have experienced REAL quality.
 
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kcm.MN
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 9:14 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Rusty, I'd have to disagree with you there. There ARE instances of exceptional product coming from HF. I, for one, have an older pneumatic clipped head framing nailer that is a tank! It runs like there's no tomorrow. Meanwhile, can't tell you how many contractors I'd hear about who were going through one or more name-brand nailers every week! Part of that equation is how someone cares for their tools, and that includes on the job.

HF has some decent stuff. My gripe is that you cannot "depend" on it being high quality. And sadly now, you cannot depend on "any" brand being high quality!! THAT is my gripe!

But in the real world, there are people who don't take care of their tools, or who only use them once in a blue moon. For those people, there is no real reason to pay the higher price of name brand - especially now when name brand doesn't guarantee quality.
 
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kcm.MN
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 9:16 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

....That said, I have also gotten enough "junk" from HF over the years to no longer even be the slightest bit interested in their products or thumbing through their catalogs....of which, I don't even get anymore.
 
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rustyfarmall
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PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 9:58 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

kcm.MN wrote:
(quoted from post at 10:14:46 05/19/17) Rusty, I'd have to disagree with you there. There ARE instances of exceptional product coming from HF. I, for one, have an older pneumatic clipped head framing nailer that is a tank! It runs like there's no tomorrow. Meanwhile, can't tell you how many contractors I'd hear about who were going through one or more name-brand nailers every week! Part of that equation is how someone cares for their tools, and that includes on the job.

HF has some decent stuff. My gripe is that you cannot "depend" on it being high quality. And sadly now, you cannot depend on "any" brand being high quality!! THAT is my gripe!

But in the real world, there are people who don't take care of their tools, or who only use them once in a blue moon. For those people, there is no real reason to pay the higher price of name brand - especially now when name brand doesn't guarantee quality.


Yes. Occasionally some good stuff does come from China, but you can't bank on it. Many years ago, maybe about 1979, when HF first started, I ordered a small bench grinder and a set of screwdrivers. Almost immediately the wooden handles on the screwdrivers all cracked and fell apart. The bench grinder is still going, and still in use, although I did have to replace the on/off switch a couple of years ago.
 
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Roland (AL)
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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 8:44 am    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If it is like mine, a piece of wood got cought and forced back and bent the fence across the back. I have not fixed it yet but I will try to straighten and if it brakes I will cut a piece of angle iron and shape to replace the fence. The fence on mine bolts on.

Latr Roland (AL)
 
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DGinVT
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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 7:44 pm    Post subject: Re: harbor freight saw Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I use a piece of hard wood about 3/4 inch thick by 2 1/2 high and four feet long. On the inside face of the wooden fencethere is a piece of plastic tape stuck on it. The wood, to be cut slides quite nicely along it.
 
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