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8N connecting rods

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hotdawg22
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 12:54 pm    Post subject: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I am ready to put the pistons back in and ran into another question or two
First: are the rods offset and does it matter which one goes in what cylinder? I know that the notch in the piston goes toward the front.
Second: Does it matter which way the rod caps go back on?
Thanks all.
 
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Charner
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:20 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

"put the pistons back in" - don't know what you did - I assume you put new rings on pistons. It is absolutely necessary to replace the pistons the same way they came out. Usually there are small notches on the rod made with a small file. Thats if it has been rebuilt before. The reason is the piston are worn to match the sleeve and the rod is worn to match the crank shaft. Good luck.
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:22 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

hotdawg22 wrote:
(quoted from post at 16:54:17 05/16/13) I am ready to put the pistons back in and ran into another question or two
First: are the rods offset and does it matter which one goes in what cylinder? I know that the notch in the piston goes toward the front.
Second: Does it matter which way the rod caps go back on?
Thanks all.
Usually the rods are marked with a cylinder number, so install accordingly. If replacement rods, probably not numbered and it doesn't matter. Mechanically doesn't matter even if numbered, but might cause confusion to someone later. No offset on N's.Rod caps are another matter. They should never be un-paired. Keep each rod with its respective cap...always. As for direction of cap relative to rod, the insert anti-rotate tabs both belong on same side (toward same rod bolt) of rod.
 
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ZANE
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 5:52 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I hope you realize that the rod caps must be mated to the exact rod it came off.

Mix them up and you have a big bad problem.

The bearing keeper tabs go to the left side of the engine on the N engines and later American made Ford tractors also.

Zane
 
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Welding man
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 6:14 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I cannot believe the number of people that try to do mechanic work and do not have a service manual.If I don't have a manual,I get one,or I don't work on it.I have hundreds for just about every make and model of tractor and they are invaluable. I guess when you are working on your own stuff it doesn't matter if you screw it up,but if it's the customers,lookout.
 
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hotdawg22
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 6:58 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

as i took the pistons out i kept the cap on the same rod it came off of. Then i laid them all out in the order they came out so i can re-install the same way. However as i was putting the rings on i noticed that the rods were not numbered so i wanted to ask the question just in case there was an offset to any of them.
Other thing was, the bearing keeper tabs are opposite each other. If i turn them to both being on same side there is a visable difference in that they just do not align up. Is that possible?
 
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hotdawg22
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 7:00 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Maybe you are in the business of doing mechanic work. ??t
I come here for expert advice and usually get so thank you for your comment.
 
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hotdawg22
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 7:06 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I did replace the sleeves and the rods are still on the same pistons with new rings installed. I know the engine was rebuilt 3 years ago and it was abad job so everything has been re-done. I mentioned above that the bearing keeper tabs were installed opposite each other and the align perfectly and if i move them around to both on the same side , they become offset and don't match.
Looks like someone "made them fit" last overhaul.
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 7:17 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

hotdawg22 wrote:
(quoted from post at 23:06:17 05/16/13) I did replace the sleeves and the rods are still on the same pistons with new rings installed. I know the engine was rebuilt 3 years ago and it was abad job so everything has been re-done. I mentioned above that the bearing keeper tabs were installed opposite each other and the align perfectly and if i move them around to both on the same side , they become offset and don't match.
Looks like someone "made them fit" last overhaul.
What aligns perfectly? The tabs? The rod to rod cap? "They" doesn't say much.
 
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Welding man
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 3:56 am    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

That was my advice,buy a manual. Second and third hand information is not always the right information.Read it for yourself and you will remember it a lot longer and if you need other info on you equipment you will have it at hand,when you need it. I'm sorry for being a perfectionist.I believe in doing it right or don't do it.
 
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ZANE
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 11:31 am    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

To be safe I would take the rods to an automotive machine shop and have them all resized so as not to get it wrong.
The tabs are definately supposed to be together on the same side of the rods.

All facing the left side of the engine.

There is no offset to the rods in an N Ford engine. Will work either way but not sure if the oil hole in the rod would work as good turned the wrong way????????????

Zane
 
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R Geiger
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 11:58 am    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The last two I overhauled were all marked on the rod and cap with punch marks. 1 mark for number one and on up. Not saying yours are tho! .
Good Luck
 


Last edited by R Geiger on Fri May 17, 2013 12:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 12:03 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

ZANE wrote:
(quoted from post at 15:31:44 05/17/13) To be safe I would take the rods to an automotive machine shop and have them all resized so as not to get it wrong.
The tabs are definately supposed to be together on the same side of the rods.

All facing the left side of the engine.

There is no offset to the rods in an N Ford engine. Will work either way but not sure if the oil hole in the rod would work as good turned the wrong way????????????

Zane
Plenty of documentation out there as to where numbers face, tab positioning, tabs face, oil holes face, etc., but the much more interesting question to me is WHY, other than that is the way the factory did it? Is there any reason why , in this specific engine, that rods facing either way, will not function equally well? I'm fine with rod cap orientation to a rod...fully understand those reasons.
 
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ZANE
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 3:08 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If my memory serves me right there is only one oil hole in the top of the rod at tha crank journal. It is either the leading side of the rod or the following side of the rod and I would assume that it is enginereed to throw oil at the piston pin etc at a certain angle???

Got to be a reason and that is whey the bearing retainer tabs go to the left of the engine.

Zane
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 3:26 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N connecting rods Reply to specific post Reply with quote

ZANE wrote:
(quoted from post at 19:08:28 05/17/13) If my memory serves me right there is only one oil hole in the top of the rod at tha crank journal. It is either the leading side of the rod or the following side of the rod and I would assume that it is enginereed to throw oil at the piston pin etc at a certain angle???

Got to be a reason and that is whey the bearing retainer tabs go to the left of the engine.

Zane
May be, but I don't have one in my hand, but the photos look like it is centered. The repair manual says squirt hole front or rear doesn't matter. The FO-4 actually shows spray from both sides in their illustration. Other engine rebuild manuals show or say hole to front..........so, I guess you just take your pick. Opinion: since it is oiling the skirt, I go with 'it doesn't matter'. Sand on left/right tabs side. But, I have no problem with "put it back the way Ford built it"....that is what I would do, but I still like to understand the "why". Might be like the story of cutting off the end of the ham bone before cooking. Granddaughter asked why her mother cut it off, because my mother did. Asked grandma why she did, etc., etc., and finally the eldest said, "because I didn't have a larger pan". We can't ask far enough back....all dead.
 
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