Yesterday's Tractor Co. Parts for Farm Tractors - Compare our Prices!
Click Here or call 800-853-2651 
   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 9N,2N,8N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   Traditional YT Forum ViewClassic View   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Another water heater question.

Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic    
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Steve@Advance
Tractor Expert


Joined: 12 Nov 2013
Posts: 1673


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:51 pm    Post subject: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I'm looking to replace my 20 year old electric water heater soon.

I have a household of 3, myself with minimal needs, but a wife and teen daughter that... do girly stuff in the bathroom involving mass quantities of hot water...

I currently have a 50 gallon that works well, or it did till the lower element went out. I'm scared to try to replace it, might start a leak and I'm sure it's full of calcium.

So, my choices are:
Go with a 50 gallon Rheem Marathon, fiberglass tank,lifetime guarantee, uses standard elements and thermostats, $800.00.

Or a 27kw tankless heater. I'v read good things about them but never actually seen one in use. Somehow it's supposed to drastically lower energy consumption, but I can't see how? It costs $500.00.

My concern is the 115 amps it requires to operate. I have a 200a service. If the water heater (115a), electric furnace(63a), dishwasher (10a?), electric range & oven(40?), dryer (30a) plus misc are all on...

As you can see I'm well over the 200a limit. I've read several reviews and no one has complained about tripping the main or dimming the lights or burning the buss bars...

What am I missing here? Is the 115 amps a worse case situation that rarely happens? Are the elements powered up one at a time only as needed? Am I sizing this properly?

Anyone have one of these or have a recommendation?
Thanks!
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Russ from MN
Tractor Expert


Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 2686


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 9:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Put a new element in your old one for now, they are cheap! Clean out the calcium and flush it out. Have a new drain valve available, that's the only problem I ever had, destroyed it getting it to open.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
paul
Tractor Guru


Joined: 25 Dec 1997
Posts: 20799


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 9:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Check with your electrical supplier, some have programs to put in a Matathon at reduced rates.

I got an 80 gallon Marathon installed for $120 out of my pocket in the early 1990s. Really haven't thought about it, it just works.

Paul
 
Back to top
View user's profile
huntingreen2day2
Regular


Joined: 14 Oct 2011
Posts: 253


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 9:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I would fix the old one also. The last thing I would do is install a instant water heater if I had people in the house that used excessive amounts of hot water.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
jeffcat
Long Time User


Joined: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 1381


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 9:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Sorry but I wouldn't replace and element. Have seen too many people break off bolts and stuff. If you get a little older then the troubles of getting it in and out of the basement and the costs just keep going up. My $.o2
 
Back to top
View user's profile
john in la
Tractor Guru


Joined: 28 Mar 2004
Posts: 6873
Location: Bedico, La.

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

With everything I read when looking for a new water heater...........
Said the gas ones were OK and you could just about recoup your extra upfront cost in energy savings over the life of the unit.
The electric units were a stay away from unit unless it was a new construction house.
Consumer Reports Magazine

 
Back to top
View user's profile
howdy1960
Tractor Expert


Joined: 15 Jul 2012
Posts: 1728


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 10:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Didn't Ask This Old House do a segment on tankless water heaters and said electric one not all that great? I seen them replace a lot with gas tho.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
david - or
Regular


Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 169


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote


With an electric furnace and electric range and 200 amp service you should forget about electrically powered on-demand water heaters. It is completely realistic for the furnace, water heat, and range to all be on at once. You are already perilously close to the limits of your service with just these 3 loads.

If your primary heat is that electric furnace, and if the water heater is located within the heated envelope of the house, the stand-by losses of a storage tank cost you zero in the winter time. (The heat lost from the tank heats the house, which you need to do anyway).
 
Back to top
View user's profile
tiresntracks
Long Time User


Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 527


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The first thing I would do is replace the element. If something breaks or leaks you're not out much for the element and you were going to replace the whole heater anyway. If it works, and it probably will, you just saved a bunch of money.
Whenever I work on a water heater I always have the shop vac handy. Works good for cleaning up spills and leaks before they get too big. If you can't get the drain valve to work, you can unscrew the element (not all the way, just until water starts running out) and suck up the water with the vac. Screw the element in, empty the vac and repeat until empty.
When you get the bottom element out, make a flexible extension for the vac hose and remove the sediment and deposits from the bottom of the tank.
About the tankless heater, don't do it! I added a third bathroom to our house and I was going to replace the 50 gallon water heater with an 80 gallon. Then I thought about my daughters staying in the bathroom until the water heater was empty and I kept the 50. Now they run out of hot water before I run out of money.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
MarkB_MI
Tractor Guru


Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 7858


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 3:09 am    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Hmm. Since you've already decided to trash the old heater, what do you have to lose by changing out the element? You gotta drain it to move it, anyway.

A tankless heater saves money, in theory, because it doesn't need to keep 40 or 50 gallons of water hot all the time. But there are other ways to save cost with an electric heater. See if your power company offers interruptible water heater service; you pay a much cheaper rate in exchange for letting the utility cut your service for a few minutes out of the hour during peak demand. Or, if nobody is home during the day, consider putting the water heater on a timer.

You are wise to be concerned about your 200 amp service being adequate to handle a 27 kW water heater. Just the furnace and water heater alone will have you service nearly tapped out. You're likely to see lights dimming when the water heater kicks in, even if it doesn't trip your main. You could go with a slightly smaller unit; I see Rheem offers two 5 gpm units, one 27 kw and another rated at 18 kw/75 amps. The latter seems more reasonable, but I'd still be concerned. If it was my house, I'd stick with a conventional water heater.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Two Dogs
Long Time User


Joined: 03 Nov 2007
Posts: 816


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 4:13 am    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I tried the electric tankless route for a few miserable months. It was exciting in the shower going from scalding to freezing and back each time my pump cycled or another faucet in the house was used. I gave that junk away and am now the happy owner of a traditional storage tank water heater. I never noticed any lowering of my electric use either. TDF
 
Back to top
View user's profile
IaGary



Joined: 14 Jun 2007
Posts: 7909
Location: North Liberty Iowa

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:14 am    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

There is a type of electric water heater that has been out for a a couple of years now.

A Electric Heat Pump water heater. It works similar to a heat pump that is used to heat a house only on a smaller scale.

Next hot water heater I have to buy I will look at one of those heat pump water heaters.

Daughter put one in there house of 4 people and seems to work okay with less power usage than a electric resistant heat water heater.

Check it out.
Heat pump water heater.

 
Back to top
View user's profile
showcrop
Tractor Guru


Joined: 13 Dec 2000
Posts: 11185


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:24 am    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote


I assume when you say full of calcium, that you have very hard water. For me that eliminates a tankless heater immediately. It will scale up way faster than your tank. I have replaced many elements in hot water heaters where the water was hard. Just get your self set up with everything you need. If it bolts in get a couple spare bolts. We used to always carry spare elements and spare bolts on the truck, and plan on replacing bad elements when we encountered them. For hard water you should put in a low watt density element. It takes them a lot longer to scale up.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
JDemaris
Tractor Guru


Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 12533


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:26 am    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Tankless is not going to "drastically" lower anything except maybe the weight of your wallet.
A good well insulated tank-heater uses very little energy when in "stand-by." A tank heater uses the same power and some use less then a tankless when actually heating the water. The main gain to having a tankless is when you need hot water in a remote area and don't need it often.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
George Marsh
Tractor Guru


Joined: 05 Aug 2009
Posts: 6049
Location: terre haute

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:28 am    Post subject: Re: Another water heater question. Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Steve, you can't go tankless unless you have a softner. Lime will build up in the tankless too.

Replacing elements is a PIA. I use my shop vac and a small hose to suck the lime out. The last element was a big challenge to get out. Most of the time getting the element out is much easier.

There are lifetime elements, hi density that will last forever in lime. The last set, I ordered from amazon. They were less than $25 each. Ordering 2 elements meant free shipping. Besides you have a top and bottom element.

I will never go tankless.

What do you have to lose, fix yours.

Harbor freight sells water alarms for around $10. If you are worried about leaks, get an alarm.

I worry about plumbing leaks, because I have a well. My pump is in the basement. I rigged up an alarm with a switch. My alarm will kill the power to the pump. 3 months after installing the alarm, I had a leak, and alarm worked, Thank
GOD.

Go for it.
George
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Yesterday's Tractors Forum Index -> Tractor Talk All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
TRACTOR   PARTS TRACTOR   MANUALS
Same-Day Shipping! Most of our stocked parts ship the same day you order (M-F).  Expedited shipping available, just call!  Most prices for parts and manuals are below our competitors.  Compare our super low shipping rates!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor.  We are a Company you can trust and have generous return policies!   Shop Online Today or call our friendly sales staff toll free (800) 853-2651.

YT Home  |  Forums Home

Copyright © 1997-2014 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters