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D19 LP will not start unless pulled


 
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Garri
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2014 8:49 pm    Post subject: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

We have a 1962 Allis D19 factory LP that has become very stubborn. I have replaced ALL of the following: Alternator, points and condenser (twice), spark plugs, spark plug wires, coil, distributor cap, battery and rotor. Starter seemed to be dragging a little, so I just had it rebuilt. I also replaced the wire from the coil to the distributor. It turns over fine, but will not start. Will not even try, even with ether. I can pull the tractor and within 3 feet, it will bust right off with no hesitation. Points are gapped at 22 per the original owners manual. I just don"t get it. I have checked the distributor and I am getting a full 12 volts inside the distributor. Any advice and help will certainly be appreciated.
 
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Mr. T. Minnesota
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 12:34 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

G,
Not familiar with LP fueled engines and their ignition system. Just shooting in the dark, you say the starter is dragging a little. Might be the bushings are worn and the starter is drawing more than it should and causes ignition voltage problems!!! When being pulled there is no draw at the starter which allows full voltage to the ignition. Some thing to try, by pass start the engine with another battery allowing the ignition full voltage from the existing battery. Do not use the starter switch. Jump directly to starter. Be careful. If that is the problem you may need to replace the bushings on the starter. Hope this made sense-3:30 AM central Minnesota. If you try this, let us know what happens:)
Mr.T. Minnesota
 
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Mr. T. Minnesota
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 3:17 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

G,
Should not have read your post at 3:30 AM. You rebuilt the starter- there goes my theory:) Hope you find a solution. Any hints on starting an '65 HD3 diesel crawler!! I am close but not quite there.
Mr. T. Minnesota
 
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DiyDave
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 3:48 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Sounds like a quirk particular to LP's. There is a breather hole, in the LP system, (I think it senses atmospheric pressure) somewhere, that a hole spider will stuff a dead bug into, lay an egg on it, then seal the hole, with papery substance. Don't know if this is your problem, but have heard of it before...
 
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Bob Bancroft
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 3:51 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I think Mr.T probably hit on it. Low voltage to the ignition while cranking. Is the tractor wiring original?
 
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wheelbarrow
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 4:07 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

sounds like your starter switch is not connecting ignition circuit while cranking the engine.try connecting a jumper wire from battery to switch side of coil while cranking engine.
 
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jerry4
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 5:25 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

does it have good compression/maby the valves need adjusting
 
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Indiana Ken
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 6:10 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Might pull a spark plug wire off and verify you have spark when the engine is cranking on the starter. I understand you have 12 volts at the distributor but that is not under cranking conditions.
 
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Tramway Guy
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 11:48 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Some other manufacturers used a ballast resistor that was bypassed by the starter/solenoid when starting as the spark needs to be hotter to start LP-gas engine. If the D-19 has this setup, it might not be working correctly.
 
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Garri
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 2:13 pm    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The resistor was removed years ago and not there. One thing I forgot to mention is when I have the distributor cap, rotor and cover off, I only see spark at the points intermittently. When there is spark, it is weak. Only every now and then I get a good bright spark in the points. I have not ran a compression check yet. A friend of mine mentioned that the other day. I will try that next, but how would low compression affect the electrical system? It starts so easy when pulled and runs so smooth and strong.
 
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Tramway Guy
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 3:30 pm    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Does it have a coil that is meant to work with or without a resistor? Resistors are in the design for a reason...
 
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Mr. T. Minnesota
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PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 4:16 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

G,
It is my understanding the resistor is there to reduce voltage so you do not burn up your points. If full voltage was allowed to go through the ignition it would not work for long. As far as the occasional good spark, check the condenser. Could be faulty from the get go! If you can, change it. As far as compression causing ignition problems, not sure. The only time compression seems involved with ignition is when a spark plug is faulty and will not fire under compression. Things I learned from my dad years ago! Hope this helps!
Mr. T. Minnesota
 
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Garri
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PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 9:19 pm    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Thanks for all the info. The condenser and points
that are in there now are the third new set that I
have put in in recent months. Same old story with
all three sets. I guess it is possible to have
three bad ones in a row, but I'm thinking it is
something else. Danged if I know though. I have
the tractor parked on an incline. Earlier today I
let it roll just a few feet and it started and ran
like a new one. I am ordering a new Pertronix
electronic ignition now from YT and will see if
that is the trick.
 
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Garri
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PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2014 9:21 pm    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

That is a good question. I don't know. I will ask NAPA tomorrow. The coil came from there. Maybe the computer or book will tell.
 
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wis jack
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PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2014 4:11 am    Post subject: Re: D19 LP will not start unless pulled Reply to specific post Reply with quote

put jumper wire from batt. to coil. your start terminl post on starter may not be working properly.
 
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