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806 alternator draining battery

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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:49 pm    Post subject: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I have a retro fit 10 SI alternator on my 806. I found the external regulator was still on the tractor with all the wires disconnected, so it shouldn't be affecting anything.

I had posted on the forum here on 12/15 about my alternator heating up, then not charging at all. Based on the information I got in responses I got things hooked up and my alternator was charging perfectly at 14 volts into a single 12 volt battery and not heating a bit. I really appreciated the help. But I still have problem that showed up after it sat a couple of days. The battery was pretty well drained.

The picture is how I hooked it up.I got a few extra ones in there of the same thing. That 10 gauge wire goes directly to the battery.

I do not have the diode in it yet. I have them ordered but wired in the idiot light for now.
The drain occurs when I hook up the sensing wire from the output post to the #2 spade of the internal voltage regulator. With that connected I get a full 13 volt discharge, checked between the neg post of the battery and ground. Taking that wire off the regulator spade stops the drain. The "exciter" wire isn't affecting anything.

I thought maybe the alternator was bad even with a new regulator, but it checks out fine at an auto parts store. I'm sure it's something I have crossed up, but don't know what it is. I can run the tractor like it is and just disconnect the ground strap, but getting it working would be better.

Appreciate the help, as always, Bob



 
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:19 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If you have the #1 wire on the 2 wire plug hooked up to the wrong place it will in fact cause the battery to be drained and also can/will burn the alternator out. You need it hook up to the ignition in such a way that with the ignition shut off it has no connection what so ever to the battery power
 
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Bob
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:22 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

With no voltage to the #1 "excite" terminal the alternator shouldn't be drawing a significant amount of current through either the large output stud or the #2 "Voltage sense" wire.

Can you measure the actual current draw instead of the voltage differential?
 
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Janicholson
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:42 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Is the diode polarity correct? the band on the diode must be on the side pointing to the alternator. Another issue might be the old regulator and wiring connected to it. It should be removed and wires traced to assure they are not hot. Jim
 
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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:48 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Just the voltmeter is all I have to check with, Bob. It shows the 13 volts and turns a test light on.

With the switch off there isn't anything at the "excite spade" on the voltage regulator. Since the wire comes over from the battery feed that puts current into the voltage regulator at the #2 spade. I did a temp wiring going from the #2 spade to the wiring plug, leaving the connection to the # 1 spade open. That gives me drain. Disconnect that and connect the # 1 with the spade to harness plug open and there's no drain with the switch off.

The three posts are hooked up pretty much like in the picture, except I don't have the diode yet. I believe the idiot light was a substitute for that diode, which I was doing for now.
 
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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:54 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I don't have the diode yet, just the idiot light in the system. I ran the new wire to the load on the switch over to the idiot light, then to the excite spade. The only wire I used that was on the tractor was the 10 gauge going directly to the battery. I haven't got an ammeter. With just the 10 gauge wire hooked up and the wire going to the regulator from the output post where the 10 gauge is hooked up, there's no drain.
 
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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:58 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

That's pretty well oriented by the harness plug, but there was some other wiring spices I took apart to be sure. The hot wire from the battery feed post goes directly to the number 2 spade on the volt reg. The other spade (#1) goes back to he idiot light and switch.

Thanks for the help.
 
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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Let me correct that last post of mine about the jumper wire going from the output post on the back of the battery. With that jumper connected to the voltage regulator is when I get the drain. If I disconnect that from the voltage regulator, the drain stops. That's with the wire to the battery hooked up to the alternator.
 
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:04 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Sounds like you need to take the alternator into a parts tore and have it checked. I know you have had a number of problems with this and to me it sounds like some how you have managed to some how burn out something In the alternator because the #2 wire should have zero voltage draw when running or not running it is the sensing wire which tells the alternator V.R. what the battery is doing and if that is shorted it will drain the battery
 
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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:16 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

That was what I started getting concerned about so I took it and had it checked. It checks out fine. The thing I'm wondering about though is the number two spade is showing continuity to ground. That would explain the battery drain, but how could it charge and pass the test at the auto parts store? Unless it would only show the charging and not a grounding of any type.

Has to be something there. I thought it must be a bad voltage regulator.

Thanks again, I'll keep working on it.
 
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Janicholson
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The smaller wire from the Bat terminal (big stud) to the Sense (#2 spade) should not have current flowing through it. It should just provide a voltage source to help control the output voltage. If the drain stops when that short wire is disconnected, the regulator has serious issues. Make sure it is connected to the #2 spade. The idiot light must not be grounded in any way. the excite current comes from the key switch, to one of the lamps terminals, the other lamp terminal must connect to the #1 Spade. This puts the idiot lamp "in the wire" from the key to the Alt. No ground to the lamp. When starting the tractor, the lamp will turn on because the regulator in the alternator acts like a ground (electronically) and the voltage from the key provides the volts to make it glow. When the alt turns and the tractor starts, the regulator #1 terminal stops being a ground, and becomes 12v. With 12v on both terminals of the lamp. and no ground, the lamp goes out. I hope this helps. Jim
 
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:48 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I have found that many of the test machines in auto parts store only get it right 50% of the time when testing things. I have them do the test at least 5 times and even then sometimes take it to another store and have them check it also
 
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Bob21 Martin
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 5:55 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

That helps a lot, Jim. This voltage regulator is new, but it must have a circuit to ground it shouldn't have. I don't know why it passed the test as being good. It does charge OK. The problem is in the drain afterwards.

I see what I can do with it.

Thanks again for all the help. Really appreciate it. Bob
 
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 8:34 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I am making an assumption that the original external regulator is not involved. New parts are sometimes non functional out of the box. Making electricity sometimes makes testing people believe it is OK. Jim
 
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Jon Hagen
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 8:54 pm    Post subject: Re: 806 alternator draining battery Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Pull the Delco alternators regulator plug off and look down between the regulator blades. If there is a little metal web connecting the #1 and #2 regulator blades, use a narrow hacksaw blade to cut out that web.

If no web at the alternator plug, remove the tractors old regulator cover down by your feet and unplug the regulator on the chance it is your battery drain.. Remove the regulator or not, but tape up the plug so it cant short to any metal.
 
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