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How to tell if it's charging?

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Paul in Edmonton
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:50 am    Post subject: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

How can I tell if my system is charging?

It's 6V (front mount) with a genny, but the generator and voltage regulator are not Ford. The VR is Autolite (looks like model VRR-4008-A) and the genny is Delco-Remy (model 1101355).

When the engine is running (which it is doing fine now with a new battery), voltage at the battery, as measured with a digital multimeter is jumping all over the place (and it's jumping more with the more expensive meter than it is with the cheap one). So I'm not sure what's really happening...

How can I tell if it's really charging or not?

Thanks,

-Paul
 
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old
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:03 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Digital meters do not like the engine spark noise and have that problem. Best to use an analog type meter which you can buy at radio shack for around $10 or so. You can also go buy a simple dash type volt meter and hook it to the battery and check with it not running then with it running. Not running with 6 volts you should get around 6.3 volts running you should see 7 plus. DO NOT pull one battery cable off with it running to check because you can/will let the smoke out of the charging system and you can also get hurt if you do something wrong as in maybe even dead
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:09 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Paul in Edmonton wrote:
(quoted from post at 11:50:24 11/16/12) How can I tell if my system is charging?

It's 6V (front mount) with a genny, but the generator and voltage regulator are not Ford. The VR is Autolite (looks like model VRR-4008-A) and the genny is Delco-Remy (model 1101355).

When the engine is running (which it is doing fine now with a new battery), voltage at the battery, as measured with a digital multimeter is jumping all over the place (and it's jumping more with the more expensive meter than it is with the cheap one). So I'm not sure what's really happening...

How can I tell if it's really charging or not?

Thanks,

-Paul
Need analog voltmeter, as digital does not like the electrically noisy environment. That VR number is factory original for early 8N tractors, but they did not use Delco-Remy generators but no reason that a D-R generator won't work.
 
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Bruce (VA)
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:18 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Check out tip # 47 (as others are saying).

Or replace the ammeter on the tractor.
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Britcheflee
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:31 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Paul in Edmonton wrote:
(quoted from post at 08:50:24 11/16/12) How can I tell if my system is charging?

It's 6V (front mount) with a genny, but the generator and voltage regulator are not Ford. The VR is Autolite (looks like model VRR-4008-A) and the genny is Delco-Remy (model 1101355).

When the engine is running (which it is doing fine now with a new battery), voltage at the battery, as measured with a digital multimeter is jumping all over the place (and it's jumping more with the more expensive meter than it is with the cheap one). So I'm not sure what's really happening...

How can I tell if it's really charging or not?

Well, I guess if you use it over a period of time and the battery goes flat would that not also indicate it is not charging? Do the light dim and brighten on these tractors as you increase/decrease the rpm as well?

Thanks,

-Paul

 
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Dell (WA)
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:06 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Paul........you ask......"How can I tell if my system is charging?".......would it surprize you to learn that is what your AMMETER is for??? When running, you should read 3-5 amps (+) Iff'n it reads (-) minus amps, guess what??? It ain't charging. ........respectfully, Dell
 
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Paul in Edmonton
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:16 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Dell (WA) wrote:
(quoted from post at 19:06:14 11/16/12) Paul........you ask......"How can I tell if my system is charging?".......would it surprize you to learn that is what your AMMETER is for??? When running, you should read 3-5 amps (+) Iff'n it reads (-) minus amps, guess what??? It ain't charging. ........respectfully, Dell


Dell, that assumes the ammeter is wired properly. If the wire is going through the loop the wrong direction, the gauge will read plus when it should be minus and vice versa. I want to verify that it is doing the right thing before I trust that gauge.

Besides, it's barely off zero...

I've got a couple of analog meters I'll try. One is the $10 cheapie and the other is on my $90 battery load tester. That one's easier to use with the nice big cables and clamps...

-Paul
 
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Bruce (VA)
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:31 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

" If the wire is going through the loop the wrong direction, the gauge will read plus when it should be minus and vice versa. "

Huh?

It's a loop.

It can't go in the wrong direction because the ends of the wire are still attached to the correct terminals. The wire goes from point A thru the loop on the ammeter to point B.

How could that possibly read backwards?
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old
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:13 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Bruce if you think about it for a moment you would see that he probably has the battery wired back wards as in - ground so yep the amp gauge would in fact read back wards. My Oliver 77 is that way and has been since I got ti but I know the alternator works just fine so I have not changed it since I know it is wired back wards so his tractor probably has the same problem
 
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HCooke
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:15 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Pretty sure (I have 3 or 4 of em) that you can go thru the loop the wrong way.
 
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Bruce (VA)
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:35 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Maybe I'm having a CRS moment.

On an 8N, point A is the solenoid. Point B is the terminal block. The wire goes from the solenoid through the loop on the meter to the terminal block. Or, vice-versa.....doesn't matter.

How can it go through the loop backwards?

CRS moment?!
 
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HCooke
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:59 am    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The current flows one way, the needle deflects one way, if the current reverses, the needle deflects the other way. Maybe I'm wrong but I know I've reversed it on a 9N.
 
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Bruce (VA)
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:06 pm    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Well yea, if you reverse the current (as old said) it will read backwards.

But if it's a loop meter & one end of the wire is on the terminal block & the other is on the solenoid, it's not 'reversible'!

On a 9N.....it goes to the hot side of the starter switch, right?
 
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Paul in Edmonton
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:39 pm    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Bruce,

The meter works both ways--it reads positive if electrons are flowing in one direction and negative if they are flowing in the other.

Assume that normally, the electrons flow from the terminal block to the ammeter and then to the solenoid, and that's a positive reading (I may have it backwards, but it doesn't matter for the sake of the argument). If it's wired so the wire goes through the loop left to right, the ammeter shows positive. If I rewire it so it goes through right to left, the ammeter "sees" the electrons moving the other way, and will read negative, even though the wire itself still has the electrons moving the same way.

Do you have a clamp-on DC ammeter? (I do--very useful device!) If so, clamp it on a cable with DC current and take a reading. Then unclamp it, flip it over so it's facing the other way, reclamp it and take another reading--it will be negative if the first was positive. This is the same effect.

To paraphrase a common poster here: It's the Law--Faraday's Law and Lenz's Law, working together in this case...

-Paul
 
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souNdguy
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:19 pm    Post subject: Re: How to tell if it's charging? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

9$ tractor suply analog volt meter.. and a 10$ center 0 ammeter.. and you can tell if it's charging, how much current.. and what voltage.
 
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