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Question for you diesel guys

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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:52 am    Post subject: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I posted on here a month ago that I have an international 364 diesel with a BD 154 engine. My problem at the time was when put under load it would blow excessive black smoke. Taking some advice given to me and the age of the machine I figured the injection Pump needed a rebuild. I just installed the rebuilt pump and the tested injectors which passed. My problem still exists. I need some help from you diesel guys to help me with this issue. The tractor idles fine with little to no smoke. When you pull throttle open it makes a plume of Black coal. Also when I take it for a test ride up the road it has little power and smoke black. I tried other things as well such as removing the intake and exhaust manifolds to see if there was any restrictions and the engine ran the same. Please give me some good news this Thanksgiving I could really use it. Thank you and I hope everyone has a great Thanksgiving Day.
 
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Bob M
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:51 am    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

John - Whenever you see black exhaust it means the pump's injecting more fuel than can be burned.

You've eliminated intake/exhaust restricting air flow to/from the engine. And since you've had the pump rebuilt and the injectors tested, at this point I'd suspect the pump timing. Could be it's timed late. Or perhaps the advance is not not working. The pump shop should have checked that however.

Good luck, and have a happy Thanksgiving!
 
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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

This particular injection pump does not have an advance on it. I was wondering about the timing myself t oday. I'm marked the pump when I removed it and I put the pump back on in the exact same location and it matches the timing marks on the pump an engine exactly. I'm just wondering if anything could have happened in the timing set up i tself such as a keyway partially Sheard or something like that? Is that actually possible?
 
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Bob M
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Pump drive key sheared I suppose is possible (I've had the camshaft key break on a gas tractor).

Is there a timing adjustment on your pump like on the MD/WD6/WD9 pumps? If so you can change the timing using the adjustment. Otherwise you might set the pump timing 1 tooth advanced from the factory timing mark and see if this helps.

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with the BD 154. Does it have a Roosa Master pump, or ????
 
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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Yes you can rotate the pump slightly forward and backward but is very hard with all the solid injection lines it doesn't wanna move easily. There is a pin in the key way for the injection pump and gear it is correct not Sheard.
 
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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Forgot to add it is a CAV rotary injection pump
 
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David G
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I would suspect timing is way slow.
 
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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Is there a way to check the timing without opening the front of the engine
 
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armand tatro
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The FIRST thing to check (IMO.) when having lots of smoke and maby loss of power is the air filter and turbo charger if you have one! Have you check/replace the air filter? Let us know what you find. Armand
 
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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Air and fuel filter new. No turbo.
 
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JOHN in PENNSYLVANIA
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I just read an article that says the bd154 is known for woodruff key problems with the camshaft. Any one seen this?????
 
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TJV
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I had an issue with a tractor last year and the pump shop said to advance the timing a couple degrees on the older tractors to compinsate for the wear over the years (60 years) in different places (gears and connections) it seemed to help a little.
 
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fixerupper
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Something tells me it's still restricted airflow. If the timing was that retarded it wouldn't start or would start real hard and smoke at idle. Is there a restriction ahead of the air cleaner? Did you try it with the hose off of the intake manifold so it's sucking pure air straight into the manifold? You've probably checked these out, but these ideas is what comes to my mind. Jim
 
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the tractor vet
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

No i have not but i have only worked on a couple . And you are sure that the valve lash is correct and that the intake is opening like it should . And with out knowing the spec's on the cam myself i think you would be shooting in the dark. So i am guessing that the only way to know IF it is a timing issue is to pull the ft of the engine off and start from square one and set everything from the get go . NOT fun .
 
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rhtx55
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Question for you diesel guys Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If your fuel system has a return line from the pump back to the tank, I would say it is either very restricted or pratically plugged. The pump is putting out more fuel than the engine can use, it has to go somewhere.
 
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