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Oil Pressure

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John Kamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:47 pm    Post subject: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I just restored a 46 2N motor. Runs great, BUT after it warms up the oild pressure drops to 1 maybe 2 lbs. Starts out at 35 - 40 lbs. What gives? is the spring tension on the pressure thingy bobby up front weak?
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

John Kamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 18:47:42 01/09/13) I just restored a 46 2N motor. Runs great, BUT after it warms up the oild pressure drops to 1 maybe 2 lbs. Starts out at 35 - 40 lbs. What gives? is the spring tension on the pressure thingy bobby up front weak?
Did you do any oil pump work? Did you verify all main, rod, and cam bearing clearances?
 
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John Kamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The original oil pump had a striped gear to the crank. a new one was installed during the over haul. Yes all clearances were checked. I do get good oil pressure for the first 10 minutes.
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

John Kamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 19:10:44 01/09/13) The original oil pump had a striped gear to the crank. a new one was installed during the over haul. Yes all clearances were checked. I do get good oil pressure for the first 10 minutes.
"a new one was installed during the over haul" new pump or new gear?
 
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John Kamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

just a new drive gear the impellers were in good shape
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

John Kamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 19:19:28 01/09/13) just a new drive gear the impellers were in good shape
Clearance from the gear surfaces to surfaces they run against and shaft to bore clearances as well as face to face are all critical. "Look good" isn't good enough. If bearings plasti-gauged good & good cam bearing clearances were verified, I would be suspect of oil pump.
 
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TheOldHokie
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

John Kamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 18:47:42 01/09/13) I just restored a 46 2N motor. Runs great, BUT after it warms up the oild pressure drops to 1 maybe 2 lbs. Starts out at 35 - 40 lbs. What gives? is the spring tension on the pressure thingy bobby up front weak?


If you have 35-40 PSI at startup the "spring thingy bobby" is producing at least 35-40 PSI of cracking pressure. The "spring thingy bobby" doesn't know or care whether the oil is hot or cold just how much pressure it is holding back. Your problem is elsewhere.

Loss of pressure when the oil gets hot says you have overly wide clearances or a leak somwhere in the oil system. First thought would be to verify the cover plate on the pump is sealed good and tight. Any leak there will kill pump pressure.

TOH
 


Last edited by TheOldHokie on Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JohnKamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote


Looks like i need to drop the pan and check the nuts on the oil pump.. I remember tighting these as i wire the nuts. the oil filter line on the bottom goes arround the back of the block and enter the inspection cover for the valve adjusters. inside it sprays out the the valves. I thought this was letting to much oil pass thru. So, I installed a shut off valve in the line and as i close the valve I can get oil pressure up to 10 lbs but then I hear increasing valve noise.
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 19:45:04 01/09/13)
Looks like i need to drop the pan and check the nuts on the oil pump.. I remember tighting these as i wire the nuts. the oil filter line on the bottom goes arround the back of the block and enter the inspection cover for the valve adjusters. inside it sprays out the the valves. I thought this was letting to much oil pass thru. So, I installed a shut off valve in the line and as i close the valve I can get oil pressure up to 10 lbs but then I hear increasing valve noise.
" the oil filter line on the bottom goes arround the back of the block and enter the inspection cover for the valve adjusters. inside it sprays out the the valves."...........sorry, but not on an N tractor!
 


Last edited by JMOR on Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JohnKamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Yep it's what it does. I've not seen this before either. But, who knows what some users do when they try to fix things. The govenor does not have a oil inlet. Do I need to install one and run the oil line there? The casting on the block shows B116 which I think means a Feb 11, 1946 engine. I got this out of Kamloops BC for $500 and it had almost new tires all around. but the engine was siezed up. I restored an 8N 3 yrs back with all your help on the forum.
 
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TheOldHokie
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:20:40 01/09/13) Yep it's what it does. I've not seen this before either. But, who knows what some users do when they try to fix things. The govenor does not have a oil inlet. Do I need to install one and run the oil line there? The casting on the block shows B116 which I think means a Feb 11, 1946 engine. I got this out of Kamloops BC for $500 and it had almost new tires all around. but the engine was siezed up. I restored an 8N 3 yrs back with all your help on the forum.


A farmerization that probably breaks things and possibly why you had a siezed engine. That oil line flow is inline with the mains/rods and is sucking off pressure. Remove that kludge - the valves do not need it and it only confuses the issue.

TOH
 


Last edited by TheOldHokie on Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JohnKamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 17:29:10 01/09/13)
JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:20:40 01/09/13) Yep it's what it does. I've not seen this before either. But, who knows what some users do when they try to fix things. The govenor does not have a oil inlet. Do I need to install one and run the oil line there? The casting on the block shows B116 which I think means a Feb 11, 1946 engine. I got this out of Kamloops BC for $500 and it had almost new tires all around. but the engine was siezed up. I restored an 8N 3 yrs back with all your help on the forum.


A farmerization that probably breaks things and possibly why you had a siezed engine. That oil line flow is inline with the mains/rods and is sucking off pressure. Remove that kludge - the valves do not need it and it only confuses the issue.


I'll drill and tap a 1/8th NPT in the governor and move the line there. The oil does need to return form the oil filter right?

TOH

 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:35:04 01/09/13)
TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 17:29:10 01/09/13)
JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:20:40 01/09/13) Yep it's what it does. I've not seen this before either. But, who knows what some users do when they try to fix things. The govenor does not have a oil inlet. Do I need to install one and run the oil line there? The casting on the block shows B116 which I think means a Feb 11, 1946 engine. I got this out of Kamloops BC for $500 and it had almost new tires all around. but the engine was siezed up. I restored an 8N 3 yrs back with all your help on the forum.


A farmerization that probably breaks things and possibly why you had a siezed engine. That oil line flow is inline with the mains/rods and is sucking off pressure. Remove that kludge - the valves do not need it and it only confuses the issue.


I'll drill and tap a 1/8th NPT in the governor and move the line there. The oil does need to return form the oil filter right?

TOH
If I follow your oil line description correctly.........then what has been done is that the oil filter outlet (bottom center) has been routed into the valve cover instead of into the governor (or as before the governor oiling scheme, into the block(see pic), just below the filter. I would want it corrected, too, but I'm afraid this (where oil filter return dumps) will NOT impact your low oil pressure.

 
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TheOldHokie
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:35:04 01/09/13)
TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 17:29:10 01/09/13)
JohnKamerer wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:20:40 01/09/13) Yep it's what it does. I've not seen this before either. But, who knows what some users do when they try to fix things. The govenor does not have a oil inlet. Do I need to install one and run the oil line there? The casting on the block shows B116 which I think means a Feb 11, 1946 engine. I got this out of Kamloops BC for $500 and it had almost new tires all around. but the engine was siezed up. I restored an 8N 3 yrs back with all your help on the forum.


A farmerization that probably breaks things and possibly why you had a siezed engine. That oil line flow is inline with the mains/rods and is sucking off pressure. Remove that kludge - the valves do not need it and it only confuses the issue.


TOH

I'll drill and tap a 1/8th NPT in the governor and move the line there. The oil does need to return form the oil filter right?


Sorry - I didn't read carefully and jumped in with foot in mouth. I thought the line was off the tee at the back - not the oil filter outlet. That rerouting won't hurt anything.
 
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JohnKamerer
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Oil Pressure Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Thanks for the pic. I'll run it to the block as shown. But I agree it won't help the oil pressure. or is there a good reason they went to the govenor?
 
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