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Hydraulic Flow Rates

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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 5:48 am    Post subject: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I searched the archives and wasn't completely successful, so I'll throw my question out there. I'm working on a 4' splitter for the 3 point hitch. What are the hydraulic flow rates for my 4600 and 5600? Are they the same, or is the 5600 higher flow on a bigger tractor? If they are 8 GPM it will work ok, but if they are less it will be painfully slow. I'm trying to decide how slow this will be based on the cylinder I have. Long term I will get a PTO pump, but to get started I plan to use tractor hydraulics to run this. Thanks.
 
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RodinNS
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:22 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

They're about 8 and 12 gpm respectively. Either one will be SLOW for a splitter.

Rod
 
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souNdguy
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:54 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

if it's a stopgap UNTIL you get a pto pump.. go for it. as said.. it will cycle slower than a higher double digit or 2 stage setup.. but it WILL work.

i know a guy that runs a splitter off an N with a large piston cyl for extra force.. but it takes forever to stroke.. but it DOES split wood. Smile and yes.. he is retired.. Smile
 
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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:07 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

So the 5600 has higher capacity pump? That is good news and will make me want to have the splitter on that tractor. My 24" splitter has a 11 GPM pump with similar diameter cylinder, so I have an idea the ballpark fo speed, even though I will have twice the travel distance with this splitter. Thanks for the info.
 
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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:10 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Yep, the plan is "until" I get a PTO pump, which means until I can save up the dough for a pump. We all know how that goes Smile This could be on the ten year plan. I'm not retired, but don't work as quickly as I used to.
 
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chevytaHOE5674
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:12 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I would go find a briggs motor off an old lawn mower or something and then buy a 2 stage splitter pump. Way more fuel efficient than running a large tractor....
 
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souNdguy
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:19 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I don't know it it is way mor eefficient or not... fuel usage = load.

diesel is more spendy than gas.. but that diesel is a lil better engine than an aluminum whizzbang lawnmower job.

I sure wouldn't buy another engine... just get the pump.. the $ you save on the engine will offset the fuel costs.

If I was doing this as a business, i'd get a standalone pump with engine..
 
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Shetland Sheepdog
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Brian,
I have an American (brand) 4' horizontal splitter that has the 23 GPM Prince PTO pump. I use it with any of my 10 series Fords, and run them at 1000 RPM, so just over 1/2 of PTO speed! Works super for me!
I suspect that you would need to run the tractors at full throttle to get rated flow on the tractor hydraulics!
JMHO, HTH, Dave

Edit: one thing to consider is that my cylinder is 4", so it will operate at about 60% of the speed of yours. The 3"x48" cylinder has 338 CID while the 4"x48" cylinder has 603 CID (makes the 4" stronger but slower!

Here's the splitter on the departed 3410 'Bota

 


Last edited by Shetland Sheepdog on Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:32 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I agree, if this was a business or even if I had a lot to split I would use the gas engine. But, I'm married, so "investment capital" is much harder to get then "operational cost." That means I can't buy either the PTO or gas engine pump, but spending $20 at a time on fuel several times is an easier expense to get approved.
 
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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:34 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Thanks Dave. I appreciate the pictures. I'm planning on vertical beam to keep it closer to the tractor and hoping that standing the blocks up then working standing up will be easier on my back.
 
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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Just to give more background on what I'm doing. I have a 24" long splitter already, 5 hp briggs, 11 GPM Northern pump that I built 15 years ago and I added a log loader to it last winter to pick up the big stuff that I can't lift anymore. Anything that is gnarly, knotty or short will see that splitter. I am building this so any of the straight or clean logs I have I can cut to 48", split them to dry, then use the cordwood saw to make them stove size (16") in the fall. I generally saw around 6-8 cords per year total, some of that is smaller and doesn't need to be split at all, some of it is gnarly butts and I'll use the smaller splitter, so this one will see 2-4 cords per year, so speed and fuel consumption won't be a huge factor, unless it is so painfully slow that I can't make myself do it. Based on the flow rates posted, It will not be fast, but I think it will be doable.
 
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souNdguy
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:22 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I hear ya...
 
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RodinNS
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 11:47 am    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Only a woman could rationalize that line of thinking... but I hear your problem.
The 5600 will make about 12 at 2100 rpm. It'll mabey make 7-8 at a brisk idle.
I'd try to get a big Prince pump as quick as I could. Not the little one, the big, 22 gpm one.

Just leave the Briggs engine to rot somewhere else.

Rod
 
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Brian in MA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 12:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

It's not necessarily about rationalizing, more about not wanting to go to the well again at this point. Once I have a usable tool it's easier to get upgrades. Now I just have a pile of parts. And I ordered the splitting wedge this morning and once she sees the credit card charge I'll have to explain that one too. I just remembered I have an old Howard Power Arm backhoe with a PTO pump, I'll have to dig that out of the snow to see what flow that pump is, maybe I already own the solution. Thanks for the info.
 
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WayneB
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Hydraulic Flow Rates Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I have a setup similar to Dave's. 35T and prince PTO pump. We used it splitting about 9 cord of oak, each at least 36" in lenght. Most cuts were too big for my 20" saw blade to cut all the way around, leaving a couple inches in center to break by dropping with front loader. Also had a gas powered two stage splitter. It was put aside, too weak and too slow.
Split a couple a cords last month, and it took longer to put the splitter on the tractor and drive to the site and back and then take it off and store it, than splitting the wood.
Bottom line: Gas splitters are OK for 16"-24" wood and three point splitters earn there money for outdoor furnance length splitting. IMHO
Wayne
 
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