Question about guards and sickle on an 820 series I.H. head

[Haley]

Is anyone here still running or familiar with the guards and sickle on the 820 series I.H. head? I am finally in the process of converting one of my older rigid Ford heads to run the 820 sickle and guards but everywhere I look for parts does not show this head using wear plates against the sickle,Is this right? I am using the 270 guard and it looks like the sickle actually runs against the guard and the guard itself is the wear plate.I am trying to get away from the old style Claas bar and pittman arm wobble setup and go to the I.H.-Hart carter style wobble box with a sickle and guards that can be bought easily aftermarket.The 270 guards are pretty much a bolt on for my head and the sickle uses a knife section that is pretty much spot on with the Claas.I have everything worked out except for the wear plates so someone that knows the 820 head please shoot me straight.
 

[IaGary]

That is correct no wear plates.

They are built right into the guards as you said.

The 810, and 1020 heads are the same way.

In all my years of combining with IH combines I have never used a wear plate with the IH guards.

Gary
 

[Haley]

Thanks for the reply Gary,thats what I thought.I noticed in my Shoup catalog that they list double prong guards without the crossbar for a 1020 and it got me to thinking that maybe the ones without the crossbar might work better since it looks like the crossbar limits the amount of sickle section that actually does the cutting.Have you ever had any problems with the 820 crossbar guards clogging up in thick wheat and tearing it instead of cutting it? I can really set mine up to run either guard and am just trying to figure which one is better.Thanks for any input.
 

[IaGary]

The guards you are talking about are rock guards.

The bars helpkeep rocksout oftheguards.

If you never cut beans, where you need to run on the ground, or don"t have rocks you may want the guards without the bars.

The bars have never caused problems cutting for us. Not even in 100 bu oats with extra green grass under growth.

So suit yourself.
 

[ihman73]

Haley if you haven't bought all the parts yet you might look into a SCH Prodrive wobble box. They are a pretty reliable looking outfit, if we hadn't upgraded to a 1020 head there would have been one on our 820. We also never had/have any issues with the crossbar guards. We are actually running crary goldencut guards on the 1020 and like them for beans in wheat they don't really make a difference. The crary spring-loaded hold downs with the replaceable wear strips are great also.
 

[Haley]

Thanks Gary,I think I will just go with all 820 guards and sickle to simplify ordring parts.I never thought about the crossbar heeping rocks out but That makes sense.
 

[Haley]

I have looked at the SCH pro drive but wooooh they are pricey!I have heard a lot of people on here say they have a lot of problems out of the Hart Carter style open box the 820 uses but I have ran one for 8 years now and had no problems at all.I have several of them laying around and will probably use one of them for now.I have also looked at the SCH cutting system and havent ruled it out.The adjustable hold downs look great and the whole replacement cutting kit only adds about $300 more than the standard kit.
 

[James22]

Been doing something useful so haven't been on the forum for a few days so probably too late. I converted my 820 head to the SCH system and would do it again. Works great. Bought a new IH wobble box a few years ago and it is is excellent condition, so didn't spend extra to purchase a SCH pro drive. Did spend the $ to upgrade to a electrical head control rather than sticking with the original cable system.
 

[Haley]

Did you go with the roller guides or just wear bars? Were the guards really as easy as they say to put on?(no shimming,just bolt on) I havent bought any parts yet but probably will sometime this next week.
 

[oj]

Haley, we put a SCH knife/guard kit on our mower conditioner, they are great, and will cut anything, i will do all my machines when they require new guards/knives, did the haybine because the knifeback was wore right out, best thing i ever did, they are more expensive to buy, but in two seasons i've only broken a couple of guards...they're on a Heston 8100 hay head on a swather.

The SCH knives drive very easily too, those rollers make a massive differance... might be worth trying a knife kit before changing wobble boxes.
 

[oj]

Go with the rollers Haley, you won't regret it!
 

[James22]

I went with the rollers. In the kit they gave me, the 1st guard (nearest the drive head) didn't have the proper clearance for the last foot or so of the knife assembly. Had to slant one side of the square knife 'backbone" (making it a trapezoid shape) on the driven side which is a separate component that bolts to the main assembly. Easily done with a small grinder. Also used a thin washer on the bottom between the platform and this first guard to increase clearance. Had the correct parts; they just didn't quite work. Not a major issue and you will find it during the final phase when installing the assembled knife. Otherwise it was just a complete bolt-on and no shimming.
 

[Huskers86]