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More on well pump wire


 
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john in la
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:11 am    Post subject: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Decided to run the new well pump wire to my daughters house (140ft vrs 250ft) to save on wire cost. Heck I am buying all the parts at least she can do is pay the electric bill to run the pump.
Ran the new wire across the ground and the pump has been working as it should for past 18 hrs so I can say we found the problem. Sure was nice to be able to take a shower last night after 48hrs with no water.

Also decided to add 110 to the pump house while we are doing it to run a heat lamp rather than running extention cords out there when it gets cold.

So I bought some grey plastic pipe and 4 pieces of duel rated THHN/THWN wire 150ft long in differant colors black; white; green; and blue. They did not have red.

So now my question is how do I wire this at the pump house. I do not know about direct/hard wireing the 220 pump and 110 light with only a 2 pole breaker at the main panel.
If 1 leg of the 220 has a problem it should throw the 2 leg breaker so there should not be a problem hard wiring it but I need to ask just so I can get this right.
Your advise welcome about if I need to install a box at the pump house with a 220 and a 110 breaker.
 
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Greg K
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:28 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

You need more wires. Green/ground. White/neutral. Black/1 leg of well. Blue/start winding for well. Red/run winding of well. Other color/ hot for 110v in pump house. This is based on the capacitor box being in the house. If the box is in the well house then you only need one more color for a hot for the 110v.
 
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Kirk Grau
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:30 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Run back to the supply house/Lowes/Home Depot and pick up a 4 or 8 circuit load center, seems like it should set you back about $30 plus the breakers. Think of it like a little sub-panel and wire your circuits from there.

Others will chime in with other options, but this would be my approach. Gives a little future flexibility if you decide to wire a receptacle out there some day. I am assuming your pump controls are at the well if you are able to change power source as you are. If pressure switch is remote, might have to rethink.

Good Luck,

Kirk
 
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Greg K
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:52 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

OK I checked your last post and it is a jet pump, not a submersible so disregard the part about start/run windings. You need one more color/wire for a hot for the 110v but sounds like you are all set for everything else.
 
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TractormanNC
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:13 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The blue wire will be fine in place of the red. Most anything except white or green for hot wires. If you are really concerned about color, wrap the exposed end with red tape.
 
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MarkB_MI
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:14 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

There are two ways to do it. One requires five conductors, the other requires only four conductors, but also a load center.

So in the first example, you hook up the well as before, then run a third "hot" and a neutral for the convenience outlet. The extra hot needs its own breaker back in the house.

In the second method, you'll run your pump wires to the load center rather than to the pump. You'll also need to run a neutral from the house to the load center. Then run the pump and outlet off different breakers in the load center.

In either case, the ground wire should be grounded locally in the pump house; I think tying it to the well pipe should do it, but you might want a separate ground rod as well. The ground and neutral are kept separate in the pump house.
 
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john in la
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:18 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Yes the pressure switch is in the pump house.
In the past I only had 220 out there (2 hots and a ground) and it was hard wired to the pressure switch. The breaker in the main panel protected the pump and all the wiring running out to the pump.
I guess I could have (should have) installed a A/C type disconnect box out there but never did.

Now that I am old enough to be installing stuff the kids will have to deal with I take a differant out look on how I do it.
A little sub panel with a 220 breaker for the pump; and a 110 breaker for the light; future receptacle sounds like the way to go.
 
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john in la
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:46 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Thanks Mark
I will go with method two and put a sub panel at the pump house.
I understand keeping neutral and ground seperate at the pump house what I did not consider was grounding the green ground wire at the pump house.
Since I have a plastic well casing I will opt for the $12 ground rod and clamp.

I solved the problem with the Ditch Witch even though the clay is so packed it seems like we are digging into concrete. Problem is now my 26 yr old son and 25 yr old SIL may not speak to me for a week. You boys want water..... get to work.
 
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MarkB_MI
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:11 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Ha! I think I can guess who got the honor of operating the Ditch Witch.
 
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buickanddeere
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 11:06 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Good man for running a neutral.
Too many people here still think a connection to ground is the same thing.
The neutral wire out in the pump house is not supposed to have any connection with the ground. Ensure that there is not a bond screw in the neutral terminal block.
A ground lug on the well casing and #6 bare copper up to the ground lug and green wire in the breaker box is good.
Some jurisdictions also want a 10ft ground rod driven in and connected to the breaker panel as well. Not a bad idea if there is work being in or around the well casing.
 
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Kerry50
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:17 pm    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Instead of a light, why not use a heater with a thermostat? I use a milk house heater, have it set to the lowest setting. My well house is insulated good and I don't have to worry about changing a light bulb when my water freezes.
 
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cannonball
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:39 am    Post subject: Re: More on well pump wire Reply to specific post Reply with quote

just put a light on each leg and then the amps would be same
 
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