2606 tightened up or seized?

[bc]

I don't know what to say now guys. Thought I might have all my issues fixed. Got the gasket for the 2606 C-221 engine filter housing, put a plug in the oil galley under it, and put it back together. Cranked on it a little without the coil wire to see if it would pressure up and it didn't. Put the wire back on, choked it, and it fired right off. Just as it was starting to rev up, the oil pressure came up to 40 psi, I pushed the choke back in immediately, and it died. Don't know if it died because of the choke or because it tightened up. Then it wouldn't hardly crank over and my old battery was running down.

Today I go out and it won't hardly crank over. Pulled the plugs and squirted oil in there. Looked in the cylinders with the scope but couldn't see much. Tried to pry on it underneath and couldn't get any leverage but it wasn't free. It would move just a little with each try of the starter but it was getting hot. Pulled the starter and it ran ok being out. Tried to pry on the ring gear but couldn't get much leverage.

It ran started and ran ok the other day. I guess I did something to make it tighten up and stop.

Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[used red MN]

How much did you run it prior to this with 8 lbs of oil pressure or whatever it had? Did you run it at a fairly high rpm for any length of time in that condition? I could not confirm that plugging that pressure port behind the oil filter mount was correct, so I did not reply on the plug size. I probably should have chimed in saying that you should have someone “in the know for certain” confirm that is the correct thing to do.
Adding link to other post with more info, covering several issues he had.

2606 issues after rebuild

Hello guys. Got multiple issues after my 2606 rebuild project. It will start and run just fine now. I run it a little bit between 1500 and 2100 rpm but can't drive it yet. I had the engine rebuilt 3 years ago, mounted the engine using a tree limb to hold a hoist, and then pulled it into the...

forums.yesterdaystractors.com

 

[bc]

There was probably 2 or 3 times I ran it about 10 minutes or so to where it was brought up to temperature. Another few times for just long enough to check something out. Never below 1500 and some around 1800 and some at 2000. Once I got the timing figured out, it always started right off. It actually felt like it was turning over easier the more it ran. If it was going to seize up the it should have done it before now. It only ran just a couple seconds at the most. Those galley plugs don't seem to show up in the drawings.

Guess I will put the starter back on tomorrow and see if it moves. If not then I will put some atf in the cylinders. If this is a deal where the engine needs to be tore down then it will have to wait till fall or winter after I get some other projects done. If I screwed something up then all I can do is deal with it and move on.

Thanks

 

[caterpillar guy]

I would forget about the cylinders being the problem pull the pan and look at the bearings and yes bearings will set an engine up if they gall the crank or the bearings happen to pile up in the rod. Mains normally don't bother much since they are not moving like a rod is. IF the bearings are wiped out it might also be crank grinding or replacement time. If the crank is found to be the problem find the oil flow problem before you put in another crank.

 

[MARK ROBKE]

Exactly what Cat guy said- see if those rod bearings are dry and trying to seize. Fix oil flow problem before new repairs. Mark.

 

[bc]

Thanks. That gives me a plan here. Probably be this week between other projects I can block the rear bolster bolts and pull the pan. That was a reground crank in there and they had me replace one rod and all the rods were checked. Everything new but the oil pump and I may as well order one of those. I wouldn't think a piston would seize in only a couple seconds. With the pan off maybe I can trace the oil flow a little better.

 

[Janicholson]

Thanks. That gives me a plan here. Probably be this week between other projects I can block the rear bolster bolts and pull the pan. That was a reground crank in there and they had me replace one rod and all the rods were checked. Everything new but the oil pump and I may as well order one of those. I wouldn't think a piston would seize in only a couple seconds. With the pan off maybe I can trace the oil flow a little better.

With incorrect piston to cylinder clearance they can seize in f or 5 firing strokes. Clearance appropriate to the pistons is mandatory. Basic clearance could be checked from the open crancase (not ideal, bur usable info with long feeler gauges. Jim

 

[kshansen]

I have not followed all the threads on this project but sounds like this was an engine overhaul with a replaced crank.

Just wondering if it might be similar to a problem I had many years ago when I rebuilt my BN. Had crank ground and installed new bearings. I did notice just a slight bit of drag when turning the crank before installing the pistons. Lucky I did not finish assembling the engine but took the block to a machine shop were they found that a couple of the main bearing bores were slightly out of line. No idea of how many times that engine may have been abused in 40 or more years. They took a light cut off the caps and then linebored the block to true things up. Well it's something like 35 or more years later and still going strong.

Actually giving a little thought to dropping the pan and inspecting the mains and rods some day. Oil pressure gauge does not have numbers on it but have noticed it might be running a little lower when mowing with the Woods 72 inch deck. Probably should hook up a real gauge to see the actual presser!

 

[bc]

Update. Got the pan pulled tonight. Drained the oil and ran a 3" magnet (from the base of a HF magnetic parts tray) through it and no metal in it. Figured out I had to jack it up at the bolster, block the front wheels in front and back, and then unbolt the front axle at the bolster and the mount at the bell housing. Then had to roll the rear part around so the pan would come out.

Guess I don't know how the oil pump and screen comes loose. IH manual and the parts diagrams don't show how it is bolted in where it connects to the cam gear/distributor. I would think there is a retainer bolt under there somewhere.

Once that is out, then I suppose I should unbolt each rod one at a time looking for a problem. If nothing there then start unbolting the mains one at a time. Also look to see if the front and back oil galley plugs are missing.

Any help here is appreciated. Thanks.

 

[used red MN]

The bolts that hold the pump in are up high where it mounts to the block, see link. The gear just slips out of mesh with the cam gear as you pull it down. You will probably want to pull the distributor noting where the rotor is pointing, and even the angle of the drive tang for it in the end of the pump shaft. Something is going on with this forum and the iPhone Safari browser, the link attach feature is not working right. I will paste it in at the end.
If the engine locked up due to a bearing particularly a rod bearing it will be discolored usually darker because it got hot. Grab the rods by the cap or nuts/bolts and try to move it front to back. The rods have a little side clearance in the crank throw journals. It should basically slide or move back a forth just that wee bit, like .004”-.010”. If one of them don’t move then it is probably the one if any of them are actually bad.

Oil Pump fits International D188 D236 C263 C221 D301 C301 D282 504 560 420 460 303 2706 2606 2504 660 706 414 606 230421R91

Oil Pump for International Combine(s) 303, Engine(s) C221, C263, C301, D188, D236, D282, D301, Harvester(s) 414, 420, Tractor(s) 460, 504, 560, 606, 660, 706, 2504. Replaces International OEM nos 230421R91, 211388R91, 332435R91, 69605R91, 69604R91.

www.tractorpartsasap.com

 

[bc]

Thanks. Guess I will find out something this afternoon. Probably get to lay under there and get an oil shower at the same time.

 

[bc]

I managed to pull the rod caps on 3, 4, & 6. No side to side movement when tight.
Looks like the rod journals on 4 & 6 had a little something sticking out that I can feel with my finger. Grooves in the bearings. Specks of metal on the vise came out when I wiped the oil out of the #6 bearing. Pics should be in order 3, 4, 6 for the bearings and #4 twice and #6 for the journals.

My guess is that they left out that galley plug that bypassed the filter. And I was so happy to hear it run that I didn't check the oil pressure gauge until later.

Just wondering on opinions on polishing or regrinding the crank? Probably have to pull the head and check the cylinders. I'm not set up in the barn to hang the engine after splitting it from the bell housing and front bolster but I'm not sure there is an alternative.

 

[used red MN]

Well the crank looked salvageable up until I saw the number 6 journal on the crank. Looks like it is going to need turned to the next under-size, at least on the rods. Quite unfortunate.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

Polish that throw with some 600 grit and see what it looks like.

 

[bc]

Bummer Bummer. Thanks guys. I'll put the pan back on for now so I can do a few other projects that need to be done. I have a bunch of 4x4 posts, railroad ties, wood fence posts, and other metal that I can probably rig up some kind of A frame to pickup that bolster and engine to set it where I can work on it. Then I can look at the rest of the journals and check the oil passages.

 

[Janicholson]

Bummer Bummer. Thanks guys. I'll put the pan back on for now so I can do a few other projects that need to be done. I have a bunch of 4x4 posts, railroad ties, wood fence posts, and other metal that I can probably rig up some kind of A frame to pickup that bolster and engine to set it where I can work on it. Then I can look at the rest of the journals and check the oil passages.

an example

A cherry picker garage lift can do that with better success and safety. Jim