350 Utility TA clutch malfunction?

[chevypanel46]

I’m sure looking forward to hearing from the very knowledgeable 350 Utility owners here. I've been using my ‘57 350 Utility with front loader and blade for driveway maintenance for 8 years now. Now...almost everything works well—it shifts smoothly into all 5 gears and main clutch appears to be working perfectly. I’ve never had to use the TA for any reason, but it appears to be operating exactly as it should (going into “lower gear mode”), but when depressing the clutch pedal while going up a grade the tractor will not roll backwards and seems to be locked in gear until engaging the clutch to give it a little forward slack to pull it out of gear. It does exactly the reverse of this in reverse gear on a downhill grade. Like “used red MN” describes in one of his posts​

“Say you have piled some dirt with the loader and you
run the front wheels up the pile. When you push the
clutch in the tractor will be locked from rolling
backwards due to the one way clutch.”

So it appears the TA "one way clutch" is frozen up but I’m hoping it can be unfrozen without splitting her open. I’ve watched Doug Gingell’s YouTube video, “How to Adjust the Farmall Torque Amplifier”, and I’ve tried—and tried—to adjust the TA/clutch linkage but with no improvement.

-Strange as it seems, with the clutch pedal full down and the TA lever all the way to the rear (engaged) the tractor WILL roll backwards, but only as long as the TA lever is held there.

-After removing the 4 hole inspection plate I was pleasantly surprised to find the clutch assembly looking completely intact with what appears to be a good looking clutch assembly, good throwout bearing operation, and a healthy looking clutch disc.

-With the clutch pedal down I can easily rotate the TA clutch counter-clockwise (looking from rear to front) but not in the opposite direction.

-With the shifter in neutral and the TA lever pulled back I can rotate the clutch disc with my finger tips.

Don’t know what more to add, but I sure look forward to ya’ll’s good advice.

 

[used red MN]

Hello CP46, welcome to YT! What is happening is your clutch and TA linkage is out of adjustment. The problem is that the adjustment procedures from the factory manual don’t necessarily allow for wear that comes into play from years of use. It has been a while since I have been around these tractors and performed a hands on adjustment. Basically if the video tells you set the tractor pedal free play to X dimension do that. I think they usually show this to be done with the short angle link to the TA disconnected. Then the angled link between the clutch actuating lever and the TA release shaft lever is what pulls the TA clutch lever to release the TA direct clutch when you fully depress the foot clutch. If when adjusted per the book the TA does not release with the clutch fully depressed you simply have to shorten the angled link until the TA clutch is releasing properly.

with the clutch pedal full down and the TA lever all the way to the rear (engaged) the tractor WILL roll backwards, but only as long as the TA lever is held there.

Just to clarify when you say “is held there” is that just in terms of being held by its “latching mechanism” or are you needing to hold the TA back with your hand beyond the position it would be held by the latch. If this is the case then a definite more detailed step by step process will be needed to get it all adjusted and working correctly. Maybe someone else will chime in with the complete process if needed. FYI, that assembly locking in one direction and turning free in the other is a GOOD thing. That is needed to make your TA low or reduction gear work. That is the function of the one-way clutch or sprague assembly that often fails making lo TA inoperable.

 

[chevypanel46]

REALLY appreciate your reply, used red MN!

You confirmed what I'd been optimistically thinking: All these components are basically healthy and functional--It's simply a lack of proper adjustment.

To clarify:

"with the clutch pedal full down and the TA lever all the way to the rear (engaged) the tractor WILL roll backwards, but only as long as the TA lever is held there" By "held there" I mean pulling the lever ALL the way back, which is well past the "latching mechanism".From what you say "a definite more detailed step by step process will be needed to get it all adjusted and working correctly." I also have to pull it ALL the way back before the TA clutch disc will disengage. "With the shifter in neutral and the TA lever pulled back ALL the way I can rotate the clutch disc with my finger tips."
It also has to be pulled ALL the way back for the Torque Amplifier to engage while driving.

I'm looking forward everyone wanting to "chime in"!

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

The "binding" is expected behavior due to the design of the TA unit.

First thing to address is getting the TA lever adjusted properly. It will probably not require more than 1/2 - 2 turns of the clevis indicated by the yellow arrow in the picture below. Thread that clevis farther on to the rod 1/2 of a turn at a time, put the pin back in, and try it. This trial-and-error method is how you compensate for the wear.

Also observe the TA rockshaft, the thing the TA lever moves when you pull it, for weird and excessive movement. It should rotate around the grease fitting, not move back and forth or make any other strange movement.

With the TA lever adjusted properly, at least you can pull the TA lever to shift. Once you get that situated the next step is adjusting the short link on top until the TA shifts when you fully depress the clutch pedal. Again, thread the clevis farther on to the rod by 1/2 of a turn at a time until it works.

 

[bob p mn]

Had a 504 once that I was trying to adjust for a buddy of mine, he had just bought the tractor had pretty much the same problem. No matter how I adjusted it it would not work right, turns out the long adjusting rod from the TA handle was bent, had a big bow in it. Straightend that rod out and it adjusted right up, not saying that's your problem but sometimes you run into troubles that aren't run of the mill.

 

[Janicholson]

TA adjust

The process (as I do it): Set the clutch free play at 1 inch down from all the way up measured at the stop against the platform or foot plate, to cast contact in the pedal arm. this can be felt by hand. In an open area with nothing to run into, use low gear, and a tape measure, measure the point that letting up on the pedal causes the tractor to begin to move. this is the engagement point of the master clutch. The TA linkage is now adjusted so it begins to be released at this position of the foot pedal. further depressing the pedal releases the TA clutch fully. (usually another 3/4" or so to an inch of foot travel. This assures that the TA clutch is fully engaged when the master clutch applies power through it. It also assures that the full pedal depression releases the TA clutch so shifting is not bound up. The lever should apply and fully release the TA clutch very near the center of its travel. Doing this compensates for linkage wear and I have had no issues doing it this way. Jim

 

[chevypanel46]

Thank you Barnyard Engineering, Bob and Jim SO much for your good feedback. It’s back to the shop today to see if we can figure it out. Having the TA completely functional would be great, but more important is to just get the primary clutch working right.

This is my first time posting on YT and I inadvertently posted this under both Tractor & Farm Talk and Farmall, International & McCormick threads. Not sure how to correct that, but will be monitoring both threads.

 

[Janicholson]

Thank you Barnyard Engineering, Bob and Jim SO much for your good feedback. It’s back to the shop today to see if we can figure it out. Having the TA completely functional would be great, but more important is to just get the primary clutch working right.

This is my first time posting on YT and I inadvertently posted this under both Tractor & Farm Talk and Farmall, International & McCormick threads. Not sure how to correct that, but will be monitoring both threads.

Welcome to YT forums and ASAP parts. I do own a 350U and it was the first tractor I drove W/O dad holding me up!. 1957 at 8 years old. Jim

 

[Janicholson]

link
The master clutch is working OK. the TA has 2 devices that are called clutches. The one you see from the cover plate is the TA direct drive clutch. it is smaller and is responsible for making the TA reduction unit turn at full engine speed, thus direct drive. When it is released (Clutch pedal down, or TA lever back) the drive goes into the TA gearing (planetary type) and the TA gears produce reduction of about 30+%. The TA gear housing is stationary because the second TA "clutch" is in action. It is a Sprag clutch that allows forward rotation, but denies reverse rotation. It is what is causing the transmission to appear to be locked up. It is not faulty, it is doing what it is supposed to do. The issue is that the front direct clutch is not releasing far enough when the pedal is fully down to allow the whole TA unit rotational freedom. This is noticed when pulling sonething in direct and stopping while still pulling, or going up a hill that then tries to cause the tractor to roll backwards. The Sprag clutch causes that to not happen and the shifter gets stuck because there is pressure on the gear teeth. There is at least one video, see link. Jim

 

[Roger Tomfohrde]

All good information but I will give you an exception to these. The T/A clutch disk has to free on both sides. Mine was stuck to the steel and left a lump on one side so it could not slip when the clutch is released. It was stuck and had to be disassembled to chisel the surfaces clean.

 

[used red MN]

With the shifter in neutral and the TA lever pulled back I can rotate the clutch disc with my finger tips.

Roger, I realize his post was somewhat confusing with quite a few different details, but by saying the above “spinning the clutch disc with his finger” tells us it is free on both sides.

 

[used red MN]

link
The master clutch is working OK. the TA has 2 devices that are called clutches. The one you see from the cover plate is the TA direct drive clutch. it is smaller and is responsible for making the TA reduction unit turn at full engine speed, thus direct drive. When it is released (Clutch pedal down, or TA lever back) the drive goes into the TA gearing (planetary type) and the TA gears produce reduction of about 30+%. The TA gear housing is stationary because the second TA "clutch" is in action. It is a Sprag clutch that allows forward rotation, but denies reverse rotation. It is what is causing the transmission to appear to be locked up. It is not faulty, it is doing what it is supposed to do. The issue is that the front direct clutch is not releasing far enough when the pedal is fully down to allow the whole TA unit rotational freedom. This is noticed when pulling sonething in direct and stopping while still pulling, or going up a hill that then tries to cause the tractor to roll backwards. The Sprag clutch causes that to not happen and the shifter gets stuck because there is pressure on the gear teeth. There is at least one video, see link. Jim

CP, not sure if this will help you at all but the reason the drive train locks up when turned backwards is because the power is trying to pass through “two” gear ratios at the same time. The reduction ratio is always in mesh, when the TA direct clutch engages the parts involved with the reduction ratio speed up. When the transmission is driven in the normal direction the one way clutch or sprague allows this. If it tries to turn backwards when the direct clutch is engaged it is trying to drive the power train in two ratios and locks. Clear as mud? I am not sure if Jim ever realized this but the unfortunate thing about that video is the person turning the crank is rotating it the wrong direction. IH Fan and engine rotate clockwise when viewed from the front as do probably 95% or better of all engines.

 

[chevypanel46]

OK, here's the latest. I went through the adjustment procedure as described by Jim N., which perfectly coincided with the shop manual I just got hold of.

It does work, but not very well. The TA clutch begins to disengage at about the same spot of downward pedal travel as the master clutch begins to disengage--which is what it's supposed to do, right? And with the clutch pedal all the way down the tractor WILL roll backwards.

The PROBLEM now: It takes a tremendous amount of pressure to get clutch pedal all the way down--beginning at the point it contacts the TA clutch. Clutch pedal will go all the way down but it requires much more pressure than would be acceptable for normal operation. The strong resistance is obviously coming from the TA clutch.

Looking through the 4 bolt inspection hole the TA clutch assembly appears to be working right, but I suspect there's something wrong with the "internal linkage" or the pressure plate that makes it have so much resistance and makes it require so much control lever travel. The rotating ends (with grease zerks) of the "Torque Amplifier clutch release shaft" are worn pretty sloppy.

In my picture above there appears what looks like an "adjusting screw with a lock nut"??? at the center of the clutch release shaft--to the left of the clutch assembly. Is that a variable to consider?

Measuring at the top of the TA control lever, from the "notched back" position, I have to pull the lever back 4 1/2 inches before the TA throwout bearing begins contacting the clutch, then pull it back to the max 7-8 inches with a lot of pressure to fully engage the TA. I doubt if that's the way it's supposed to operate, but the TA itself seems to operate perfectly.

Right now I'd be happy just to get the master clutch working/disengaging properly with or without the TA working.

I want to thank all you guys once again for the good information and wise counsel!

 

[chevypanel46]

Another thing to mention: The diameter of all these pivot pins appears to be 1/2 inch. I found the "top pin" in the TA clutch release lever to be 3/8" diameter (the holes are 1/2). I tried using both 1/2" and 3/8" pins (and adjusting for each) but with no appreciable difference.

 

[Janicholson]

Another thing to mention: The diameter of all these pivot pins appears to be 1/2 inch. I found the "top pin" in the TA clutch release lever to be 3/8" diameter (the holes are 1/2). I tried using both 1/2" and 3/8" pins (and adjusting for each) but with no appreciable difference.

That may have made it some what better, but not effectively a cure. Adjust as described and be happy. Jim

 

[chevypanel46]

Thank you, Jim. I went back through and thoroughly cleaned and greased all the friction/pivot points and that seemed to help a little. It appears she’s about as good as she’s gonna get, and will still get the job done.

I had used this tractor for driveway maintenance for the last eight years never bothering with the TA, and the shifting and master clutch had always operated smoothly until just recently. It still does, only with a real heavy foot on the clutch pedal.

Given the increasing nonavailability of parts, it may be time to start thinking about passing her on to someone looking for a really good restoration project tractor. Engine is strong and doesn’t burn a drop of oil. Front and rear hydraulics are good and PTO works too.

Thanks again to everyone. You have a great bunch of people here!

 

[used red MN]

I would personally adjust it by trial and error and get it to work satisfactorily for me. Unfortunately that process cannot be transferred into a written procedure with specified measurements. Myself knowing how to continually observe changes/ reduction in the free play as the tractor is operated I would adjust the free play to 5/8” or maybe even a 1/2”. I would then adjust the angled TA release linkage rod to where when intentionally pressing the clutch all the way down it will release. I believe with that change in the free play the master clutch should release sooner. So only when you find the gears are locking for shifting that you then intentionally apply the extra pressure to the pedal to release the TA clutch as well. We had a 300 and 350 Farmall on the farm I grew up on. The TA release was not always adjusted properly. So as part of the hands on operation training you were simply directed to pull the TA back if difficulty was encountered when shifting. Soon it just becomes second nature. Having the free play set to such a minimum amount requires vigilance in keeping your foot off the clutch when you have it engaged and keep surveillance on any reduction in free play during operation. Have you lubed the zerks on the cross shafts? They only need about 1/2 a stroke of the grease gun lever. Also lubing all the pivot points of the linkage may also help. You could also lube the finger pivot on the TA pressure plate used motor oil in a pump oil can is probably the best lube to use. Look at the attached photo. those are the TA release finger pivots on the 300 I mentioned above, my Uncle still has it. As you can see the pivot pin mounts are broke out one of the others is completely broke. I would venture a guess that if you have not used the TA much or at all it may limber up and move easier in time if you start using it more often to assist you when shifting in a binding scenario.

 

[chevypanel46]

Thank you Red,

I will be working with the tractor and experimenting with the incremental adjustments you recommend here. All the heavy resistance appears to be coming from the TA clutch pressure plate, and I had not thought to lubricate the pivot pin mounts. It's kind of a mystery how the master clutch has worked so freely for years with the TA seemingly having no effect on its operation. All together y’all have provided me with a pretty comprehensive education on the 300/350 Utility TA.

Not sure where it should be posted, but I'll offer up a backwoods Tennessee fix I did for the rear hydraulic control handle. Both handles were worn really sloppy and the rear one finally broke off completely. Looking online I could find only one new factory part and they wanted $300 for it. Nope. I removed the "control valve lever shaft" and found a 7/16" box end just fit around the end where the old control handle was attached. With a little piece of pipe to protect the rest of the shaft, I was able to get a good "wrap around weld" on the end. It has worked really well for a while now, completely smooth operation and no sloppiness at all.

 

[Janicholson]

CP, not sure if this will help you at all but the reason the drive train locks up when turned backwards is because the power is trying to pass through “two” gear ratios at the same time. The reduction ratio is always in mesh, when the TA direct clutch engages the parts involved with the reduction ratio speed up. When the transmission is driven in the normal direction the one way clutch or sprague allows this. If it tries to turn backwards when the direct clutch is engaged it is trying to drive the power train in two ratios and locks. Clear as mud? I am not sure if Jim ever realized this but the unfortunate thing about that video is the person turning the crank is rotating it the wrong direction. IH Fan and engine rotate clockwise when viewed from the front as do probably 95% or better of all engines.

It is a poor video, but lonely!

 

[Janicholson]

OK, here's the latest. I went through the adjustment procedure as described by Jim N., which perfectly coincided with the shop manual I just got hold of.

It does work, but not very well. The TA clutch begins to disengage at about the same spot of downward pedal travel as the master clutch begins to disengage--which is what it's supposed to do, right? And with the clutch pedal all the way down the tractor WILL roll backwards.

The PROBLEM now: It takes a tremendous amount of pressure to get clutch pedal all the way down--beginning at the point it contacts the TA clutch. Clutch pedal will go all the way down but it requires much more pressure than would be acceptable for normal operation. The strong resistance is obviously coming from the TA clutch.

Looking through the 4 bolt inspection hole the TA clutch assembly appears to be working right, but I suspect there's something wrong with the "internal linkage" or the pressure plate that makes it have so much resistance and makes it require so much control lever travel. The rotating ends (with grease zerks) of the "Torque Amplifier clutch release shaft" are worn pretty sloppy.

In my picture above there appears what looks like an "adjusting screw with a lock nut"??? at the center of the clutch release shaft--to the left of the clutch assembly. Is that a variable to consider?

Measuring at the top of the TA control lever, from the "notched back" position, I have to pull the lever back 4 1/2 inches before the TA throwout bearing begins contacting the clutch, then pull it back to the max 7-8 inches with a lot of pressure to fully engage the TA. I doubt if that's the way it's supposed to operate, but the TA itself seems to operate perfectly.

Right now I'd be happy just to get the master clutch working/disengaging properly with or without the TA working.

I want to thank all you guys once again for the good information and wise counsel!

The TA clutch should be disengaging farther down the pedal travel. If it is (as stated) at the same time, the TA clutch will be blocking travel of the pedal by the fingers being pushed in too far. That is the best I can say. From a fully "up" clutch pedal, the one inch freeway is encountered, then the engine clutch begins to be released, as this is complete, and the engine is free from driving the tractor, the TA clutch begins to be released., as the pedal reaches the last 1.5 inches or so of travel, the TA clutch is fully released allowing the tractor to roll rearward in forward gears, or backward in reverse. Jim