Allis WD-45, or D17 flywheel starter ring location?

[docmirror]

I don't have much hope, but I'll start here and see if it's an easy answer. I'm putting a Gleaner E engine in a Allis model D grader. I've sourced a flywheel and pressure plate which accepts the heavy duty 9 spring pressure plate. It's installed on the engine, and the engine is in the grader already. The model D trans has the starter mounted on top, and the starter has been rebuilt, and it spins fine.

My issue is that the starter gear is not engaging the starter ring on the flywheel. I'm thinking that the starter ring is too deep, and the starter is not engaging it because I have the wrong flywheel installed.

The question is - are there different starter ring locations on different flywheels? I think this flywheel is from a D17 four cyl engine, but I'm not sure. If the starter ring is supposed to be further back on the flywheel, that would indicate that my starter is not driving the bendix gear deep enough. If anyone knows a lot about the flywheel end of the WD-45, or D17, or even the model D starter setup any guesses would help.

 

[Bob Bancroft]

I don't have much hope, but I'll start here and see if it's an easy answer. I'm putting a Gleaner E engine in a Allis model D grader. I've sourced a flywheel and pressure plate which accepts the heavy duty 9 spring pressure plate. It's installed on the engine, and the engine is in the grader already. The model D trans has the starter mounted on top, and the starter has been rebuilt, and it spins fine.

My issue is that the starter gear is not engaging the starter ring on the flywheel. I'm thinking that the starter ring is too deep, and the starter is not engaging it because I have the wrong flywheel installed.

The question is - are there different starter ring locations on different flywheels? I think this flywheel is from a D17 four cyl engine, but I'm not sure. If the starter ring is supposed to be further back on the flywheel, that would indicate that my starter is not driving the bendix gear deep enough. If anyone knows a lot about the flywheel end of the WD-45, or D17, or even the model D starter setup any guesses would help.

Once again I can't answer your specific questions. The WD45 starter is mounted top center behind the engine, pointed at the engine, obviously to the rear of the flywheel. The D17 starter is mounted down along side of the engine block, obviously front of the flywheel. So yes, from that I'd say you're on the right track.

 

[DrAllis]

You need a flywheel from a WD-45 engine (W-226) made for the model "D" grader!!!! A WD-45 tractor uses a 10 inch clutch and the starter comes in from the rear. The D-17 engine (G-226) flywheel accommodates an 11 inch clutch and the flywheel is larger diameter than the 10 inch clutch flywheel. This starter comes in from the front. Flywheels for either engine will bolt up to either crankshaft.

 

[docmirror]

Zoiks. Just my luck, I grabbed the D-17 because it had the larger dia disk and the 9 spring setup. I think I have a WD-45 flywheel. Next, I presume I can't use the bigger clutch and PP, as they are diff size.

Anyone want to buy a like-new clutch PP and flywheel for a D-17?

Thanks Dr.

 

[docmirror]

I see a 10" setup with 9 springs:

Allis Chalmers WD45 Pressure Plate Assembly, Remanufactured, 70230424 - 204579

Allis Chalmers WD45 Pressure Plate Assembly, Remanufactured, 70230424 for sale, 204579. For Allis Chalmers tractor model WD45 (s\n 99648 - later) Replaces Allis Chalmers OEM number 70230424, 70232594 Pressure Plate Size: 10 Pressure Plate Levers: 3 Pressure Plate Springs: 9 Pressure Plate...

www.yesterdaystractors.com

I'm guessing I can use this over the 6 spring deal? I have a bit more HP with the Gleaner engine, would like a good stiff clutch and PP.

 

[docmirror]

Is there anything stopping me from milling and drilling my wd45 flywheel for 11 inch clutch and PP?

 

[DrAllis]

A WD-45 10 inch clutch with a 9-spring pressure plate WITH A 4-PAD CLUTCH DISC will hold 100 HP easily. Tractor pulling experience here. No milling/drilling needed.

 

[docmirror]

While I appreciate the ancillary info, it is not germane to my situation.

I have: a WD45 flywheel for a 10" PP; A brand new 9 spring 11" PP; A brand new 11" clutch; A milling machine and the knowledge to setup and mill.

So, other than spending money for stuff I don't have, a few hours on the mill will make me a happy camper with the WD45 flywheel hogged out to 11" and my new bits on the milled and drilled piece I already have. That is, unless there is something machine fitment I missing?

 

[Aaron SEIA]

I don't see how a 10" flywheel has enough material in it to "hog out" for an 11" pressure plate. If it does, the edge of the flywheel would be compromised enough it may not hold that extra power you are worried about. Sell the D17 parts and buy whats needed to make the 45 flywheel work.
AaronSEIA

 

[docmirror]

Well, it does. Only 1/2" per edge of course. It appears the two flywheels are almost exactly the same dia, but I didn't measure. How would the edge of the flywheel be compromised? It's a big heavy iron ring, there's no forces acting on it except centrifugal force. The bolts screw into the flange of the flywheel, there's plenty of meat outside the PP bolt circle.

 

[Aaron SEIA]

You've been given advice. You are free to do what you want with it.
AaronSEIA

 

[docmirror]

Your advice, which was also not germane to my question about taking off 1/2" at the outer edge. If it's ok with you, I'll wait to hear from someone with a bit more background on the materials and machining needed.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

I don't see how a 10" flywheel has enough material in it to "hog out" for an 11" pressure plate. If it does, the edge of the flywheel would be compromised enough it may not hold that extra power you are worried about. Sell the D17 parts and buy whats needed to make the 45 flywheel work.
AaronSEIA

Maybe he’s referring to the diameter of the disk , which would make the flywheel OD about 12” or so.

 

[Aaron SEIA]

Then follow Dr Allis advice. The man has forgotten more about AC than the rest of us ever knew. I doubt anyone is going to have good info about milling a 10" flywheel for an 11" clutch because virtually no one has done it. As for being germane, my advise has been entirely appropriate. But... you do you.
AaronSEIA

 

[Fritz Maurer]

A 10 inch clutch can’t handle the power of a 226? I know , my comment isn’t germane to the situation either.

 

[docmirror]

A 10 inch clutch can’t handle the power of a 226? I know , my comment isn’t germane to the situation either.

Not a matter of power, matter of money spent already. I've decided to buy the 10" equip and either eat the cost of the brand new 11", or sell it here. I don't want to mess with milling, if it will work or not. And, you are correct, it's not germane, but that's ok, most or all replies don't answer the orig question asked.