I H 444 pto Engagement problem

[Old ford craftsman]

Hello,need some ideas what to look into on a I H 444 diesel pto engagement problem.
Bought a new engagement shaft w/ handle and new lever w/ pin .looking into tranny case w/ borescope I can clearly see the pto shafts with the sliding collar.I marked my old assy insulation to handle / housing to make sure I t goes in sa.e way. My problem> shaft w/ lever installed and aligned w/ mark on housing went in to collar with ease.Installed 2 bolts snuggly to check.Pto lever just won't budge forward or back and pto is free to turn at rear of tractor by hand.Tried several times with tractor running clutch all the way down same can't move Handle to engage pto. When I tried 2nd an 3rd time I must have missed slot on colar as handle just free swung no resistance.Pulled assy back out .Looked inside again with borescope,everything very clean looking.Collar I see is on the rear pto spliced shaft up against snap ring stop,I also see where what looks like main pto spline shaft is split from rear collar not engaged.Is it possible collar is stuck that tight on the rear pto spliced shaft? My next step to see if I can get a pry bar and see if collar will slide forward to frt spliced shaft? Does this collar have some sort of a spring and ball that gives it its detent to stop in ,maybe ball is rusted in position? I assume the way it looks to operate the handle is in forward position ...disengaged w/ collar on rear shaf And backward movement of handle would be engaging collar to main pto clutch shaft..? Anyone have any helpful suggestions,would begreatly appreciated

 

[wore out]

Hello,need some ideas what to look into on a I H 444 diesel pto engagement problem.
Bought a new engagement shaft w/ handle and new lever w/ pin .looking into tranny case w/ borescope I can clearly see the pto shafts with the sliding collar.I marked my old assy insulation to handle / housing to make sure I t goes in sa.e way. My problem> shaft w/ lever installed and aligned w/ mark on housing went in to collar with ease.Installed 2 bolts snuggly to check.Pto lever just won't budge forward or back and pto is free to turn at rear of tractor by hand.Tried several times with tractor running clutch all the way down same can't move Handle to engage pto. When I tried 2nd an 3rd time I must have missed slot on colar as handle just free swung no resistance.Pulled assy back out .Looked inside again with borescope,everything very clean looking.Collar I see is on the rear pto spliced shaft up against snap ring stop,I also see where what looks like main pto spline shaft is split from rear collar not engaged.Is it possible collar is stuck that tight on the rear pto spliced shaft? My next step to see if I can get a pry bar and see if collar will slide forward to frt spliced shaft? Does this collar have some sort of a spring and ball that gives it its detent to stop in ,maybe ball is rusted in position? I assume the way it looks to operate the handle is in forward position ...disengaged w/ collar on rear shaf And backward movement of handle would be engaging collar to main pto clutch shaft..? Anyone have any helpful suggestions,would begreatly appreciated

There's no detent ballt in the collar.

Splines MAY be twisted from shock loads on the PTO, you can pull the PTO shaft out of the back of the tractor and have a look.

 

[INCase]

There's no detent ballt in the collar.

Splines MAY be twisted from shock loads on the PTO, you can pull the PTO shaft out of the back of the tractor and have a look.

do you have to pull the lever shaft out first? I would presume the lever would hold the collar and then it would fall into the transmission?

and is that accessible thru the transmission top plate (shifter plate)?

 

[used red MN]

Not sure how much you view the forums but it just so happens there is a current discussion about this same tractor and problem on the Tractor and Farm Talk forum. Here is a link. T & F Talk IH 444 PTO

 

[wore out]

do you have to pull the lever shaft out first? I would presume the lever would hold the collar and then it would fall into the transmission?

and is that accessible thru the transmission top plate (shifter plate)?

Remove the shifter mechanism with the PTO disengages.

The collar will be in the rearward position, on the PTO shaft and should come out with it.

 

[Old ford craftsman]

Not sure how much you view the forums but it just so happens there is a current discussion about this same tractor and problem on the Tractor and Farm Talk forum. Here is a link. T & F Talk IH 444 PTO

 

[caterpillar guy]

The one I found in tractor talk was a problem of not staying in gear. Which I would suspect has a worn out collar slipping out as it runs and would probably not be that bad to fix . Unlike yours that will not move with lever connected to collar. I would suspect it has one of a few possible issues. Twisted spline, stuck collar from, whatever wear, galled and forced into that position,possibly even the spline or collar are worn enogh that it can get cocked so it will not engage the other shaft or even the end of the shafts are boogered up so they don't slide well from someone trying to engage it without using the clutch thinking it was an independent PTO instead of a live PTO. I think you are going to have to pull it and have a good look at it .