Massey 65 throttle surging

[gullyc]

Got a '61 gas Massey 65 with the G176 Continental. Runs pretty well but notice the throttle is super touchy. Seems to surge outta control when barely touched, or not at all. I read about the friction disk problem where the throttle won't stay put and the lever moves. My lever seems tight and doesn't move on its own. Instead the engine changes rpm with very little throttle movement or none at all. Especially seems to surge to high power and over rev. Is this a governor issue and not the throttle friction disk problem? I can probably manage the governor adjustment to the linkages but could this problem be deeper? What should I be looking for?

 

[Dieseltech]

Sounds like governor trouble, make sure the carb rod is not sticking on both ends first. Governor spring speeds up engine, the governor weights slow it back down, the control rod length is critical too, if it's not set right engine control will be lazy or have a bad surge. I'd start with setting the rod length by the service manual, then adjust the length as needed 1-2 turns shorter/longer to get the action you want. If it never responds then there might be weight set/linkage trouble inside engine.

 

[gullyc]

Thanks dieseltech that seems like a good place to start. I'll get my eyes on that linkage today see what I can see. Imagining the next steps, I would have to remove the radiator and the timing cover to get at this thing correct? Are there governors available do a replace you think? I heard somebody say on another thread that they didn't think they were.

 

[Dieseltech]

Thanks dieseltech that seems like a good place to start. I'll get my eyes on that linkage today see what I can see. Imagining the next steps, I would have to remove the radiator and the timing cover to get at this thing correct? Are there governors available do a replace you think? I heard somebody say on another thread that they didn't think they were.

The governor weight set is behind the crankshaft pulley/timing cover on that engine, I don't know if it's still available.

 

[Bob NY]

Thanks dieseltech that seems like a good place to start. I'll get my eyes on that linkage today see what I can see. Imagining the next steps, I would have to remove the radiator and the timing cover to get at this thing correct? Are there governors available do a replace you think? I heard somebody say on another thread that they didn't think they were.

I had a governor problem with my 1966 165 gas (same engine as yours) a few years ago. A new governor was not available from Agco and I couldn't find any aftermarket. Turned out mine wasn't working because it was rusted. I took it apart, cleaned the pieces, lubed it and put back together. It works great now.

 

[gullyc]

Hey thanks for the info. I think I read a post on some forum similar to what you describe. Maybe it was you. Anyway, what does the governor look like for this thing? I found a youtube where a girl did a governor replace on a TO35 I think it was. Looked pretty easy. It was the type with a bunch of balls around the edge of a disk. Is the one in the 65 similar or some other type? Did you change the front crank shaft seal and felt while you were in there? Any other tips you have would be fantastic. I think the gov is def the problem. I'll look over the linkage and adjust that first but I have a feeling I'm going to have the timing cover off it soon.

 

[Dieseltech]

Hey thanks for the info. I think I read a post on some forum similar to what you describe. Maybe it was you. Anyway, what does the governor look like for this thing? I found a youtube where a girl did a governor replace on a TO35 I think it was. Looked pretty easy. It was the type with a bunch of balls around the edge of a disk. Is the one in the 65 similar or some other type? Did you change the front crank shaft seal and felt while you were in there? Any other tips you have would be fantastic. I think the gov is def the problem. I'll look over the linkage and adjust that first but I have a feeling I'm going to have the timing cover off it soon.

The 65 is NOT like the 35 governor on the CAMSHAFTA gear, 65 is on the CRANKSHAFT behind the timing cover.

 

[Bob NY]

Hey thanks for the info. I think I read a post on some forum similar to what you describe. Maybe it was you. Anyway, what does the governor look like for this thing? I found a youtube where a girl did a governor replace on a TO35 I think it was. Looked pretty easy. It was the type with a bunch of balls around the edge of a disk. Is the one in the 65 similar or some other type? Did you change the front crank shaft seal and felt while you were in there? Any other tips you have would be fantastic. I think the gov is def the problem. I'll look over the linkage and adjust that first but I have a feeling I'm going to have the timing cover off it soon.

The Z-134 governor attaches to the end of the camshaft. The G-176 governor fits around the crankshaft. Here is an exploded view of the G-176 governor.

 

[jt501]

Sounds like governor trouble, make sure the carb rod is not sticking on both ends first. Governor spring speeds up engine, the governor weights slow it back down, the control rod length is critical too, if it's not set right engine control will be lazy or have a bad surge. I'd start with setting the rod length by the service manual, then adjust the length as needed 1-2 turns shorter/longer to get the action you want. If it never responds then there might be weight set/linkage trouble inside engine.

yes this was the problem on our gas Massey 65 when it was doing that same thing. replaced the governor and it fixed the issue.

 

[gullyc]

The Z-134 governor attaches to the end of the camshaft. The G-176 governor fits around the crankshaft. Here is an exploded view of the G-176 governor.
View attachment 93724

So how do I get to this thing? Assuming I start by taking off the radiator and work my way toward the rear. What will need to come off and will I need any special tools?

 

[Bob NY]

So how do I get to this thing? Assuming I start by taking off the radiator and work my way toward the rear. What will need to come off and will I need any special tools?

You will probably have to take off the grill, hood, radiator, crank pulley and timing gear cover. I had to move the front bolster forward to get the timing cover out. I blocked up the tractor under the oil pan and put long bolts in so I could just moved it forward rather than take it off. The drag link may have to be unhooked too.