new electric range/old range power supply

[JMOR]

Maybe these instructions will help AND maybe the hand scratch will help some seen the potential hazard (perhaps small fractional), but there none the less, when the 120v return path is by the same neutral wire that control board AND cabinet is tied to.

 

[cjunrau]

Go to the store and pull the manual or find it online for the oven you want. It will have instructions if it allows for a 3 prong receptacle. I it requires or comes with a 4 prong cord and 4 prong receptacle then pull new wire.

Problem nowadays is that these ovens and ranges have these motherboards in them that may be made to run on a standard 120v circuit. The 240v powers the heating elements.

Bot all new Samsung appliances a few years ago. Just after the warranty period ended, the motherboard on the 3 prong range made the display act up and flash around. All the main functions still work but the display is hard to read. Replacing it requires a new top section.

A push button and the motherboard went bad on the microwave during the warranty period. Required a new door. First he ordered the wrong door. The second door was dented on the side. He offered to order a third one and I declined.

I think they have it programed to fail exactly when the warranty is over. seems like days or weeks after is when they fail. almost like clock work.

 

[DoubleO7]

The code changed in about 1966 from allowing 3 wire connections to the current code for 4 wires.

NEC did not require 4 prong until 1996.

 

[drsportster]

You will need to run a new cable on this

 

[drsportster]

My current electric range has 2 hot and 1 ground. The new induction ranges require 2 hot,1 netutal and ground.
Can I wrap white tape on the ground and call it netural and then run a number 12 green wire from my copper cold water pipe to the range as a ground?
I have seen pics that show the ground and netural strapped together. If I need a new supply line then I will keep what I have. I want to upgrade kitchen with new range and dishwasher to sell home.. Thanks for the help on my other posts.

Can't tape a ground to a Neutral with white tape

 

[JMOR]

Read my post. N and Gnd CAN be one wire and use with a 3 prong plug. The instructions caveat that with, “local codes”. I don’t know where he lives or the local codes there.

 

[olddavid]

Can I wrap white tape on the ground and call it netural and then run a number 12 green wire from my copper cold water pipe to the range as a ground?

If you run another ground it has to go back to service ground/neutral at some point else a short might not trip the breaker and possibly leave the chassis hot. This was discussed in another lengthy thread.

 

[JMOR]

If you run another ground it has to go back to service ground/neutral at some point else a short might not trip the breaker and possibly leave the chassis hot. This was discussed in another lengthy thread.

You didn’t read the instructions
sheet in my post did you?

 

[JMOR]

If you run another ground it has to go back to service ground/neutral at some point else a short might not trip the breaker and possibly leave the chassis hot. This was discussed in another lengthy thread.

You didn’t read the instructions
Ction sheet in my post did you?

 

[kencombs]

This is a problem I have with this form of communication. My statements are apparently misleading, or not specific enough. Physically running a cable is not a concern. How it is hooked up inside the panel is, as stated, grounds and neutrals are all hooked together.

Is the range hooked to a sub-panel or the main? Makes a huge difference . Ground and neutral are supposed to be connected at the main, not at subs. Good practice and current code would have on bar for grounds and the other for neutrals and the two bonded.

 

[olddavid]

You didn’t read the instructions
sheet in my post did you?

No, I guess not, and you are right for an old installation you might be ok to tie the neutral and ground together and I might do that if it was mine. New codes might not allow that for new installations. I believe my dryer has 4-wire hook up where the old ones only had 3. Grounding to the waterpipe won't protect him from shorts to the chassis. It would be better to do as you suggested.

 

[JOHN908]

You didn’t read the instructions
Ction sheet in my post did you?

I found the installation manual for the Samsung oven Bespoke $1200 at Lowes and it comes with the strap already setup for 3 wire hook up. It states DO not remove the strap for 3 wire install. The strap connects ground and neutral together. So your article did state a ground can be connected to a COLD water line so I am going to do that also being the range is only a couple feet away.

 

[JOHN908]

If the company would just install a transformer for the control circuit there woudn't be an issue.

 

[bc]

NEC did not require 4 prong until 1996.

They wrote a song about the NEC years ago I believe. Couple of the lines were:

"Do this, don't do that, can't you read the signs?"

"The sign said, "You've got to have a membership card to get inside"

It was sung by the 5 man Electricians Band as I recall.

Song started out with what a sign said about who couldnt apply to be an electrician. First line was:

"And the sign said long haired, freaky people need not apply."

I think there is a bunch of people here who: "tucked their hair up under their hat and went in and asked him why". I suppose there are a couple here who were told: You look like a fine upstandin young man, I think you'll do."

 

[chuckthin]

If the company would just install a transformer for the control circuit there woudn't be an issue.

Or, almost all new low voltage power brick power supply say 100v to 240v so you don't need 120v for control circuits any more.

 

[JMOR]

I found the installation manual for the Samsung oven Bespoke $1200 at Lowes and it comes with the strap already setup for 3 wire hook up. It states DO not remove the strap for 3 wire install. The strap connects ground and neutral together. So your article did state a ground can be connected to a COLD water line so I am going to do that also being the range is only a couple feet away.

If you are going to connect ground to water pipe, then you do need to remove neutral to ground strap.

 

[TheBartman47]

They wrote a song about the NEC years ago I believe. Couple of the lines were:

"Do this, don't do that, can't you read the signs?"

"The sign said, "You've got to have a membership card to get inside"

It was sung by the 5 man Electricians Band as I recall.

Song started out with what a sign said about who couldnt apply to be an electrician. First line was:

"And the sign said long haired, freaky people need not apply."

I think there is a bunch of people here who: "tucked their hair up under their hat and went in and asked him why". I suppose there are a couple here who were told: You look like a fine upstandin young man, I think you'll do."

Sign, sign, everywhere a sign...

 

[olddavid]

If you are going to connect ground to water pipe, then you do need to remove neutral to ground strap.

No offense but I'm not sure if that is a good plan. Is the waterpipe as good as service ground? Is it actually a metal pipe where it goes under ground? Even if it is will it trip a breaker if a hot wire shorts to the chassis? In my humble opinion just bonding the ground to the neutral is a better solution.

 

[1948CaseVAI]

My current electric range has 2 hot and 1 ground. The new induction ranges require 2 hot,1 netutal and ground.
Can I wrap white tape on the ground and call it netural and then run a number 12 green wire from my copper cold water pipe to the range as a ground?
I have seen pics that show the ground and netural strapped together. If I need a new supply line then I will keep what I have. I want to upgrade kitchen with new range and dishwasher to sell home.. Thanks for the help on my other posts.

Why do folks here make so many jobs so much harder than they have to be to do it right? You might be able to fiddle with an old truck and make it reun on distillate, but it would not run right or be worth the hassle, Join the current century.

 

[sotxbill]

“Becomes energized”, by the amount of voltage drop in the neutral wire

Then,, could it become energized by the amount of voltage drop in the ground wire?? whn compared to gas, water, phone, cable, ei eio?

Had a very long mall in a very rocky area in town with two power feeds from each end. And where they met in the middle and had boxes mounted side by side on the same wall, there would be an arc if you touched from one box to the other as the phone company was trying to ground pbxs (being installed that ran on both sides of the middle).... power company was not happy and came out and redid the grounding on one side.