OT: There are alternatives to burning wood.

[Geo-TH,In]

The alternative is Insulation, Good windows and good doors.

This is my forever home. I bought it 45 years ago.
Took 5 years to double the size, added a 2 car garage and converted it to total electric using the least efficient heat source, electric baseboard heat. I installed Andersen windows, Insulated doors, insulated garage doors, exterior walls got an upgrade in insulation and 25000 brick. Brick helps keep the house comfortable. It takes a long time for brick to cool off or heat up. Brick are shock absorbers, buffers temp change.

This is my fixed electric bill from 2020-2021.
$156 fixed rate per month. I also power my pole barn from the same meter. My garage stays at 55.
My most current fixed bill is $20 more starting in Jan 2023.

If I were to add wood heat, my homeowners insurance would increase. I'm too old to want to think of using a chainsaw and burning. Each to their own. I can't think of anyone in my neighborhood that burns wood.

Except for a man who has a boiler. He lives 7 miles away from my country home in the southern part of the county. He loves to take any wood I'll give him. A win for me and a win for him.
He has a chainsaw and a dump truck. I have a terramite.
He cuts, I load.

I'm not anti burning, just don't want to smell your smoke.
I don't want to smell your wood smoke, your cigarette smoke, or your black diesel smoke.
I think everyone has a right to breathe clean air.

My point is there are alternatives to burning wood.
BYT, the younger man who has a boiler also has back problems from using a chainsaw and lifting heavy firewood to his log splitter.
He told me someday he'll have to stop burning.

 

[Loosehandle]

Brother lives near Indianapolis I live in Wisconsin, the winter comparison is apples and oranges

 

[300jk]

I dont burn wood in the house. Dont have access to the amount of firewood I would need. I would have to buy it, and be fairly costly, and labor intensive. I do have a coal stove that provides our basic heat, and when it cant keep up the boiler comes on. Our boiler is oil fired along with our water heater. Everything else is electric. Meaning clothes dryer, oven, ect. Natural gas is not an option where we live. Heating is primarily done with propane or oil. House is of 1979 vintage. 2x6 exterior walls well insulated and the attic also has a lot of insulation. Never have any icicles from heat loss. Windows are 2 years old and of good quality made around here locally. With all that said our electric bill is already substantially higher than yours. Cant imagine what it would be trying to heat with electric too.

 

[WNYBill]

George, I applaud you. We are in WNY, south of Buffalo. We have an oil-fired boiler for our base board hot water heat and 2 heat pumps (mini splits) for AC. The heat pump will heat down to about 0, not sure of the efficiency, it quits working at about -5. Right now it is -5 with a -20 wind chill so the heat pump is in-operatable, and the oil furnace is burning about a gallon per hour @ $5.70/ gallon. If the wennies had their way we would be sitting in front of an electric resistance heater and I can't even compute that cost and the grid couldn't handle the draw.

We have people making laws/rules that don't understand the problem and now they have 1.7 trillion more to waste!

 

[NY 986]

Yes, too many uninformed people wanting to make decisions for all.

 

[Traditional Farmer]

I enjoy all aspects of heating,cutting,burning,etc wood.Great exercise,one of the reasons I have few health problems.With all the health problems and issues you have you might do well to take up cutting and burning wood.

 

[redforlife]

Burning wood is not for everyone. For some people, the choice of burning wood is just not a possibility. Are you sure you don't fit into that category more so, than just voluntarily doing an alternative???

In my opinion, if you simply just don't have the time to cut your own firewood or don't want to, it doesn't make any sense to try and heat with wood. And I don't even heat with wood, because of that reason. I have the time to cut wood. I live by myself and like the ability to take off and be gone whenever I want, and for as long I want. But I don't like leaving a wood stove un-attended. Especially a wood stove in the house. I don't heat with wood because of that reason.

Your post makes it sound not only like there is alternatives to burning wood, but you are also opposed to others burning it (not sure that you are, but your post sure sounds like it).

For some people that have the time and ability and wants to, burning wood just makes sense. They also may not be able to afford your electric bills. My electric bill is between 40 and 50 dollars a month and not a fixed rate. I don't heat with electricity. My point being, the difference in the electric bill, and some people not being able to afford that. Not to mention, they might not have all the upgrades and improvements done to thier house, as you do to yours.

I'm not promoting one way or the other. Myself not burning wood is evidence of the bi-partison nature of my comments. Just expressing my 2 cents.

 

[John T]

Good morning good neighbor, your post There are alternatives to burning wood.

I AGREE, AMEN neighbor X2 I have used most all the alternatives YOU ARE INDEED CORRECT lots of choices
there are indeed alternatives !!!!!!!!! Some like wood some don't, some like elec some don't SO WHAT !!!

As you well know, INSULATION is the best way to reduce heating bills REGARDLESS if you heat with wood, wood chips, corn, coal, LP Gas, Natural Gas, Heat Pump, Geothermal, Solar, Dual Fuel or very inefficient electric resistance heat which only yields 3.41 BTU per Watt Yikes !!!!

As you have proven and are well aware INSULATION reduces heating cost REGARDLESS of what alternatives a person chooses to heat with. Having used most ALL methods above including resistance elec heat which my elec utility company loved furnishing lol I have settled on the most cost efficient form I now use which is DUAL FUEL Natural Gas PLUS Heat Pump only when its not so cold and they are more efficient BEST OF BOTH WORLDS plus I have AC in the summer, works out great for MY needs which is all that matters.

To each THEIR OWN choices of how to heat THEIR homes, I support THEIR choices even if not the most efficient, even if its elec resistance heat orrrrrrrrrrrr wood or even if someone here doesn't like another persons choices !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tell em to pound sand if they dont like how you heat YOUR home LOL

Nice job of insulating which reduces heat bills (regardless of heating method) neighbor YOU DID GOOD George, congratulations

Merry CHRISTmas to you and yours

John T

 

[mudcreek183]

We heat with wood unless it get super cold we have no problem keeping the house at 72 degree with the woodstove.

 

[Vicinalvictor]

I agree with you, although I do have an old garage I converted to a farm office with a small wood stove in it. I don't use it very often unless I'm in there working on stuff. I can't imagine what the whole area would smell like if everyone was burning something.

 

[johnofnewhaven]

Mudcreek what is the little door by
the wood stove? Storage for wood?
I've never seen that.

 

[Russ from MN]

There is an air quality alert in the Phoenix valley now, they don't recommend anyone with respiratory problems going outside. And there will still be lots of fireplaces putting out more smoke tonight! Not that they need them, it's going to be 72 degrees here today.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

(quoted from post at 06:46:25 12/24/22) The alternative is Insulation, Good windows and good doors.

Wonderful. You offering to buy? I think $50,000 should just about cover what this house needs to be up to snuff. Make the check out to "CASH."

 

[showcrop]

Geo. I am so happy that you have finally seen the light about insulation!!! I can remember when I was first becoming aware of building construction principles around 60 years ago that people were talking about the need to frame six inch walls in order to have the additional insulation. Very soon after that we were hearing about "Therm-o-pane" glass for windows and doors. Soon after that everyone was installing the foam core doors instead of wood core doors. The oil embargo of 1973 brought a heightened awareness of the need to have a tight house in order to be able to afford to heat it. Congratulations on finally getting on board with insulation and tightness. I am sure that you will see your high electric bills getting smaller!

 

[Goose]

Our humble abode.

It has 6 inch outer walls, and an extra insulation package. We heat with propane, and it's easy to heat.

We have a wood burning fireplace, but we actually don't use it that much.

We needed a house in a hurry in 1999, so we put this one up, saying we'd probably live in it 10 years and move back to town. Now 23 years later, we're still here.

 

[Buckhammer]

It is great to see that we all think that the way we each heat our homes is the best for each of us. One size shoe doesn't fit all and what works for you might not work for me. I have been living in a home whether it was my parents house or the 2 homes i have had since 1992 that have only used wood for heat.

In 1980 my parents installed a Fisher wood stove in their dining room. The day after it was completed my dad went down in the basement and took the glass fuses out of the fuse box for the fuel oil furnace and told the family if you want heat tonight in the house we are going to the woods right now to cut wood.

It has been wood heat for me ever since.

I took control of the family farm and its house in 1998 after my grandmother moved out. At that time the house was heated with wood and still is, but the house was severely outdated. There was no furnace or duct work, The upstairs had no electrical outlets and the plumbing was the original from when indoor plumbing was installed in 1954. I did a complete remodel in 1998 and installed duct work and a propane furnace. Along with updating the plumbing and electrical. I only installed the duct work and furnace because i wanted central air. Since 1998 i can count on one hand the number of times that furnace has ran.


I love to cut wood. If time and circumstance permitted i would cut wood 7 days a week and twice on Sunday. I sell wood on the side. When I cut wood i sort it out. The good wood gets sold and what i call Junk Wood gets burnt by me. I waste nothing when i cut. Whether i am cutting a dead tree or tree tops from a recent logging i cut everything right down to the size of my thumb. It does not matter to me if the wood is great or punky. All wood makes heat if it is dry. Some just makes more than other. When i split wood i save all of the scraps and any big pieces of bark that comes off of the wood while splitting. It all goes in my stove and it all makes heat.

The money that i have saved from not running my furnace over the years and the money i made from selling wood allowed me to retire early and comfortably. Now that i am retired i have even more time to cut. A win win. There is nothing better than being outside in the fresh air every day cutting wood. I love to come home after a long day of cutting, stoke the stove, and put my supper on the woodstove to cook with food that i harvested from my land. I go to bed with a full belly, a warm home with a roof that doesn't leak and my bills are always paid on time. Life is good

 

[Buckhammer]

 

[37 chief]

I have solar electric panels, and don't pay anything for electricity each month. At the end of the year I make up the difference, which is about what I pay for a couple tanks of gas. At 80 I am glad I can still load and cut wood, I enjoy doing it. I could go with electric heat, or a gas furnace, but for now as long as I am able, I will heat with wood. Same with my weed mowing business, I could probably stop doing it, but It gives me a chance to run my tractors, and get out in the open. Stan

 

[Dean]

Yes, coal-fired electric.

 

[dwag]

Might cut 2 off pipe, move stove over to right some & add a ring on wall? lol

 

[Butch(OH)]

Electric bill is almost 2X that and I don't heat with it.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

About 30% of the electricity comes from coal.
And coal plants are being decommissioned real fast.
A few states have zero coal power plants.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

I stand corrected.
One neighbor 3 miles down wind burns wood.
He is a tree trimmer.

Yard full of wood.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

Stan,
Keep doing what you are doing. Exercise my be a good reason you are 80.
I don't think I'll be alive when I'm 80.
Males on my dad's side of the family don't make it past 65, with one exception. My dad's youngest brother lived to 80. He was a farmer and died from cancer.
My oldest brother died at 65 from cancer.
My other brother is 78 and is now living in a hospice clinic.
I really shouldn't call it living, he's residing in a hospice clinic. Everyone please do what makes you happy.
I'm happy when my back isn't hurting.
I'm happy I built an energy efficient house when I was 30 years younger. My days are limited. I can't swing a hammer anymore without hurting all night. I have no reason to work harder than I have to.

 

[mudcreek183]

(quoted from post at 09:21:23 12/24/22) Mudcreek what is the little door by
the wood stove? Storage for wood?
I've never seen that.

Yes it's a woodbox .It's is super nice don't have to lug the wood through the house to get it to the stove the box hold enough for about a days burning.

 

[Janicholson]

My relatives in Seelyville were, When alive, Peabody miners. Pibbidy long since moved south in the state. If your electricity comes from coal, the total environmental effect of your electrification has yet to mature. Working toward the use of carbon free sources is important. Wood, is carbon neutral(ish) Jim

 

[Stuart]

I live in Wisconsin also. If I wanted to use electric heat, I would need a liquid cooled check book and electric meter !

 

[Dean]

FWIW, sane folks are scrambling to reopen coal fired plants in Europe.

Indeed, the British recently licensed a new coal mine. Not reopening a previously closed mine but a new mine.

Interesting, how sanity returns once times become tough.

Stay tuned.

 

[john in la]

The world will burn more coal in 2022 than it ever has in any year to date.

 

[warbaby]

Dont get too excited there ol' buddy, its a coking coal mine for industrial smelting, and none of it is going to generate electricity- if at all.

Despite the government's recent approval, the British steel industry doesnt want its product and environmental groups will keep it tied up in the courts until it is no longer viable.

 

[kip78]

I'm not anti burning, I just don't want to smell your smoke.

I'm not anti neighbor, I just don't want to live next to people like you. You seem to think everyone is flush with cash like you.

 

[RobCons]

We all live in different areas. Down here we use a heat pump with propane gas logs as a backup. Our cooling bills in the summer are usually larger than our heating bills. We seldom use the gas logs unless there is a power outage. And yes insulation is the key to comfort and affordable heating/cooling.

 

[Traditional Farmer]

Not using coal is a temporary thing

 

[Welding man]

Just got an E-mail from the power company 2 hours ago that said the whole power grid was overloaded and please try to conserve electricity by turning down the thermostat and not to use the oven or clothes dryer for the next 24 hours. This is not my problem. I put 2 more logs on the fire and poured me a glass of wine. I didn't tell them to shut down the coal fired power house that I worked at for several years and invest in windmills and solar panels. I have a generator and the fuel to run it and a big pile of Oak wood. I'm really not concerned.

 

[M-MAN]

Mom and Dad bought into the money saving baseboard heat fiasco when they built their home. Duke even told them how to insulate it to be the most efficient. Brick house. Power bills were terrible. When they got to $400 a month they had a heat pump put in and it dropped to $150 a month. In our area nothing is more expensive than baseboard heat.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

Dean
Which is worse, Burning coal efficiently, using scrubbers and particle filters, collecting ash or burning wood, smoldering, generating a lot of smoke, creosote and putting particles in the air?

 

[Geo-TH,In]

John
You can thank Putin for a boost in burning coal.
Is burning coal worse than burning wood?

 

[Dean]

Bingo.

 

[Dean]

They are opening a new coal mine or they are not.

Which is it?

 

[Geo-TH,In]

I wasn't born with a gold spoon.
I've worked hard, made good choices and
I earned every penny I have.
If I can do it, everyone can do it..

 

[Dean]

Bingo.

Who'd a thunk it, even 3 years ago?
Say It Aint So

 

[Dean]

No.

You can thank the sane folks in China, India, and, of course, Russia.

Stay tuned.

 

[johnofnewhaven]

Welding Man I got the same notice twice but in a text on my phone. You are spot on with what you said.

 

[db4600]

This topic is a hoot. Naive, hypocritical, and ego-maniacal all in one. You better put sock on your Terramite Woodsy Owl!

 

[Liquid_wrench]

My dad did the same thing, every foot of electric baseboard = 1 amp, so if you have 50' of baseboard.... you are using 50 amps of electric, his bill was well over $300.00 a month for a 1500 sq ft house.

 

[warbaby]

They have APPROVED a proposal for new coal mine. Thats a pretty BIG difference from actually constructing and opening one!

British-based foundries have already said they dont need the blast furnace coke that will be derived from this proposed mine, and because of Brexit, foundries in the EU will not buy it due to punitive tariffs coupled with rising carbon taxes.

Add to that the environmental groups (and their well-paid lawyers) aligning against it as well as the adamantly opposed local residents and its a pretty safe bet that this mine will never get past the planning stage. 2030 will be upon them sooner than they think!

Stay Tuned... And Merry Christmas!

 

[Dean]

So, sane folks in England have decided to license a brand new coal mine or they have not. Which is it?

Additionally, you appear to condone eco-nazis (and their well-paid lawyers) making policy decisions, such not being the providence of the court system in the US.

Do you feel the same way about Dobbs? How about D S?

Merry Christman, and stay tuned.

Gotta love it.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

John Fetterman will save us!

 

[chevytaHOE5674]

UP here in the frozen tundra where we are on hour 48 of a blizzard (65mph wind gusts, -40 wind chills, 40 inches of snow, etc) the price per KW is so expensive I try not to even run the toaster. I'd be further ahead to just burn Benjamin's in the wood stove it would be cheaper than paying for electric heat. Lol

UP here wood and propane are king. Nobody could afford to live here with electric heat.

 

[JMOR]

Those "clean energy" people using electric heat are just letting someone else burn the fossil fuel for them somewhere else. What a farce! :x

 

[caterpillar guy]

If you have to buy wood I'm so sure it is a practical solution for heat. I have plenty of wood available from fence row trees cutting limbs to clear equipment each year plus all the dead wood to cut. Rarely cut a live tree. If we do it is for logs to make lumber to build sheds or something else like that. Then we don't waste the tops either cutting them for Wood down to about your thumb size also. Though at times I think the old buzz saw would be more efficient for that smaller stuff than a chainsaw. You can cut several pieces at once with each pas of the blade. Dad and I talked about if we would have enough dead fall stuff along with other wood for both of us in the past when he put in his wood furnace since it would do all the heating now instead of having some oil heat. That was over 20 years ago and still no problem with dead wood for heat. And everything makes heat junk wood like Boxelder and Pines.Yes grandpa planted a bunch of pines on some steep slopes with the Cat to pull the trans planter 60 or more years ago. We cut Christmas trees out of the tops of some of them for decades and now are cutting the dead ones for wood. It has thinned it out some but still has a lot left. Wood does not necessarily make dirty air and I don't mind wood smoke smell, better than the garbage burning I used to smell around areas. Electric heat is just not an option in most places and the grid can't supply the amount you want everybody to draw from it with electric heat even if the hoses were insulated a foot thick and so tight you could hear the air rush as you open the door to go in or out. You need coal to make steel for those housings for your fine batteries you so proudly purport to every body hoe great they are. Those nice cars you want to drive around and all those other products you want /like so much all have steel in them and they need coal for the coke to make it.

 

[Crazy Horse]

WM .... I think we too often forget that our own little world is not the whole world. We should all be in this together and try not to be so smug if everything is OK at home. Much the same as many of the wealthy when asked about those less fortunate who have nothing.

 

[Bret4207]

You are free to do as you wish George. And I should be free to do as I wish. I like the smell of woodsmoke, I don't like being totally dependent on a power company to survive 7 months of winter. Just because what you have works for you doesn't mean it's right for everyone else. Live and let live George.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

(quoted from post at 06:46:27 12/25/22) Just because what you have works for you doesn't mean it's right for everyone else.

Oh but yes it does. You are simply not squeezing your sphincter tight enough, not believing in God hard enough. You heard the man. If he can do it anyone can do it.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 10:13:20 12/25/22)

(quoted from post at 06:46:27 12/25/22) Just because what you have works for you doesn't mean it's right for everyone else.

Oh but yes it does. You are simply not squeezing your sphincter tight enough, not believing in God hard enough. You heard the man. If he can do it anyone can do it.

t is so simple! If you don't work & try hard enough& wind up with nothing, just blame someone else for your failure & raise holy H that those who did work hard are not eager to support you.

 

[warbaby]

They licensed it, sure, but it PROBABLY wont get built.

Theres no market for it.

It'll cost way more than the competing mines.

Unless markets and demand for smelting coke change dramatically, it will end up being a white elephant and a money loser. If it even gets built.

It is the UK's version of Keystone XL.

 

[Leroy]

I am going to ask what do all of you with electric heat do for heat when the storms take all the power lined down and it is over a week before they can get them restored? Have had that situation here in Ohio a few times but luckly we could survive without electricity. So do you have a big generator to power your heat or what? And I have found electricity is a cold heat, does not warm the body like wood does. But my question is what do you do to durvive when the power lines are down for a week or more in below zero weather.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 11:38:08 12/25/22) I am going to ask what do all of you with electric heat do for heat when the storms take all the power lined down and it is over a week before they can get them restored? Have had that situation here in Ohio a few times but luckly we could survive without electricity. So do you have a big generator to power your heat or what? And I have found electricity is a cold heat, does not warm the body like wood does. But my question is what do you do to durvive when the power lines are down for a week or more in below zero weather.

ot just your bodies, but what about the plumbing? $$$$$

 

[Fritz Maurer]

Yeah, the old XL pipeline white elephant. So much cheaper to move oil by rail and sea vessels. Burn 2 gallons of oil to deliver one.

 

[INCase]

your fixed bill makes a difference. if not on that plan i presume your bills would be huge $$.

the farm house is fuel oil heat. until the past week or 2 oil has been so high that electric was cheaper than fuel oil for heating. now it is the other way around. BUT, its not much cheaper than electric now. we're paying $0.145 per KWH and $3.93/gal fuel oil. at $4.50/gallon electric and oil are the same price. (assuming 77% efficient oil furnace)

In Jan 2021 fuel oil was only about $2.50/gal. about a month ago it was $6.10/gal delivered. Luckily i was able to avoid paying that. we have been pretty mild until this past weekend.