Ring gear procedure

[Mertz54]

I'm replacing my ring gear on my 9N. Couple questions: 1. Do I need to drain the oil? I did the first time I did this but my antique neighbor is saying I don't. He's an old rancher with two antique tractors in his shed so I tend to believe him.

On a different note, my clutch sticks. By that I mean when I press the clutch pedal, the clutch refuses to disengage and the tractor continues to travel, sometimes as much as 10 yards. I read on this site that there is a seal that is probably leaking. if that is true, what is the name of that seal and can I replace it when I have the tractor split?

 

[Eman85]

Ring gear requires axle trumpet removal, you don't have to drain it. It will drain itself on the floor, I would rather use the drain plug and a pan.
Clutch sticks? Is it adjusted properly? Has it leaked fluid out of the drain hole at the bottom of the bellhousing? If you're splitting the tractor the seal you mean is the input shaft seal, yes it's done with the tractor split. If it's causing the clutch disc to swell it would be time for a clutch also.

 

[Jim.ME]

I'm replacing my ring gear on my 9N. Couple questions: 1. Do I need to drain the oil? I did the first time I did this but my antique neighbor is saying I don't. He's an old rancher with two antique tractors in his shed so I tend to believe him.

On a different note, my clutch sticks. By that I mean when I press the clutch pedal, the clutch refuses to disengage and the tractor continues to travel, sometimes as much as 10 yards. I read on this site that there is a seal that is probably leaking. if that is true, what is the name of that seal and can I replace it when I have the tractor split?

One more word added to your description can be the difference between right and wrong answers. Starter ring gear or the differential ring gear? They are two different animals. Starter ring gear is on the flywheel, and you don't need to drain oil to get to it. The differential ring gear is in the rear end housing, and you have to drain the oil. The pinion gear should be replaced with the differential ring gear.

If it is the starter ring gear, you should fix the clutch and any seals in the area while split for the starter ring gear.

 

[Mertz54]

Jim,

Interesting. When I read Emam's post, that thought did cross my mind but I had never heard of any other ring but the starter ring gear. That answers my question. I Thank both of you.

The first time I did this a friend did it and I was just a spectator so this will be fun. He had a hard time pressing the gear on to the flywheel so he ended up spot welding it in three places. That lasted about a year. This time I'll take it to a machine shop. This website is amazing.

 

[mhb@ufe]

Jim,

Interesting. When I read Emam's post, that thought did cross my mind but I had never heard of any other ring but the starter ring gear. That answers my question. I Thank both of you.

The first time I did this a friend did it and I was just a spectator so this will be fun. He had a hard time pressing the gear on to the flywheel so he ended up spot welding it in three places. That lasted about a year. This time I'll take it to a machine shop. This website is amazing.

The ring gear needs to be heated so it will swell and then when installed on the flywheel it will shrink on and be tight. Pressing it on cold causes it to stretch and will not shrink back down.

 

[Tall T]

I'm replacing my ring gear on my 9N. Couple questions: 1. Do I need to drain the oil? I did the first time I did this but my antique neighbor is saying I don't. He's an old rancher with two antique tractors in his shed so I tend to believe him.

On a different note, my clutch sticks. By that I mean when I press the clutch pedal, the clutch refuses to disengage and the tractor continues to travel, sometimes as much as 10 yards. I read on this site that there is a seal that is probably leaking. if that is true, what is the name of that seal and can I replace it when I have the tractor split?

I'm also confused.
Are you calling the CROWN gear a ring gear; i.e. the crown and pinion in the differential housing??
The ring gear is on the flywheel and is what the starter bendix engages with to turn the engine over.

 

[Jim.ME]

I'm also confused.
Are you calling the CROWN gear a ring gear; i.e. the crown and pinion in the differential housing??
The ring gear is on the flywheel and is what the starter bendix engages with to turn the engine over.

The differential ring gear is a (type of) crown gear. The differential gears are generally referred to as ring and pinions, at least around here, and in most catalogs, including some Ford tractor parts books.

 

[Eman85]

Ring gear requires axle trumpet removal, you don't have to drain it. It will drain itself on the floor, I would rather use the drain plug and a pan.
Clutch sticks? Is it adjusted properly? Has it leaked fluid out of the drain hole at the bottom of the bellhousing? If you're splitting the tractor the seal you mean is the input shaft seal, yes it's done with the tractor split. If it's causing the clutch disc to swell it would be time for a clutch also.

OK my mistake, I had differential ring gear on my mind for some reason. Flywheel ring gear should be heated, if you don't have a way to do it find someone that can do it correctly. Pay attention to the gear and the bevel.

 

[Mertz54]

The ring gear needs to be heated so it will swell and then when installed on the flywheel it will shrink on and be tight. Pressing it on cold causes it to stretch and will not shrink back down.

mhb,

Yea, I'm aware of that. We did try to heat it the first time around. I'm guessing that we didn't get it hot enough because we just couldn't get it over the lip. Hence, we went with the welds.

Thanks for the reminder. That's why I am going to a machine shop this time around. There's an old timer in town who knows what he's doing.

 

[Mertz54]

OK my mistake, I had differential ring gear on my mind for some reason. Flywheel ring gear should be heated, if you don't have a way to do it find someone that can do it correctly. Pay attention to the gear and the bevel.

My friend and I found that out (the bevel) the hard way. There's an old timer in town who knows what he's doing so I'll let him do it. I think I'll replace the clutch and throw-out bearing as well. Both highly recommended by other old timers.

 

[Jim in LA]

I ended up taking the flywheel and ring gear to a very good machine shop. They ended up having to cut the flywheel down because the ring gears(I had to buy a second one) would not fit no matter how hot they heatd them. That tractor is "special"

 

[HarryVanderpool]

I ended up taking the flywheel and ring gear to a very good machine shop. They ended up having to cut the flywheel down because the ring gears(I had to buy a second one) would not fit no matter how hot they heatd them. That tractor is "special"

Did they chill the flywheel?

 

[Tall T]

The differential ring gear is a (type of) crown gear. The differential gears are generally referred to as ring and pinions, at least around here, and in most catalogs, including some Ford tractor parts books.

If you lay a ring gear down it looks like a RING.
If you lay a crown gear on it's back it looks like the kings crown.

Why am I not surprised!
Calling a crown gear a ring gear -- especially when confusion with the flywheel ring gear is obviously possible --
makes as much sense to me as calling a huge kingpin a spindle just because they are attached.

 

[Jim.ME]

If you lay a ring gear down it looks like a RING.
If you lay a crown gear on it's back it looks like the kings crown.

Why am I not surprised!
Calling a crown gear a ring gear -- especially when confusion with the flywheel ring gear is obviously possible --
makes as much sense to me as calling a huge kingpin a spindle just because they are attached.

Just differences in what we learned for the names of the gears. Look at the definitions. A crown type gear has pointed teeth at right angles to the plane of the gear, a differential gear does not have pointed teeth at right angles to the gear plane. The gears in the differential are actually the spiral bevel type of gears, the teeth are more like helical gears. A starter ring gear on his 9N is a spur gear type.

I believe ring and pinion are more common names for the differential gears, autos, trucks, even used by Ford in many of their tractor parts books, such as the 800 series. There might be some that use crown gear for differential gear description however I haven't found any calling out crown gears.

 

[Tall T]

Just differences in what we learned for the names of the gears. Look at the definitions. A crown type gear has pointed teeth at right angles to the plane of the gear, a differential gear does not have pointed teeth at right angles to the gear plane. The gears in the differential are actually the spiral bevel type of gears, the teeth are more like helical gears. A starter ring gear on his 9N is a spur gear type.

I believe ring and pinion are more common names for the differential gears, autos, trucks, even used by Ford in many of their tractor parts books, such as the 800 series. There might be some that use crown gear for differential gear description however I haven't found any calling out crown gears.

Jim,

You're right!
Just checked in my '48 to '51 Chev Truck Shop Manual.
In the exploded view they label the big one the "ring gear".
and in procedures illustrate "ring gear and pinion adjustment" . . . which I have to do next spring to remove backlash.

They also show the "differential pinion gear" meshing with the smaller "differential side gear".

All my life I've only heard "crown and pinion" so I was stuck on that. Maybe it's a Canadian thing
but I probably picked it up from my friend who used to be a GM service guy and he was telling me how to get 10 more MPH out of my '51 3/4 ton at the same Engine RPM.

This Shop Manual was printed at GM in Detroit.

 

[Mertz54]

Okay, I'm ready to split my tractor. I've got everything separated that should be, according to the manual. Is there any particular order to removing the bolts between the motor block and the rear end?

 

[used red MN]

Okay, I'm ready to split my tractor. I've got everything separated that should be, according to the manual. Is there any particular order to removing the bolts between the motor block and the rear end?

You probably moved on past this point. I have never split a Ford. In general if it has a larger bolt in the lower part of the split line one on each side I would take all the others out in no particular order. After it is supported, then remove the two bolt that are left one on each side working side to side removing them evenly. If it has not spilt apart by this time I would screw the bolts back In two turns each. Then pry or use wedges etc to force it apart.