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8N with 12volt battery - all else original

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mr.precision
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:10 am    Post subject: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Picked up a 1948 8N recently. Tractor starts easily and runs like a watch. PO fitted 12 volt battery and changed nothing else. From what I can tell, the generator, harness, regulator, terminal block etc all appear original or correct replacements.

Where would I measure voltage to the points, or look for a ballast resistor? What would be the correct voltage to look for?

The 12 volt battery is new, otherwise I'd just go back to 6 volts and leave things as they are. I am not familiar with the front mount coil/distributor setup and don't want to fry the points. I seem to recall that a JD 420 I had years ago was 6 volt and had a ballast resistor also. Thanks.
 
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Tony in SD
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:34 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

My guess is PO needed a battery and just bought a battery that fit in the battery compartment without considering voltage. I d put a 6 volt battery in as soon as I could.
 
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mr.precision
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:59 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Battery has been in the tractor for 1 year. PO claims no problems as he did use it. I don't have a problem putting a new 6v battery in it, but then I have a 12v battery laying around that I don't need. Looking for a simple solution..... and your suggestion may be the best choice to avoid any future problems. Thanks.
 
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TheOldHokie
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 6:01 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

mr.precision wrote:
(quoted from post at 09:10:34 06/15/21) Picked up a 1948 8N recently. Tractor starts easily and runs like a watch. PO fitted 12 volt battery and changed nothing else. From what I can tell, the generator, harness, regulator, terminal block etc all appear original or correct replacements.

Where would I measure voltage to the points, or look for a ballast resistor? What would be the correct voltage to look for?

The 12 volt battery is new, otherwise I'd just go back to 6 volts and leave things as they are. I am not familiar with the front mount coil/distributor setup and don't want to fry the points. I seem to recall that a JD 420 I had years ago was 6 volt and had a ballast resistor also. Thanks.


Measure voltage to the points at the primary connectIon on the top of the coil. If the coil is still 6V
you need an additional ballast resistor in the primary. Not needed if the coil as been replaced with a 12V version.

Obviously the generator (if still 6V) will not charge your 12V battery but if you don't have lights and keep it on a battery tender the tractor will run for years like that.

TOH

This post was edited by TheOldHokie on 06/15/2021 at 07:04 am.

 
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Abbby
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:54 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If it isn't broke don't fix it.
 
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mr.precision
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:29 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I do have 12v to the coil, but don't know if the coil is 12v or 6v. Need to clean the crud off the coil and see if there are any markings.
Obviously if there is 6v coil in place, I'll need to put a ballast resistor in the circuit or the points will burn up. Easy to do if that's the case.
Thanks TOH.
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:43 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

mr.precision wrote:
(quoted from post at 19:29:46 06/15/21) I do have 12v to the coil, but don't know if the coil is 12v or 6v. Need to clean the crud off the coil and see if there are any markings.
Obviously if there is 6v coil in place, I'll need to put a ballast resistor in the circuit or the points will burn up. Easy to do if that's the case.
Thanks TOH.
Should already be a ballast resistor on the "3 terminal" terminal block. You will have 12v to the coil when points are open. No current flow, no voltage drop!
 
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HCooke
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:51 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I agree the TOH. Run it for a while and see what happens.
 
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Jim L WA
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:29 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I know you said everything else is original, but just for grins, measure the voltage coming out of the generator while it's running.
 
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R Geiger
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:52 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Jim L WA wrote:
(quoted from post at 10:29:20 06/16/21) I know you said everything else is original, but just for grins, measure the voltage coming out of the generator while it's running.
Ya, I was wondering the same. If it has been working ok for him, probably a 12 volt generator. Pictures would have been good!
 
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TheOldHokie
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 10:50 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Jim L WA wrote:
(quoted from post at 12:29:20 06/16/21) I know you said everything else is original, but just for grins, measure the voltage coming out of the generator while it's running.


Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants Wink

TOH
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 12:55 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 14:50:48 06/16/21)
Jim L WA wrote:
(quoted from post at 12:29:20 06/16/21) I know you said everything else is original, but just for grins, measure the voltage coming out of the generator while it's running.


Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants Wink

TOH
I have an old 3 brush 9N generator, driven with old washing machine motor, connected to nothing other than a voltmeter, it will put out 17 volts! I am wondering what happens & how long before something fries if the gen is actually 6v with good regulator. Seems to me that as engine speed goes up and gen arm voltage reached ~7.2v, then cut out closes and now reg & gen sees 12v and says to self or each other, "either over current or over voltage" and cuts field power...and the cycle repeats as fast as it can. ??
 
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TheOldHokie
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:15 pm    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

JMOR wrote:
(quoted from post at 16:55:08 06/16/21)
TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 14:50:48 06/16/21)
Jim L WA wrote:
(quoted from post at 12:29:20 06/16/21) I know you said everything else is original, but just for grins, measure the voltage coming out of the generator while it's running.


Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants Wink

TOH
I have an old 3 brush 9N generator, driven with old washing machine motor, connected to nothing other than a voltmeter, it will put out 17 volts! I am wondering what happens & how long before something fries if the gen is actually 6v with good regulator. Seems to me that as engine speed goes up and gen arm voltage reached ~7.2v, then cut out closes and now reg & gen sees 12v and says to self or each other, "either over current or over voltage" and cuts field power...and the cycle repeats as fast as it can. ??

Think that would be in the audible frequency range for humans or do we need to bring in the dogs Rolling Eyes

TOH
 
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JMOR
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:42 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 20:15:16 06/16/21)
JMOR wrote:
(quoted from post at 16:55:08 06/16/21)
TheOldHokie wrote:
(quoted from post at 14:50:48 06/16/21)
Jim L WA wrote:
(quoted from post at 12:29:20 06/16/21) I know you said everything else is original, but just for grins, measure the voltage coming out of the generator while it's running.


Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants Wink

TOH
I have an old 3 brush 9N generator, driven with old washing machine motor, connected to nothing other than a voltmeter, it will put out 17 volts! I am wondering what happens & how long before something fries if the gen is actually 6v with good regulator. Seems to me that as engine speed goes up and gen arm voltage reached ~7.2v, then cut out closes and now reg & gen sees 12v and says to self or each other, "either over current or over voltage" and cuts field power...and the cycle repeats as fast as it can. ??

Think that would be in the audible frequency range for humans or do we need to bring in the dogs Rolling Eyes

TOH
A person with a h___ of a lot better hearing than me can probably hear it. By using an old transistor radio earphone & holding the shaft (ground/ring) part in fingers and touching one of 3 VR terminals with tip, I can hear the field contacts opening/closing. It is below 60HZ and I estimate ~20 to 45 cycles/second. Hz to to yung'uns.
 
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mr.precision
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:13 am    Post subject: Re: 8N with 12volt battery - all else original Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Hood is off.... gas tank full of rust. So I can't run it right now and check the generator output.
Here's pictures of the generator and the terminal block, which has the original ballast resistor. I still don't know if the coil is 12v or 6v.





 
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