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IH 140 electrical system


 
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dhenley
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PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2021 9:43 am    Post subject: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I have an IH 140 with serial number 33039. I believe it has an original 12 volt negative ground electrical system. I noticed that ammeter shows discharging with tractor running. Have had generator rebuilt and replaced voltage regulator. Ammeter still shows discharging and tractor dies when battery ground cable is removed. Can anyone confirm that it is a 12 volt negative ground system? Does anyone have an easy to understand wiring diagram for that 12 volt negative ground system (if that is indeed what the tractor has on it)? Lastly, can anybody provide any information on what is needed to mount an alternator on it instead of a generator (such as where to buy bracket(s) and alternator and possibly an easy to understand wiring diagram for an alternator)? Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks
 
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D7fever
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PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2021 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I think that the 12 volt systems from the factory were negative ground.
 
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Janicholson
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PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2021 12:09 pm    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The charging problem may be as simple as polarizing the generator. The system was originally 12v negative ground. with your
serial number. With the tractor OFF, and the Ignition OFF, use a piece of solid copper (house wire) to jump from the BAT
terminal on the regulator to the GEN (or ARM) terminal on the regulator. a spark will happen but not dangerous. Hold for
one second, then take the jumper off. This causes the field to be energized, magnetizing the iron field poles. If it now
charges all is well. If it does not, with it running at 1/2 throttle, put a jumper from the F terminal on the generator to
ground. If it now charges the regulator (or regulator ground is bad. If you still need to convert, let us know. Jim
 
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used red MN
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PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2021 1:21 pm    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

dhenley, welcome to YT! Here is a diagram look at the
F140 section, see link. I agree with trying to polarize the
system. However, if your first name is Don we need a video
of you singing and driving your tractor! ; > )
Wiring diagram

 
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dhenley
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PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2021 3:35 pm    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Actually. my name is Don Henley. But I'm not that Don Henley. You really don't want to hear me singing on or off of my tractor. I will try to polarize generator tomorrow and then get back with y'all if that doesn't fix it.
 
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BarnyardEngineering
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PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2021 6:02 am    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Google Bob M's wiring diagrams. The 6V generator/regulator wiring is the same as your 12V. Also the diagrams for 12V alternator conversions are the same, except you don't have to swap the wires on the ammeter, it's already negative ground.

Also google John T's generator troubleshooting procedure. It applies to any generator/regulator setup.

The issue may be as simple as a bad ground. Clean all contact surfaces from the generator back to the engine block. Even take the mounting bracket off the block and shine that interface up too.
 
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dhenley
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PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2021 8:05 am    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I polarized the generator as per instructions. Ammeter still shows discharging with tractor running (and discharging even more when headlights are turned on). I then ran a piece of heavy wire from F post on generator to the battery ground terminal with tractor running at half throttle. Nothing changed as ammeter still shows "same amount" of discharging while running. Any idea of what to try or where to look next?

Thanks
 
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dhenley
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PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2021 8:12 am    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I found the information from John T, but cannot find the information from Bob M.
 
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Jim Becker
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PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2021 8:17 am    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Have you tried jumping from the regulator "GEN" to the regulator "BAT" with the engine running? If that makes it charge, you have a bad regulator. (possible even with a new one).

Do you have an analog voltmeter (multimeter)? Check battery voltage with engine off. Start it up and check voltage at battery. If the voltage increases, it is charging but wired incorrectly.

With the engine running, check voltage at generator "A". If less than battery reading from above, generator problem. Other wise, check voltage at regulator "GEN", then regulator "BAT", then at ammeter. Wherever the voltage changes, you have just isolated the problem.
 
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Janicholson
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PostPosted: Fri May 28, 2021 10:08 am    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

This seems to work Jim
Diagrams found

 
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dhenley
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:39 pm    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote


I tried running a jumper wire from Gen to Bat (across the regulator), but I couldn't see the ammeter gauge from where I was positioned as it was kind of hard to access the Gen post of the voltage regulator (it is positioned on the back side of the regulator). My 15 years old son was looking at it and said the needle jumped from discharging to "a little bit above the center line (charging) and was flickering". Like I say, I didn't see it first hand.

I then check battery voltage with tractor not running and it was about "1/4 of 50 volts". When I started the tractor and checked the battery, it still read the same - did not show to be charging.

I tried to check voltage at generator A, but I don't know if I did it right. I think A on the generator is the outside post (farthest away from the motor). I put the red lead on it and the black lead on the negative battery post. Is that the right way to to do it? When I did that, the multimeter remained at "Zero". I could not safely check voltage at Gen on voltage regulator as the Gen post is on the back side of the voltage regulator. I checked voltage at Bat post of voltage regulator and it appeared to be about "1/4 of 50 volts". I did not test at ammeter as it was getting dark outside.

Does any of this information make any sense as to what might be going on?

Thanks!
 
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Jim Becker
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2021 7:05 pm    Post subject: Re: IH 140 electrical system Reply to specific post Reply with quote

It appears to have started charging with a jumper from the regulator BATT to the regulator GEN. If so, you either have a bad regulator or a bad connection at the regulator (probably the ground). Remember when dealing with bad grounds that paint causes as much trouble as rust.
 
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