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Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from rear


 
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RonON
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:44 pm    Post subject: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from rear Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I am currently getting ready to separate the engine from the rear of a TEA 2085. Have most things disconnected but have a couple of questions. First, I have not yet disconnected either the drag link (steering) rods or the radius rods from the rear. I am going to disconnect the radius rods at the footrest by unclamping them and hoping that they come loose when I pull the 2 parts from each other. I need new rubber boots on the steering linkage and would like to remove the drag link along with the rear drag link end so that I can replace the rubber boots. How do I remove these and how do I separate the ball joint so that I can replace the rubber? I have removed most of the things (choke linkage, wiring, carb & breather hoses and pipes, oil pressure gauge pipe, starter, rear of the fuel tank etc) to allow separation. However, I am a bit confused about the throttle linkage. The instructions that I have are to remove the linkage at the front above the generator by slakening off the clamp and remove the vertical rod to the govenor, completely remove the clamp and remove the vertical rod to the govenor, completely remove the clamp from the long throttle shaft and make sure that the long rod is clean so it will slide out at the thermostat housing without sticking. This has me a bit confused. What clamps need to be loosened and which removed? How does this rod come out of the thermostat housing - I am not sure where the thermostat housing comes into this procedure. Does the rod come off completely or does it just slide away from the front of the engine still attached to the rear during the separation? Does anyone have any pics with an explanation so that I can visualize this procedure more clearly? Thanks for any help here, Ron
 
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Bruce(OR)
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 7:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The rod I believe, is held in place by a "U" bolt affair. Loosen it up is a beginning. As for the drag links and such, a large hammer is called for and striking the joint and not the threads. Loosen the nuts and do not remove to protect the threads.
It is a tapered fit and you are going to exert pressure on the taper with blunt force trama and pop the joint apart.
 
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Steve@Advance
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 7:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote

As for the tie rods, to get them loose, take the nut off, clean up the threads, put the nut back on but leave it backed off. Be sure it turns freely on the threads.

Get 2 big hammers, or one hammer and a back up steel block. Hold the back up tightly against one side of the eye in the end of the pittman arm where the tie rod stud passes through. Hit the other side sharply with the hammer. The shock should pop the taper out. Leaving the nut on but loose protects the threads and keeps the tie rod from falling when it comes loose.

As for the throttle linkage, there's only 1 clamp I recall seeing, a U bolt. Be warned, if you loosen the U bolt, the governor speed will need to be readjusted. If the governor is working and the speed is properly set, you may want to try to mark the position so you can get it back as close as possible. Just remove the U bolt and the compensating spring and bracket, disconnect the vertical rod from the U bolt bracket. The shaft will stay attached to the dash linkage, and pull out the hole in the thermostat housing bracket.
Linkage Detail

 
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Charles in Aus.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote


Unfastening the ball joints at the steering box end is probably the easiest leaving the nut on the end as Steve suggests .
One thing I would do is place a sheet of steel plate behind the joint to protect the alloy housing behind . This way if it does let go after a big belt it won't continue on its way and punch a new hole .



This had happened to a tractor I saw once , the new owner asked me if it might have had a Sherman or Hupp transmission fitted in the past Smile
 
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RonON
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 4:27 am    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Thanks for the help guys. As I understand your suggestions the following will work,
1. Ball joints: I need to loosen the nut holding the ball in place on the steering arm and hit the outside of the joint with a hammer backed with a steel block to loosen the ball out of the joint. Where exactly do I strike the joint? Do I put the metal block on one side of the outside of the joint & hit the other side with the hammer to loosen the joint?
2. For the throttle linkage, mark it's position as accurately as possible, loosen the U-clamp, remove the U-clamp, spring & bracket and disconnect the vertical rod from the bracket which will allow the rod to be pulled out when the tractor is being separated. I think that I can visualize this.
3. My plan to just loosen the clamps on the radius rods and allow them to disconnect during the separation is the right approach.

The separation is to replace the rear crank seal and possibly the transmission input seal if needed since I have oil leaking out of the bell housing. To do this, do the engine sump and the hydraulic pump/transmission sump need to be emptied before replacing the seals? When separated what tell-tale evidence is there that a seal is leaking. I ask this since I think that I can see the crank seal evidence with oil dripping from this area after removing the flywheel, clutch etc. but how do I tell if the transmission input seal is leaking? Any other things that I should look at when I'm in there? Thanks, Ron.
 
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RonON
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 6:23 am    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I was just thinking about the ball joints on the steering (radius) rods and wondered why I need to separate the ball joint. Why can't I just take the nut off of the end and remove & replace the rubber boots, do the seal repairs tah need doing after separation and then put the joint back in by replacing the nut? Why do I need to take apart the ball joint to do this? Am I missing something? Let me know if I am! Ron
 
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Steve@Advance
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2018 7:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote

1. On the ball joints (tie rod ends) you don't take the ball out of the socket, that is crimped in at the factory and is not removable! What you remove is the tapered shank from the pittman arm. Hit only on each side of the hole in the pittman arm. The shock will pop the tapered shank out of the hole. Once the tie rod is off the pittman arm, the rubber cap will just pull off, the new one push on.

2. Yes that is correct.

3. Yes, loosen or remove the clamps, whatever is easiest.

As for draining the oils, no, the level of both is below where you will be working.

I'm not sure on the rear main seal, if that can be changed without removing the pan. If the pan comes off, then obviously the oil will need to be drained.

The transmission seal, you are right there, might as well assume a seal that old is in need of replacement.

As for everything else in there, if in doubt, replace it. The clutch disc should have spiral grooves still visible on the surface. If worn flat or near the rivets, it's time to replace it. Since there was oil leaking, good assumption the clutch disc in oil soaked. If so best to replace it. Look the pressure plate over, if discolored hot spots on the face, worn tips on the release fingers, or if it was jumping when feathering the clutch, it needs to be replaced. (When loosening or replacing the pressure plate bolts, the pressure plate bolts must be removed and replaced evenly, otherwise the plate will be warped.) Check the pilot bearing/bushing for wear, damage. Feel the release bearing for roughness. Check the flywheel surface for hot spots, crazing, and heat checking. If needed it can be resurfaced. Typically when a clutch is replaced, it is done as a complete package, clutch plate, pressure plate, pilot bearing, and release bearing. Look the starter ring gear for worn teeth, be sure it is pressed fully on the flywheel against the stop flange.

One other thing, it is highly recommended to use an alignment tool when assembling the clutch. This centers the disc with the pilot bearing. If it is not centered, it will be extremely difficult to stab the engine back on the input shaft. This can be a difficult job under the best of conditions. If there is a misalignment it is easy to damage a new clutch by forcing it together or letting the weight of the engine hang by the clutch. NEVER force the engine back with bolts! When it's right, it will seat fully against the bell housing without force.
 
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RonON
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:42 am    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Steve and others, I have most everthing done to separate except for the clutch housing bolts and the radius arms. Do the radius arms just pull out or does the bracket that holds the foot platform etc need to be removed before the radius rods can be pulled out or do they just come out of the housings when the engine is separated from the rear end? Thanks Charles for the tip about the metal plate behind the tapered joint, I'm not sure that it saved the alloy housing but I didn't hurt anything so it was worth doing this just for peace of mind. It took a number of good wacks, both on the sides of the pittman arm but also on the front surface, luckily I didn't break anything here! I have small leaks around the upper part of the arms from the steering box and wondered if these seals can be replaced easily without taking the steering box apart? I'm sure that the clutch, pressure plate etc. will need replacing. My starter gear is a bit worn as seen in the attached picture. I have never had an issue starting this tractor and assume that this wear is from accidentally engaging the starter when changing gears. What is the verdict on this gear? replace or not replace starter. Note that I am trying to do this on a budget and I can change the starter out long after the other work is completed if needed. In a different area, my battery has overflowed so I have some acid drips coming from the battery carrier down the clutch housing. Is this because the voltage regulator is malfunctioning or not set correctly? Can it be adjusted afterwards. I am assuming after I get the seals etc replaced and the tractor running again, I can put a volt meter on this and check the voltage to the battery. I am assuming it should be around 14.5 V. If it is higher can the voltage regulator be adjusted and how do you do this? I'm doing this in my spare time so it may take me a week or so longer so be patient with me and check back for more questions. Thanks again, Ron

 
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Charles in Aus.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:42 am    Post subject: Re: Questions about separating TEA 2085 front (engine) from Reply to specific post Reply with quote


No replacement starter you can buy will be a patch on what the original is , there is no doubt that it is worn though . The offending part is sometimes available as a spare by itself , a Triumph motor car spares supplier might have one , try Rimmer Brothers in the UK ,

https://rimmerbros.com/ItemSearch--search-Starter-Motor--srcin-1

You can change the steering drop arm seals without removing the gear box , see here ,

http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/viewtopic.php?t=1370408

But to do so you have to file off the lugs on the corners of the arms so the new seal can slide over . I did this and now regret it , seeing that you have to split the tractor it isn't too much more work to take off the box , clean out the bottom and do the the job properly .
 
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