Yesterday's Tractor Co.
Shop Now View Cart
   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 9N,2N,8N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   Traditional YT Forum ViewClassic View   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile    Log inLog in 

never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE


 
Post new topic    
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:03 am    Post subject: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Did My Sunday morning tour looking over the animals and crops ,fences.. got back to the barn and
the 430 went " click " and began rolling backwards down the grade ? , tried the Hand clutch ,no
difference ? No Change in the 3 pt ,It lifts just fine ? Tried All ranges they shifted easily with
little grind even with foot clutch not being depressed, the engine clutch flywheel makes its
normal sounds when engaged and disengaged ,,..i wonder if the main shaft snapped in the
transmission that carrys the power to the rear wheels beyond the triple range,.. btw ,.. this 430
has probably plowed to the moon and back 3 times in its lifetime
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 6:45 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

CVPost-olgentdc wrote:
(quoted from post at 15:03:48 06/28/20) Did My Sunday morning tour looking over the animals and crops ,fences.. got back to the barn and
the 430 went " click " and began rolling backwards down the grade ? , tried the Hand clutch ,no
difference ? No Change in the 3 pt ,It lifts just fine ? Tried All ranges they shifted easily with
little grind even with foot clutch not being depressed, the engine clutch flywheel makes its
normal sounds when engaged and disengaged ,,..i wonder if the main shaft snapped in the
transmission that carrys the power to the rear wheels beyond the triple range,.. btw ,.. this 430
has probably plowed to the moon and back 3 times in its lifetime


Does the PTO run?

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:00 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Yes Joe ,It Does turn with the engine running and there is no slippage with engine off trying to
crank engine thru
PTO.
the trouble must be in the triple range pack I am thinking ?. No doubt ,This will require tractor
split ,,.. will that be at bellhousing ? or right before 4speed gearbox ?
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:24 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Well as am sure you know the main drive shaft runs directly from the engine clutch friction plate to the PTO, the hand clutch for power to the transmission via the triple range gear train is PTO off the main drive shaft.

The fact that the triple range shifts w/o grinding with the engine clutch & hand clutch engaged points to no output from the hand clutch although we know that the hand clutch has input from the main drive shaft as the pto runs normal. The hydraulic pump drives off a separate shaft that is splined to the pressure plate which is bolted to the flywheel so it is not a consideration here.

That is just how I read your post although I may be missing something.

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:29 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

You Have described the condition very well Joe .. Now How can I Fix It ?
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:35 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I missed that last, if necessary the split to remove the triple range or hand clutch would occur in front of the transmission.

I think I would drain the torque tube and get a good look at the hand clutch see if it engaging properly and to the input gear to the triple range gear train.

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:37 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I did notice a very slight rear ward drag when initialy shifted to reverse but it would not continue backwards .All The Gears can be shifted freely as if a clutch were disengaged .
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:43 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The Clutch pack feels normal when engaging and disengaging It has the Same snap as before .i dont think the half moon key is sheared off from the hand clutch. i fear a sheared off clutch pack basket " excuse my term"
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:14 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

CVPost-olgentdc wrote:
(quoted from post at 17:43:26 06/28/20) The Clutch pack feels normal when engaging and disengaging It has the Same snap as before .i dont think the half moon key is sheared off from the hand clutch. i fear a sheared off clutch pack basket " excuse my term"


Maybe jack up a rear wheel and see what turns as engaging in turn going forward to the hand clutch.

Also a magnet check of the torque tube bottom might turn up a clue.

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:20 pm    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Good idea , Joe , Been visiting family today . one Idea came forward same as yours , Perhaps the
Differential gear failed ?? 1st thing monday,i will remove triple range cover and see if i can
detect any failure there , if all OK then i will jack up both wheels to see if the other moves
opposite direction when i spin the other . That Will prove a Broken Spider gear which has occurred
on My Dads 430 about 1983. Sara and I Sure Do appreciate You stepping up with all your caring
thoughts . BTW , This 430 has a working traction lock pedal . just as a afterthought I will try
engaging that . But Dont know what I could discern after the test result.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 10:29 am    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Well ..the hub the hand clutch plates work in has come loose from the shaft,. Dont Look To
serious
If I can pull off the hydraulic pump and replace a woodruff Key that would be great . If Not? It
Looks like I am Gonna have to split this little fella apart. Any Ideas and Thoughts are
Appreciated.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:25 pm    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

[quote="CVPost-olgentdc"](quoted from post at 19:29:56 06/29/20) Well ..the hub the hand clutch plates work in has come loose from the shaft,. Dont Look To
serious
If I can pull off the hydraulic pump and replace a woodruff Key that would be great . If Not? It
Looks like I am Gonna have to split this little fella apart. An

I haven't found the hand clutch on the Caseih parts site, is it there? Do you have a 430 manual that shows how the hand clutch is mounted. I don't see how the hub can be loose if neither the main shaft or the PTO shaft is not broken but we have normal PTO rotation right? The hub turns on a brass bushing when disengaged while the transmission drive part of the cub is stationary. I suppose that bushing could be totally wiped out but then the hub has some support by the main shaft bearing pretty close in front of the hub.

I don't know that this will apply to your 430, so keep that in mind. The rest of this is hand clutch in 300,300B & some but not all x00B tractors. There is nothing you can do to the clutch hub on the pump side of the torque tube, there is no woodruff key or any other fastener. The hub is female splined and just slides on the male splined main drive shaft. The clutch has to be removed and then the hub just slides back off the main shaft if it didn't come off with the rest of the clutch.

Again this is the description of the hand clutch in 300,300B & some but not all x00B tractors, 430 may be different. I have a hand clutch off a x00B tractor, I can it take apart and get some pics if it will help.

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:33 pm    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I screwed up this sentence.

The hub turns on a brass bushing when disengaged while the transmission drive part of the cub is stationary.

Should read: The hub turns on a brass bushing when disengaged while the transmission drive part of the clutch is stationary.

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
olgentdc
Tractor Guru


Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 4094


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Thank You Joe ,,. I have studied your post last week about the 300 hand clutch , the
430 should be the same animal ,. no need to dig deeper until i post again with more
findings. I will post a update.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe (Wa)
Tractor Expert


Joined: 01 Jan 1999
Posts: 2783


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:13 pm    Post subject: Re: never had this happen to a 430 BEFORE Reply to specific post Reply with quote

CVPost-olgentdc wrote:
(quoted from post at 04:38:38 06/30/20) Thank You Joe ,,. I have studied your post last week about the 300 hand clutch , the
430 should be the same animal ,. no need to dig deeper until i post again with more
findings. I will post a update.


Ok, if it is the same clutch, which I believe it is, there is nothing you can do with it on the pump side of the torque tube. It's a pretty hefty lift to pull all the removals to get the pump out also.

Joe
 
Back to top
View user's profile
:   
Post new topic    Yesterday's Tractors Forum Index -> Case and David Brown All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  

TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

YT Home  |  Forums

Modern View Forum powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters