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871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo


 
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WaltB
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:23 pm    Post subject: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Hi everyone. I have an 871 that has been repainted. The serial number is ground off and there is another number on the right side in the same place as the normal one. I believe it is 7896. You can see the paint through the repainted colors. The tractor is in pretty good shape. The tranny is gold under the paint. Not red. My Dad bought an 871 and an 841 with a finish mower from a neighbor. He paid 2500.00 for all three. The finish mower was an almost new Case. Basically he got the tractors for free. The 841 runs great but is stuck in high on the combo with other smaller issues. The 871, he gave to me, did run but smoked like coal fire when running. It seemed as if it was struggling against itself. I bought gauges and tested the circuits. It seemed like a normal deal and I adjusted the bands. I opened the top cover and the cable was pretty bad. I also noticed a wear hole in the filter. The big problem was that in the bottom of the tranny I found a large snap ring. I assume for the back of the gear set. Things got busy and I just put the thing back together and put it in the shed. My Dad died and I bought the 841 from his estate thinking I could make a good tractor from both. Can anyone offer any guidance on this? I kind of hate to tear up the 871. Other than the problems I listed, it is pretty nice. I have the new cable, new filters and it had one new rear tire with both front tires being new. Dad put a new pair of rear tires on the 841 before he died. I have service manuals for both and have pretty good abilities but would love to use some of your knowledge to point me in the right direction.

So:
Is the 871 something I should fix and leave alone? I cannot afford 3000 buck plus parts to take it to an experienced SOS person. It almost looks like the tractor was used as a trainer or class project for a school.
I assume it needs split and the snap ring put back on.

Is the 841 sounding like I have to split it to find the culprit on the combo not wanting to move? Should I thread lock the bolt and wiggle it to see if it will shift. The shift lever loosens up almost immediately when you tighten it and try to shift it. You just cannot get it to hold.

I have read a lot of threads and respect your advice and tutoring. Thanks, Walt B
 
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agjim
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:51 pm    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Show us a pic of the snap ring
 
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Larry NCKS
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote


Your SOS transmission is a factory reman. Many of those early transmissions were sent back for upgrades. Some were replaced with later DDC transmissions. Yours, obviously, was originally part of a gold demo tractor before it was rebuilt.

As these transmissions were replaced, the dealer was supposed to re-stamp the tractor's serial number on the left and stamp that number on the right as well. Or the right one could have been stamped at factory for an S/N record of the remanned transmissions. Obviously yours got the right side number, but not the left. Perhaps someone else knows what the purpose of the right side number was. Other than my guesses above, I do not.

As to the snap ring, without a picture it's hard to tell where it came from. My guess, however, would be that a rear split and tear down of the components that are removed from the rear would reveal its location. Sounds like it could be a clutch pack snap ring. If it happens to be PTO clutch, that's a complete transmission disassembly.

As to the Sherman, which is what it sounds like you're talking about on the 841, someone else will need to answer those questions.
 
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Kirk-NJ
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:41 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Unless you are trying to save the SOS just because it was your Dad?s
tractor, with the problems with the trans and it smoking you will spend
more than the tractor is worth. The right side number was recall
tracking number. Because your trans has ground off number it?s likely
that it was taken off a gold demo and a replacement was put on the
gold demo with the restamped numbers. Just because your tractor
has a little gold on the trans does not make the whole tractor a gold
demo. Even if you found a 5 speed to swap in the motor will still need
work. I would sell it or switch the best parts off it into the 841 and part
the Sos tractor out
The Sherman combo handle was held in place with a lock washer
and Allen head bolt. You can try as you said to tighten bolt and try to
move. It?s likely you wit have to split the tractor and pull the Sherman
for repair. It is possible to pop the steering box off and pull the top
cover to make repair, I have done this only once and it?s a fight to get
it out of the steering box hole and back in, with trying to keep the
forks lined up it?s worse. A split is easier IMO
 
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Ultradog MN
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 1:10 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I agree with Kirk.
Take the best of both tractors and make
one good one out of the 841. You
wouldn't have a lot of $ in it and maybe
have some parts to sell.
 
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Larry NCKS
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:19 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote


871 smoking black, provided it's a gasoline engine, is a carburetion or plugged air filter issue. Should be a fairly easy fix.

If the transmission works, other than the dropped snap ring, that should be a fairly inexpensive fix as well.

Contrary to the others, I'd want to find the fix to the SOS before condemning it as totally unreasonable.

If you were close to me, I'd sure take a look at the 871 for you! That look would not cost you anywhere near $3000.00
 
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WaltB
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:44 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Larry NCKS wrote:
(quoted from post at 05:19:01 09/16/19)
871 smoking black, provided it's a gasoline engine, is a carburetion or plugged air filter issue. Should be a fairly easy fix.

If the transmission works, other than the dropped snap ring, that should be a fairly inexpensive fix as well.

Contrary to the others, I'd want to find the fix to the SOS before condemning it as totally unreasonable.

If you were close to me, I'd sure take a look at the 871 for you! That look would not cost you anywhere near $3000.00



I am new to this so I hope this reply shows up as just that and not just an addition to the last comment. That said, I live in the southwest corner of Iowa. I should have said that the whole tractor has paint peeling and the gold is coming through. It is every where that they did not do a good job of prepping it for paint. I think I will try to keep them both fixed up, I just hate splitting them. Even if I take notes and pics, I still worry I will not get it right. I will take some pics of the 871 today and post them. The farmer that had them was the type that would rather put them in the ditch than sell them. I do not think he had any idea what he had. The 841 was on the finish mower and the 871 just sat outside. With it burning oil so bad he did not use it. It runs good oil pressure and has no knocking or even slight engine sounds so I think a sleeve kit would fix it. It seems to just be bad blow by. Thanks for your posts, please keep them coming. I will ad details and pics tonight.
 
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WayneIA
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:09 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

It sounds like you have a original gold demonstrator tractor that Ford used to promote the S-O-S. They seem to be of considerably more value to some .I would give the old girl and oil change, your of oil. with a quart of ATF in the engine and run it 15 or 20 hours or so. It won't hurt and it might help the smoking. And it has been over fifty years since I have been in a SOS so am almost lost in that situation. Our common dominator is Iowa although I am 200 miles from you by Williamsburg.
 
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Larry NCKS
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:06 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

WaltB wrote:
(quoted from post at 08:44:20 09/16/19) That said, I live in the southwest corner of Iowa.


I'm 120 miles due west of St. Joe, so likely not more than 170 miles from you . . . if you can get across the river.

If you're showing gold paint everywhere, you likely do have a gold demo.
 
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WaltB
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:44 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote


Well here goes with photos. Somehow I deleted them all at the first try. I resized them so I hope they go well.














 
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Kirk-NJ
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:30 pm    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Ok since there is more than the trans that has gold paint on it some
further research would be required . Letters/numbers on the top of
radiator engine block, transmission rear center housing All should
have dates within the first three months of 1959. Unless you can get
the numbers from the trans for serial numbers I don?t think it will be
worth much more than a standard SOS with bad trans.. I had a gold
demo with trans exchange program tranny for $1500. It ran and drove
and needed minor band adjustments. With the trans exchange switch
I had no buyers. After months went by I finally switched it over to a 5
speedi
 
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WaltB
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:56 pm    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Okay, I looked for numbers on the block. I found some casting numbers that were in the shape of a circle. 8571 with the 5 on top. The rest look like part numbers but if you can get me closer, I will look more. On the radiator there are 2 tags. One of the tags says Hamilton Radiator 2831, and one says: 01596 and Quinn Radiator. I believe the stamped part in the top is the one we are looking for. It says NDA-B, L, 1 59. I could not locate anything on the transmission rear center housing. It is dark and I am using a light but could not locate only things that were casting numbers. Can you tell me a little closer areas for the block and tranny? Thank you for your help.
 
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WaltB
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:17 am    Post subject: Re: 871 Gold Demonstrator/ 841 stuck in high on the combo Reply to specific post Reply with quote

I will try to look up the snap ring for a pic today. If the rain stops...? Also, it was said to look for serial numbers on the top of the engine block and tranny. What would the numbers look like? Are they stamped in? I hate to seem dumb but can someone tell me pretty close to where the other numbers would be. The tractor is so nice, I hate to chop it up. I would rather someone else have it or try to fix her myself. I am not too worried about the engine problems, just the tranny. Thanks everyone for your help.
 
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