Yesterday's Tractor Co.
Shop Now View Cart
   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 9N,2N,8N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   Traditional YT Forum ViewClassic View   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile    Log inLog in 

1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life?

Goto page 1, 2  Next

 
Post new topic    
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Cloudaway
New User


Joined: 18 Mar 2020
Posts: 8


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:45 pm    Post subject: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Central PA.. I was told this caught fire at one point and was parked. Can anyone tell from looking at this, offer opinions. We may be talking about being parked in 1960. Near as I can tell it is around 1941 d7. There is a video on YouTube of one and it looks identical to me. Thanks for any insight.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Cloudaway
New User


Joined: 18 Mar 2020
Posts: 8


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:47 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote




 
Back to top
View user's profile
Cloudaway
New User


Joined: 18 Mar 2020
Posts: 8


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:48 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote




 
Back to top
View user's profile
Billy NY
Tractor Guru


Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 8418
Location: NY

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:43 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

It could, don't get me wrong, you'll be investing quite a bit of time and money. It would take me a while to respond about the many things you'll want to look at on this tractor in the idle state it's been in for how many years.

1st thing you'll want to do is see if the engine is stuck, see if it turns over by moving the fan, if the belts are still intact. I'm not sure what that has for a clutch housing cover if it is a 7M series, and where in there you could get a bar on it to turn it over, you need to get to where the starting engine pinion engages it.

On the crankshaft pulley or end facing the radiator, there is a way to fit a steel rod with a dowel through it to mate up with the nut on it. Using a pipe wrench or if you have a hexagonal or flat surface machined in, a wrench may work with a big cheater bar, but if you need that cheater, it's stuck. I have been through that on one of these that looks similar, still have it and another in much better shape.

Look on the engine towards the back, and or on the back of the tractor, left side, above the final drive housing, see if you can find a serial number, if 1941, it's a 7M series, next series up would be 3T, and 4T which was a gov't purchase order of 10,000 units. There are some 6T's out there too, bought for the US Navy, and even more scarce are 1T's that were armored.

The starting engine needs to be checked out, see if seized. You'll want to really look over the undercarriage, at a glance it is well worn, but my oldest one is just as worn, your pads look better and I see what looks like a loose pad on yours. If it is worn out, I hate to say it, might want to pass. I like these old tractors and it's a nice thought to see someone bring one back, but can be a money pit, or you may luck out. I'd also want to make sure the heads are not cracked on the engine. These are notorious for sitting and being brought back, but if the engine is seized, you'll need to do some work to free it up at minimum.

The dozer kit is not LeTourneau, at least the radiator guard and front mast, + overhead ridge beam for the power control unit, (cable winch - these are not towing winches either).

Hopefully it does not end up as scrap, they are a handy tractor even today if operational. There are more things to check, want to make sure the sprockets are tight to the shaft, and that the final drives are good, minus the seals, those may leak a little by now, the bellows seals in these.


I'm all for going for it, but realize that is a lot easier said than done LOL !

I can refer to my manuals if you do need help , but you'll want yourself a set of those for this tractor if you decide to embark on it. Serviceman's reference book, parts catalog, and operators instructions + whatever may be available for the power control unit, (cable winch for the blade)
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Cloudaway
New User


Joined: 18 Mar 2020
Posts: 8


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:12 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote


Thank you for the response. I looked in the front of the engine for just a moment the other day and I remember seeing slots on the front of the crankshaft where a bar could be inserted and turned. I don t remember seeing any belts, but I need to go back and take some more photos. This is sentimental to some extent, I am 37 now and I have played on it my entire life. I remember when I was a kid the slats over the roof were in much better shape. I probably slid the hood off who knows when.... I will get better pictures when I can as it s parked near my parents house. I live about 30 minutes from it, but it s out of the way of my normal drive. I really appreciate your response. Thank you.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Billy NY
Tractor Guru


Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 8418
Location: NY

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:46 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Anything to help, there are some resources out there like the antique caterpillar machinery owners club and similar, you can find parts for these and so on.

I would reset that hood and make sure the exhaust stack is covered, looks like it is now. On the right side, there is, towards the front, lower of the engine an hour meter, just flip up the cover if you are curious to see the hours on it. I don't see much evidence from what can be seen it caught fire, but I can't see the left side of the engine. There is a small gasoline fuel tank for the starting engine, unless it was converted to direct electric start.

These are considered pretty durable, well built machines, they have a dry type clutch, later ones had an oil bath type which last a lot longer, but both were of the "bullet proof" kind of reputation. I did see olive drab paint under the yellow, on the injector lines, no doubt it is likely a military or gov't purchased tractor. If that diesel is not seized up, you've got a good chance with a lot of up front work to see it will run. I would be checking this thing over thoroughly, hopefully no one vandalized it. The books on it will be very helpful.

You'll want to check out the fuel tanks, drain out water, starting engine fuel tanks often get a build up of coffee grind size rust and plug the carb screen, these like good fuel supply and hot spark, the magneto needs to be in good shape to fire that engine. Carb is easy to clean on these, old cast iron Zenith carburetor. This tractor holds lots of oil in various compartments, you'll likely have a lot of condensation water to contend with. Coolant system also holds quite a bit, hopefully nothing froze up in the water jackets and cracked those heads, that can happen on these and the heads might be not so easy to find today.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Eric in IL
Tractor Expert


Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Posts: 2126


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 8:20 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

You are anticipating an experience similar to a journey I started in 1990.

I was 30 at the time. I bought a 40 acre place to live that happened to have a D7 parked under a hickory tree. Of course I wanted it. I fabricated uses for it in my head so I could convince my wife we needed it. It was in better shape than the one in your pictures. It too had sentimental value to me. In early life it was military issue, then bought by our local school district to clear for a new football field. Then sold on auction again to a local farmer. So I bought it AND a 1940 something KB7 International semi with a Martin low-boy trailer. The truck ran but I did not want it. Sadly, the owner would only sell them as a package deal. I bit for 10,000 bucks.

So I started working on the Cat. The engine was loose so I tried to start the pony. It ran but poorly. I found the magneto was 180 degrees out of time. After that fix it ran good but I still step away when I rev it to full throttle because it sounds like it could throw a rod. I tried to start the diesel but nothing. Found the rack was stuck in the injection pump. That was an easy fix, it came to life.

I found that the oil cooler was leaking. I could not find a place that would fix the cooler. I did find a new cooler in California and it probably cost me more than the Cat was worth.

I serviced the tractor. It took the better of a week in my spare time after work.

YEE-HA now I get to use it !! It was fun, I was on cloud nine. I cut the dam on a small pond I wanted gone. Took all summer to get the muck out of the pond so I could fill it back in. I only got stuck once. Then I tried pushing some trees. What a surprise, those trees are pretty tough. They don't just push over if they are bigger than six inches.

I guess in looking back and looking at your situation, I would not do what you are thinking about. I wish I would have passed on the deal I did. Just be aware that if you go for it, you have a huge job ahead.

Think about it..... you're 37 now and haven't pulled the trigger yet. Are you trying to tell yourself something?
 
Back to top
View user's profile
RonSa
Regular


Joined: 01 Dec 2006
Posts: 102


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:27 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

It may have been mentioned already but I did not see any comments below about tracks.

That vintage of track link pins were not sealed and are very susceptible to serious rust seizure from setting for a long time. If so, it may not roll sufficiently to get it winched onto a truck. It might be costly to get the pins freed up.

Even so, I hope someone will take on the project of bringing your sentimental D7 back to life. We have an old D7 (3T?) in our family with the cable lift that still runs but rarely used.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
D7fever
Regular


Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 459


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:05 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If the engine and pony motor are not seized and the transmission and clutch housing are not full of water and frozen and cracked the housing, you have a good chance of getting it going. If you can get a good size machine or a couple of big tractors , you can tug it and maybe free up the tracks. I freed one up that had been sitting 30 years, tugged it with 2 good sized tractors, a little bit one way then a little the other way until it moved a track length Hopefully you have a cap on the fuel tank . that would save a lot of work, if there is a cap and fuel in the tank, you might have to treat the tank with biocide, but there are a lot of other things to consider before than. I have a 1944 4t D7 that runs and operates that I need to sell, located in MA.
good luck.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
RonSa
Regular


Joined: 01 Dec 2006
Posts: 102


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

If the crankshaft will turn any amount, I would suggest you don't turn it more that than a small amount about 5 degrees before you remove the valve covers and check for stuck valves. this might prevent the push rods or rocker arms from getting bent or busted.

Will the owner allow you to work on it where it is? If you have to buy it first, would you soon have to move it? I would think there would not be a problem with checking if the engine is stuck.

I think the track shoes are probably good enough to play with--- unless you want to work it hard.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Jim.ME
Tractor Expert


Joined: 02 Mar 2018
Posts: 2519


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2020 2:57 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Can't really tell from the pictures but it appears the radiator, fan and water pump are missing. If so, replacing those will add to the repair cost. Others have posted good points to consider.

Yes, it would be nice to bring it back to life. But think hard on undertaking this one, set the sentiment aside. It really won't be worth much, if any, more than now if you get part way through it and decide you can't finish. The money and time you put into it will be gone.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Cloudaway
New User


Joined: 18 Mar 2020
Posts: 8


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2020 5:19 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The dozer is accessible where It sits on my brother's property. I understand it may be a big undertaking. There is a good possibility it may sit for another 15 years until I retire. This forum is full of very knowledgeable people and I really appreciate the responses. From research I've seen several D7's and 8s listed on the web and on FB Marketplace in running condition and much better shape than ours for anywhere from 11k to 20k. I'm guessing that is what my cost would be to bring this back to life.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Billy NY
Tractor Guru


Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 8418
Location: NY

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2020 6:49 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

You won't really have an idea of how much $$ until you get into it. I would not let it sit that much longer, at least go and assess what you can, see where you'll need to start.

You can operate the compression release lever, that will open/close valves, can't recall if all, but when closed has to be enough given the timing, to get compression to fire the engine and run. I believe these are the pre-combustion chamber injectors, and there is a way to get penetration oil into the cylinders through them after removal if I recall. Never had to do that. Of course, if there is water on top of the pistons, won't do much good anyways.

At that point the heads will need to be removed to see what is seized, they are heavy, you'll need a way to hoist them. Don't do this and leave it that way, wait until you can follow through until it can be fully repaired.

I've got one in similar shape, believe it to be seized and I have not done much with it, but it's got sentimental value at minimum, at some point after I get the newer one operational again, I'll start dealing with it. This other one has just over 1000 original hours, it shows very little wear, track adjusters have never even been used. In the interim, I periodically turn the motor over by hand, check the cover on the stack and so on. The engine turns over with ease by pushing the fan blades. The starting engine, just use the hand crank to turn it over.

One thing to remember if you get this far, is that if you get the starting engine running, it shares the coolant system with the diesel and that diesel needs to spin to cool it. You can run in short periods, but don't over do it. Also, they are notorious or it's very possible to thin the starting engine crankcase oil with gasoline. I had it happen once, it overflowed the crankcase. Somehow through the carb. You'll always want to check the condition of that oil, make sure it's not thinned, or the motor will fail if you run it. The drain plugs in the bottom of the sumps are not so easy to get to. I have after cleaning all around the motor, the track, anywhere there is loose dirt or contaminants, removed the inspection cover and used a drill pump to suck out all the oil from each sump. This is also another way to see if the diesel is stuck, disengage the 2 speed transmission clutch, use care to engage it into low speed, they can grind if the clutch break is not working, then engage the clutch, see if it will kill the engine or it will spin the diesel. Compression lever must be all the way down, on "Off" which will allow the least resistance to turn the diesel. You need the operators instructions to read to understand the starting procedure correctly. Main transmission in neutral, Johnson bar ( Fwd/Rev.) lever in neutral, and master clutch all the way forward, though I think if engaged, trans is interlocked out, so it cannot engage, I prefer the master clutch to be disengaged to know the drive train is not connected.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
RonSa
Regular


Joined: 01 Dec 2006
Posts: 102


Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:53 am    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

The virus is giving me some cabin fever even though I am 81 years old and retired. I need to cut back on local travel to avoid the virus. I have some time to be boring!! LOL

I also have a sentimental attachment to old D7s. In the early 50s as a kid growing up, a contractor showed up in our farming neighborhood with his D7 about twice a year to do work in Ag fields. I always found time to "run a mile" and watch it work. Many years later, this early experience with the D7 had a major influence in causing me to choose Cat for my Engineering career.

I ask the operator one time how many hours it had on it? He said the hour meter broke turning over to 15,000 hours. In the early 50s, that was totally mindboggling to me!!! I thought he might be "yanking my chain" as we often said back in Kansas.

After he parked for the day, I went back and peaked at the hour meter---yup it was hung up turning over 15000. Having that many hours in the early 50s, it may have been an early 40s model.

The tractor not going anywhere, might this tractor be a suitable long-term "hobby" for you to tinker with? Hobbies often tend to take money out of the equation. I don't see this D7 as offering any return on investment. Could be a lot of satisfaction if you are so inclined.
 
Back to top
View user's profile
Billy NY
Tractor Guru


Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 8418
Location: NY

Report to Moderator

PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2020 1:30 pm    Post subject: Re: 1941 cat d7 can it be brought back to life? Reply to specific post Reply with quote

Cool story ! The older one of the 2 I own, a '44 model has 9999 hours or more, I'd have to look, and it has a different hour meter than the '45 does, which is glass covered and working. One of the neat stories about the '44 is that when we were literally snowed in from a massive storm, the town called upon my father to break a path on the state road, he plowed a couple of miles and the old rock cut about 1/4 mile west was filled in with snow pretty good. He punched through it, all the way to the city line, we were mostly rural around here then minus some houses built in the 30's. This was early 70's, 70 or 71. Nothing could get through, town or state had nothing available, or it was stuck already. I found the receipt, was 3 hours worth at $20/hour back then.

I just enjoy the sound of the naturally aspirated 4 cylinder D8800 engine under a load, straight pipe. They are not super powerful, I have spent time on modern D8's but they sure can still do a lot of work, and surely can push snow, I have cleared 36" or better with mine one winter, like it's not even there !
 
Back to top
View user's profile
:   
Post new topic    Yesterday's Tractors Forum Index -> Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders and Backhoes All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  

TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

YT Home  |  Forums

Modern View Forum powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters