3600 Ford tractor over heating

[ozawkiegold]

I have a 1976 Ford 3600 tractor that is overheating. I've flushed it, changed the thermostat, changed the radiator and changed the water pump. Can anyone tell me what I may have missed?

 

[super99]

Mechanical guage or electric? Electric sender units go bad.

 

[ozawkiegold]

It's an electric gauge but tractor starts to smoke if you don't get it shut down. Super hot!

 

[used red MN]

Hello oz.. welcome to YT! What is smoking, from where, what color of smoke? Grease or oil on the outside of the engine? What load and/or speed did you have the engine at when this is happening? You may have a leaking head gasket or a cracked head or possibly the block.

 

[ozawkiegold]

The smoke was coming from the side of the engine and the tractor was setting still idling. If have a leaking or cracked head gasket wouldn't you lose antifreeze? I'm not losing antifreeze and when I run the tractor with the radiator cap off and watch for bubbles I don't see any.

 

[used red MN]

The smoke was coming from the side of the engine and the tractor was setting still idling. If have a leaking or cracked head gasket wouldn't you lose antifreeze? I'm not losing antifreeze and when I run the tractor with the radiator cap off and watch for bubbles I don't see any.

I would agree, I would think it would be the coolant not staying in place to absorb the heat. Usually that means compression is the air or gas displacing the coolant. What did the coolant look like? Flushing included opening the block drain? And to turn over every stone, are youbsure the thermostat is in the correct way, thermal bulb towards the engine?

 

[wore out]

I have a 1976 Ford 3600 tractor that is overheating. I've flushed it, changed the thermostat, changed the radiator and changed the water pump. Can anyone tell me what I may have missed?

Gasoline or diesel?

Late ignition timing can cause an engine to run HOT and make for a much hotter than normal exhaust.

 

[ozawkiegold]

I would agree, I would think it would be the coolant not staying in place to absorb the heat. Usually that means compression is the air or gas displacing the coolant. What did the coolant look like? Flushing included opening the block drain? And to turn over every stone, are youbsure the thermostat is in the correct way, thermal bulb towards the engine?

The coolant looks good, no oil. It's been drained out twice and everything looks good with it. Thermostat is in the correct way and is new, bulb towards the engine. I even took it out and put in a pan of hot water to make sure it was opening all the way. I flushed it completely including opening the block drain. Used a flushing agent on it also.

 

[ozawkiegold]

Gasoline or diesel?

Late ignition timing can cause an engine to run HOT and make for a much hotter than normal exhaust.

This is a gas tractor. Haven't checked out the timing. That's one I haven't thought of. At this point willing to try anything.

 

[sotxbill]

when running... and radiator full... do you see bubbles of air coming out of the radiator??? Do you see the water flowing in the top of radiator? Is the core fins clean and you can see daylight through them? Have you run a compression test on each cyl to see if one is low,,, due to blown head gasket? Is the oil look whitish or milk shake color?

 

[Blackhole49]

I have a 1976 Ford 3600 tractor that is overheating. I've flushed it, changed the thermostat, changed the radiator and changed the water pump. Can anyone tell me what I may have missed?

Is this a new tractor with a problem or a new problem with a tractor you've owned for a while? Are you 1000% certain the radiator is 100% clear and you can see daylight though all the fin area? When you drained the radiator, was there any sign of rust or calcium in the top tank? Its interesting that I read on here about timing causing an overheating but have never read where someone posted that was there problem (BTW: not saying it can't happen). Very hard for timing to go off without extenuating circumstances.

 

[ozawkiegold]

when running... and radiator full... do you see bubbles of air coming out of the radiator??? Do you see the water flowing in the top of radiator? Is the core fins clean and you can see daylight through them? Have you run a compression test on each cyl to see if one is low,,, due to blown head gasket? Is the oil look whitish or milk shake color?

Checked for bubble with tractor running, saw no bubbles and water is flowing. New radiator, new water pump, new thermostat and the oil is clean. Have not run a compression test. When I start the tractor it runs smooth for 5 to 10 minutes with a clear exhaust and then starts to overheat.

 

[ozawkiegold]

Is this a new tractor with a problem or a new problem with a tractor you've owned for a while? Are you 1000% certain the radiator is 100% clear and you can see daylight though all the fin area? When you drained the radiator, was there any sign of rust or calcium in the top tank? Its interesting that I read on here about timing causing an overheating but have never read where someone posted that was there problem (BTW: not saying it can't happen). Very hard for timing to go off without extenuating circumstances.

I also read about timing causing over heating but I would thing the tractor would run rough, runs smooth. New radiator, nothing changed with it.

 

[used red MN]

I also read about timing causing over heating but I would thing the tractor would run rough, runs smooth. New radiator, nothing changed with it.

You apparently didn’t think bh49s question about new/old problem, was worthy of an answer. Give more details about the tractor and when how this problem presented itself. Timing can be a factor adding to an overheating problem but in this case since the tractor is just idling I doubt this is your problem. In my opinion the timing could be as far out of wack as possible to where it would still run, but at an idle doing no work the cooling system should be adequate to cool the engine. I am wondering if it could be possible some odd thing has happened in the cooling jacket of the engine? I am proposing maybe some thin casting flash broke away and is obstructing the passage for coolant to flow out of the water pump into the block. (see photo is this how your engine is configured?) Maybe a foil seal off the top of an antifreeze jug is in there blocking this? This doesn’t explain why you can still see circulation. Still have your old water pump? Show a photo of it, impeller side.
I would add on your check for bubbles I would suggest over filling the radiator so the coolant is right up at the top in the radiator neck. Take the fan belt off and start it and then check for bubbles. After the tractor has sat all night loosen the oil drain plug until it drips see if any coolant has collected in the bottom of the oil pan.
You have hit the high level diagnosis on this, now it is time to approach it more methodically and look at things more in depth.

 

[ozawkiegold]

I've answered every post but did not answer the part about a new or old problem. It is a new problem that started after I bought a lemon of a tractor. I have been going through it replacing every worn out part I can find. Changed all the oils, plugs, thermostat, coil, radiator, water pump, added wiring for a heat gauge and for oil pressure. The old water pump fins looked good but I changed it anyway. Since the water pump look good I changed the radiator think maybe but couldn't see anything wrong with it. I've had this tractor a year and at first it ran and didn't seem to have heating issues but couldn't tell because of no gauges. It started over heating so I thought the thermostat was bad. I got in to change it and it didn't have one, so I started spending money and changing parts.
The idea you have about the cooling jacket makes the most since to me. I've checked the oil several times and its just as clear as can be. I'm going to try your suggestions. The old water pump it gone so no picture there but it looked old but fine.

 

[ozawkiegold]

You apparently didn’t think bh49s question about new/old problem, was worthy of an answer. Give more details about the tractor and when how this problem presented itself. Timing can be a factor adding to an overheating problem but in this case since the tractor is just idling I doubt this is your problem. In my opinion the timing could be as far out of wack as possible to where it would still run, but at an idle doing no work the cooling system should be adequate to cool the engine. I am wondering if it could be possible some odd thing has happened in the cooling jacket of the engine? I am proposing maybe some thin casting flash broke away and is obstructing the passage for coolant to flow out of the water pump into the block. (see photo is this how your engine is configured?) Maybe a foil seal off the top of an antifreeze jug is in there blocking this? This doesn’t explain why you can still see circulation. Still have your old water pump? Show a photo of it, impeller side.
I would add on your check for bubbles I would suggest over filling the radiator so the coolant is right up at the top in the radiator neck. Take the fan belt off and start it and then check for bubbles. After the tractor has sat all night loosen the oil drain plug until it drips see if any coolant has collected in the bottom of the oil pan.
You have hit the high level diagnosis on this, now it is time to approach it more methodically and look at things more in depth.

PS. Didn't see a picture.

 

[sotxbill]

Checked for bubble with tractor running, saw no bubbles and water is flowing. New radiator, new water pump, new thermostat and the oil is clean. Have not run a compression test. When I start the tractor it runs smooth for 5 to 10 minutes with a clear exhaust and then starts to overheat.

OK.... water is circulating... no bubbles in radiator while running... No milkshake oil... check points gap and then check timing.. timing mark is on the rear flywheel, right side of engine, lower near oil pan, is a round hole, with a cover over it. remove the cover and with a timing light on front plug wire.. check the timing..... should be around 4 degrees iirc... and it should increase when you "rev it up"...to a higher degree number. Have you run a compression test? Has anyone overhauled the engine and got it out of time?? Does it start easily when warm? are some of the plug wires reversed??

 

[sotxbill]

I've answered every post but did not answer the part about a new or old problem. It is a new problem that started after I bought a lemon of a tractor. I have been going through it replacing every worn out part I can find. Changed all the oils, plugs, thermostat, coil, radiator, water pump, added wiring for a heat gauge and for oil pressure. The old water pump fins looked good but I changed it anyway. Since the water pump look good I changed the radiator think maybe but couldn't see anything wrong with it. I've had this tractor a year and at first it ran and didn't seem to have heating issues but couldn't tell because of no gauges. It started over heating so I thought the thermostat was bad. I got in to change it and it didn't have one, so I started spending money and changing parts.
The idea you have about the cooling jacket makes the most since to me. I've checked the oil several times and its just as clear as can be. I'm going to try your suggestions. The old water pump it gone so no picture there but it looked old but fine.

replaced wiring??? No gauges... have you... shot the top of the radiator with an ir gun to see the real temp?? expect to see around 160 to 170 for a gas.. and it should also show to be 20 degrees cooler where the water leaves the radiator. You temp gauge may not have the correct sending unit or voltage stabilizer, or a bad ground on the instrument panel... causing the gauges to read incorrect.. A harbor freight ir gun will shoot the correct temps and tell you whats really happening.

 

[ozawkiegold]

OK.... water is circulating... no bubbles in radiator while running... No milkshake oil... check points gap and then check timing.. timing mark is on the rear flywheel, right side of engine, lower near oil pan, is a round hole, with a cover over it. remove the cover and with a timing light on front plug wire.. check the timing..... should be around 4 degrees iirc... and it should increase when you "rev it up"...to a higher degree number. Have you run a compression test? Has anyone overhauled the engine and got it out of time?? Does it start easily when warm? are some of the plug wires reversed??

No one has overhauled that I know of, don't know the history of the tractor. If its out of time it run real smooth until it overheats. Temperature gauge must be close because when get int0 the red the tractor will start smoking from the grease on the side of the engine. I have not checked the timing but will in the near future. I have not run a compression test yet and yes oil is clean, no bubbles and water is moving in the radiator, not sure if its circulating, could be movement from the water pump.
Thank you everyone for the good ideas to try, not sure how some of them would cause overheating but if I knew it all I wouldn't be on this forum.

 

[ozawkiegold]

replaced wiring??? No gauges... have you... shot the top of the radiator with an ir gun to see the real temp?? expect to see around 160 to 170 for a gas.. and it should also show to be 20 degrees cooler where the water leaves the radiator. You temp gauge may not have the correct sending unit or voltage stabilizer, or a bad ground on the instrument panel... causing the gauges to read incorrect.. A harbor freight ir gun will shoot the correct temps and tell you whats really happening.

I will check the top of radiator for temperature and see what its running. The gauge may be off some but when its in the red it starts smoking, its hot. Up until then the tractor runs real smooth.