ford 3000 timing

[pcdreams2]

OK folks. First know I'm all thumbs when it comes to mechanical stuff.

So I've got an old Ford 3000 gasser that hasn't run in 20 years. I have
changed out the fluids, oil, etc.
It's one of those projects that I work with, get frustrated then don't mess with
for a year.

Anyway, cranks ok but never starts.
What I've done so far.

Verified neutral safety switch is good
Solonoid and coil was shot before so replaced it
New Zenith carb last year.
New plugs, wires, cap and rotor
Put new points in last week. Dropped a damn screw in it
and had to pull it.
Now I'm getting fuel and fire, but it's out of time

How do I time it?

I've done this a time or two on cars, but only with much luck and trial and error.

So What's the proper proceedure.

This is my thought process on :

Roll fly wheel round to TDC
Puts with distributor till it meshes with #1 lined up
crank and see if it'll start.
once it's started rotate distributor till it sounds right. (Manual says +/-2 TDC

Am I missing anything? Am I totally wrong?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Ultradog MN]

OK folks. First know I'm all thumbs when it comes to mechanical stuff.

So I've got an old Ford 3000 gasser that hasn't run in 20 years. I have
changed out the fluids, oil, etc.
It's one of those projects that I work with, get frustrated then don't mess with
for a year.

Anyway, cranks ok but never starts.
What I've done so far.

Verified neutral safety switch is good
Solonoid and coil was shot before so replaced it
New Zenith carb last year.
New plugs, wires, cap and rotor
Put new points in last week. Dropped a damn screw in it
and had to pull it.
Now I'm getting fuel and fire, but it's out of time

How do I time it?

I've done this a time or two on cars, but only with much luck and trial and error.

So What's the proper proceedure.

This is my thought process on :

Roll fly wheel round to TDC
Puts with distributor till it meshes with #1 lined up
crank and see if it'll start.
once it's started rotate distributor till it sounds right. (Manual says +/-2 TDC

Am I missing anything? Am I totally wrong?

Thanks in advance.

You are on the right track but dont forget that on a 4 cycle engine the crankshaft rotates two full revolutions but the distributer only rotates once.
So you need to get it to TDC on the Compression stroke before reinstalling the distributer.
Others may have an easier way but I would pull the valve cover and watch the the rocker arms/valves. Make sure Both valves are closing/closed as you roll the crankshaft over to TDC.

 

[michford]

Easiest way I have found to find TDC on compression stroke is a tdc whistle. Whistle starts sounding as piston coming up and valves are closed and stops whistling when at tdc. Pricey but simple. Here is an example from Summit racing. Remove spark plug number one, install whistle, roll engine over by hand and listen for whistle.

TDC Whistle

 

[pcdreams2]

No luck today. I found the viewing window but no pointer that I could see. I pulled the starter and rolled it around so I could clean off the timing marks. Put a little paint on TDC . Rolled it around by hand and then reinstalled the distributor aligned to one. Still not doing it. It either just cranks and cranks and never seems to fire, or it backfires. Maybe I'm on exhaust instead of combust stroke. I guess I'll probably pull the valve cover and try to test it that way. Gotta pull most of the metal off the front to get down in there though. So I may have to find a way to get it moved to a dry location before I can do that.

I did notice that it seems to be flooding out pretty bad if I open the choke at all. as in drips out the bottom of the carb. What that happens is when it seems to backfire. So I'm certain I'm getting fuel, and if it's backfiring I'm fairly certain I'm getting spark.

 

[Ultradog MN]

You might get a helper to turn it it over while you stick your thumb down #1 spark plug hole. When you feel it start to make pressure you know you are coming up on #1 compression stroke.

 

[chris142]

if you think its 180 out just move the plug wires 180

 

[pcdreams2]

if you think its 180 out just move the plug wires 180

I think that might be beyond me. Haha. I guess you'd just swap 3 for 1 and 2 would remain in the same spot? Firing order is 123

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

Do you have a manual? It should tell you the direction the rotor should point for #1. First determine the rotor direction then get it to TDC on compression stroke. See if the rotor is in the correct location. If not pull the distributor out. As you pull the distributor straight out the rotor will rotate slightly. When the gear disengages hold the rotor and jump the gear one tooth in whichever direction you need and push it back down to see where it ends up. That's the correct position and should get you started but getting the timing is a real pain. I&T manual gives a method for timing if you don't have access to a distributor test station.

 

[pcdreams2]

Do you have a manual? It should tell you the direction the rotor should point for #1. First determine the rotor direction then get it to TDC on compression stroke. See if the rotor is in the correct location. If not pull the distributor out. As you pull the distributor straight out the rotor will rotate slightly. When the gear disengages hold the rotor and jump the gear one tooth in whichever direction you need and push it back down to see where it ends up. That's the correct position and should get you started but getting the timing is a real pain. I&T manual gives a method for timing if you don't have access to a distributor test station.

I have the Ford Service Manual. I don't see anything that mentions position of #1. The only things I see related timing are the basic ignition timing (2 +/-2), point gap (0.024-0.026), and rotation is counterclockwise.

Maybe I found it in another section. "When the gears are properly meshed, there should be an angle of 60d between the centerline of the rotor at the no1 distributor terminal and the front face of the cylinder block."

I'll have to give this another look, but if this is correct I think my #1 is sitting where #2 should be

 

[Steve in IL]

I think that might be beyond me. Haha. I guess you'd just swap 3 for 1 and 2 would remain in the same spot? Firing order is 123

I don't think you want to do that. The firing order remains the same. It's just that it could be firing 360 degrees (crank rotation) too early. You can either remove (and hold in one place) the distributor, and turn the crank over exactly one rotation, or (more easily) remove distributor, rotate it 180 degrees, then reinstall. Crank, and see if it runs.

 

[pcdreams2]

OK I'll probably be back out there over this next weekend to give it another go. Thanks everyone and I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

I have the Ford Service Manual. I don't see anything that mentions position of #1. The only things I see related timing are the basic ignition timing (2 +/-2), point gap (0.024-0.026), and rotation is counterclockwise.

Maybe I found it in another section. "When the gears are properly meshed, there should be an angle of 60d between the centerline of the rotor at the no1 distributor terminal and the front face of the cylinder block."

I'll have to give this another look, but if this is correct I think my #1 is sitting where #2 should be

I looked in my I&T manual. All it says is to mesh the gears so the rotor is pointing to the #1 terminal of the cap.

 

[Sean in PA]

I looked in my I&T manual. All it says is to mesh the gears so the rotor is pointing to the #1 terminal of the cap.

You don't really need to do that. You just need to know which terminal the rotor is pointing to when the number one piston is at the TDC of its compression stroke and connect the wire for the #1 spark plug to that terminal and follow the firing order from there.

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

You also need to be sure which direction the distributor rotates.

 

[560Dennis]

Shoot some 30 weight (3to four skirts) from clean oil can into the cylinders to lube the cylinder wall and bring compression up to suck in the fuel charge. Or fifty to 1 premix fuel like that . Crank it over awhile to get good coverage .

 

[560Dennis]

Take valve cover off and rotate till one number is up with plugs out .the rockers should have lash in them . If not then check number four on 1342cfiring order Engine. look at distributor rotor to see if it lines up with number one on the cap. If it isn’t make it line up . Could be out by 180 degrees On distribution location.

 

[Ultradog MN]

Take valve cover off and rotate till one number is up with plugs out .the rockers should have lash in them ...

"check number four on 1342cfiring order Engine. look at distributor"

It is a 3 cylinder...

 

[560Dennis]

"check number four on 1342cfiring order Engine. look at distributor"

It is a 3 cylinder...

So in 65 they went to 123 firing order .