smoking tractor

[crownandrootsfarm]

Hi all,

1964 Ford 2000 tractor has smoke coming out of crank case breather. It starts as soon as I start it up and doesn't stop, tried running it for a few minutes to see if it would burn off but no luck. I have been using it for the past couple days no problem and today I noticed the smoke coming out of it. Oil looks good and at the right level. coolant is at the right level. The temperature gauge wasn't working when I got it a few years ago. Hoping its not overheating... Anyone have any thoughts on possible causes and fixes?

 

[stevieb49829]

Hi all,

1964 Ford 2000 tractor has smoke coming out of crank case breather. It starts as soon as I start it up and doesn't stop, tried running it for a few minutes to see if it would burn off but no luck. I have been using it for the past couple days no problem and today I noticed the smoke coming out of it. Oil looks good and at the right level. coolant is at the right level. The temperature gauge wasn't working when I got it a few years ago. Hoping its not overheating... Anyone have any thoughts on possible causes and fixes?

Jim and I were typing at the same time

Diesel or gas? Is your coolant water or antifreeze? Once the tractor sits for a day or two, crack open the oil drain plug just enough to get some seepage. If water, or antifreeze comes out first, before oil, do not run the tractor until you change the oil. Antifreeze will show up the same color as what's in your radiator.

Is it actually "smoke" or just a cloud of vapor? Is your engine oil cloudy? You may have moisture in the crankcase, which may or may not go away with some hard use. How hard do you use the tractor on a regular basis? It usually takes at least 10-15 minutes to get the engine up to operating temp, which evaporates condensation in the engine and blows it out the breather. If your oil is cloudy, or look like a milk shake, you need to change it and then work the tractor hard. Then if the oil clouds up again, you have a water/antifreeze leak to track down.

 

[Janicholson]

Hi all,

1964 Ford 2000 tractor has smoke coming out of crank case breather. It starts as soon as I start it up and doesn't stop, tried running it for a few minutes to see if it would burn off but no luck. I have been using it for the past couple days no problem and today I noticed the smoke coming out of it. Oil looks good and at the right level. coolant is at the right level. The temperature gauge wasn't working when I got it a few years ago. Hoping its not overheating... Anyone have any thoughts on possible causes and fixes?

Because the tractor is not new to you and this smoke is new, the key is finding the source. If the tractor has a crankcase ventilation system that draws crankcase fumes/blowby into the intake system, that would be my first look see. I would loosen the drain plug of the oil pan just till it was going to come out all the way. As oil starts to come out, look for coolant or water. If water got in the engine it can drain past the rings and it will drop to the bottom of the pan. If green, trouble if clear, probably rain. Jim

 

[Janicholson]

Is it actually "smoke" or just a cloud of vapor. Is your engine oil cloudy? You may have moisture in the crankcase, which may or may not go away with some hard use. How hard do you use the tractor on a regular basis? It usually takes at least 10-15 minutes to get the engine up to operating temp. If your oil is cloudy, or look like a milk shake, you need to change it and then work the tractor hard. Then if the oil clouds up again, you have a water/antifreeze leak to track down. steve

I would caution operating an engine with coolant in the oil. it does not lubricate and will wipe out the lower end in 10 minutes, doing damage all that time. Checking for coolant in the oil first is proper. Jim

 

[crownandrootsfarm]

Jim and I were typing at the same time

Diesel or gas? Is your coolant water or antifreeze? Once the tractor sits for a day or two, crack open the oil drain plug just enough to get some seepage. If water, or antifreeze comes out first, before oil, do not run the tractor until you change the oil. Antifreeze will show up the same color as what's in your radiator.

Is it actually "smoke" or just a cloud of vapor? Is your engine oil cloudy? You may have moisture in the crankcase, which may or may not go away with some hard use. How hard do you use the tractor on a regular basis? It usually takes at least 10-15 minutes to get the engine up to operating temp, which evaporates condensation in the engine and blows it out the breather. If your oil is cloudy, or look like a milk shake, you need to change it and then work the tractor hard. Then if the oil clouds up again, you have a water/antifreeze leak to track down.

thanks for the response, that is very helpful. hard for me to tell what the difference would look like between smoke and cloud of vapor to be honest, tried attaching video but it wouldn't go through. (maybe this attached picture is helpful?) its gas and has antifreeze in it. ive been working her pretty hard the past week plowing and discing and it hasn't rained in at least a week so I don't know how water could all of a sudden get in there, pulled dipstick and oil looks clean too. will follow up with what I find after letting it sit for a bit and cracking the drain plug.

 

[caterpillar guy]

Smoke would tend to be more streaming like versus vapor or ventilation where it would tend to be wispy like for lack of a better way to explain the difference. Most engines will wisp some fumes of oil water condensation and such out of the vent tube when used. Our old 830 Case used to do that some new. Was never a problem in the 2500 hours or so we had it. Yes the checking for water/coolant in the oil would be a best start as it will wipe out the crank and bearings quickly.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

thanks for the response, that is very helpful. hard for me to tell what the difference would look like between smoke and cloud of vapor to be honest, tried attaching video but it wouldn't go through. (maybe this attached picture is helpful?) its gas and has antifreeze in it. ive been working her pretty hard the past week plowing and discing and it hasn't rained in at least a week so I don't know how water could all of a sudden get in there, pulled dipstick and oil looks clean too. will follow up with what I find after letting it sit for a bit and cracking the drain plug.

Crowman
I have a Jubilee with the vent in the valve cover.
I retired the Jubilee in 2019. I would start it often and only ran it for minutes.
Then my #4 exhaust valve stem rusted and the valve stuck open, The air vent is next to the #4 valve
I had to remove the gas tank to remove the valve cover only to discover a lot of condensation.
I sprayed a lot of WD40 inside the spark plug hole. Installed the spark plug. It took a few cranks and the #4 valve broke loose.
I think the valve cover vent is not exactly Ford's better idea. They have a second vent in the oil fill cap.
I took a rubber hose that fit in the valve cover vent. Used JB weld to seal off the vent.
Then I ran the house to the hose in the intake oil bath air filter.
My attempt to make a crude PCV. My thinking is to keep the moisture out of the valve cover. The air would have to go through the oil bath filter or come back through the carb.
I will never start the tractor and run it for minutes. I have used it to mow my lawn 3x this year.
It runs just like it used to.
Someday, I'll remove the valve cover vent and use a camera to look inside for moisture.

 

[Bob NY]

My MF 65 diesel had a lot of smoke coming out of the valve cover vent when I bought it. I assumed it was blow by from the pistons. I eventually found that the head gasket was blown from the #3 cylinder to where the oil drains down from the valve train.

 

[jon f mn]

Unless it is a lot of smoke it is likely normal vapor leaving the engine. There are many reasons why you didn't see it at first, weather being the major reason. If the Temps outside are right you won't get actual steam so you wouldn't see it even tho it was there. Also weather could make it worse, if there is a large temp change you can get more condensation in the engine and that would need to come out. If for instance it got cold over night you would get more moisture inside and that may take several hours to get rid of.

That being said, checking for water in the oil is a good idea as that would tell if you have a leak. Could also be that you have broken rings if it's real bad. But that usually means it's blowing out a lot and frequently is even blowing oil out.

 

[Texasmark]

I may have missed it but is it gas or diesel? I had that tractor in the '63 model with a diesel for a couple of decades. I usually run my tractors for awhile any time I start them to reduce internal condensation. Over time, If I was just putting around it would smoke on startup and for a few minutes thereafter. If I hooked a mower to it and got in some tall grass, or a plow and worked it hard for an hour (give or take) the smoke would disappear and be gone for another period of time.

I'd do as others have said and after the tractor has been sitting for several days, carefully remove the drain plug and pay attention to what comes out first. If its black or honey colored black oil I'd change the oil (15w-40) and filter (FL-1A) and then hook it to an implement where you can run it hard, not overheating, just hard to ensure that the thermostat is open and the coolant is flowing good.....an indication that you have the engine temp where you want it, for an hour or so. Then, say the next day, fire it up and see if it quit smoking. If that doesn't help then you will have to look for a problem elsewhere like others have mentioned. I never had a vent problem.

 

[used red MN]

Crowman
I have a Jubilee with the vent in the valve cover.
I retired the Jubilee in 2019. I would start it often and only ran it for minutes.
Then my #4 exhaust valve stem rusted and the valve stuck open, The air vent is next to the #4 valve
I had to remove the gas tank to remove the valve cover only to discover a lot of condensation.
I sprayed a lot of WD40 inside the spark plug hole. Installed the spark plug. It took a few cranks and the #4 valve broke loose.
I think the valve cover vent is not exactly Ford's better idea. They have a second vent in the oil fill cap.
I took a rubber hose that fit in the valve cover vent. Used JB weld to seal off the vent.
Then I ran the house to the hose in the intake oil bath air filter.
My attempt to make a crude PCV. My thinking is to keep the moisture out of the valve cover. The air would have to go through the oil bath filter or come back through the carb.
I will never start the tractor and run it for minutes. I have used it to mow my lawn 2x this year.
It runs just like it used to

You definitely don’t need to go through all this, modifying your breather. This guy caused his own problem by starting his tractor frequently that was basically in storage and then not letting it run long enough to warm up. He posted about this when he had the problem and was told to just not start his tractor so frequently, but he felt he had to go and out smart the original design engineers to compensate for the problem he was causing by his own choice.
For you crown…
To add to what others have said and maybe this is a repeat, if the amount of smoke or vapor is not like a “freight train” fog coming out of there it is probably normal. Your engine has some wear and blow-by. Blow-by being combustion gases that get past the rings and pistons and into the crankcase, this is the built in vent for that.

 

[Fixingfarmer]

Picture shows plugs at the bottom so gasoline

Looks and sounds like blowby to me from rings getting worn. Possibly valve guides getting worn.

I wouldn't call that amount excessive. Now if you get a cloud you can't see to drive or are choking on don't want to run the tractor because of it that's different just like Used red MN stated above. I don't remember dads 64 having a vent that didn't have a pipe to the ground i'll have to look. A bit of blowby is to be expected especially if you are working it hard that's normal. Your tolerance to the amount of it will be the determining factor in wether you want to put rings in and check valve seats while the heads off id do both when you decide to do it. Beyond that as long as it starts run her. Alot of engines have much worse blowby and have run for thousands of more hours.

It doesn't look like anyone suggested checking the air cleaner but if not and that isn't where you started check the cup.

 

[crownandrootsfarm]

Hi all,
I appreciate all your feedback. Checked oil is all good, no coolant or water. I did do a compression test and 3 of them were 145-150 and one of them was 70 PSI. Am I right to say that it has to be just blowby judging by that test and i should just keep running the old girl until I have the time to look into it and fix whatever it is?

I am now looking to put in a working temp gauge. Do people usually run these old tractors without temp? It looks like previous owner plugged the hole where the temp sensor should go in for some reason if I'm looking at the correct hole. Is this where it should be plugged in (next to the wrench), back right of crankcase in between spark plugs and battery)?

 

[stevieb49829]

I'm not familiar with this engine, but any pipe plug in the head is usually a good place for a Temp Gauge sender.

Since the tractor runs, and there's no antifreeze in the oil, I'd put a squirt or two of ATF in the low cylinder, let it sit overnight, then start it up and use it. Is the exhaust protected from incoming rainwater? That cylinder may have stuck rings, and they may work themselves loose with a bit of TLC. Stuck rings would show up as worse-than-normal blowby and may have happened if the tractor sat outside for a few weeks, or months without running. After you use it for a few days, check the compression again on that cylinder. steve

 

[550Doug]

I'm not familiar with this engine, but any pipe plug in the head is usually a good place for a Temp Gauge sender.

Since the tractor runs, and there's no antifreeze in the oil, I'd put a squirt or two of ATF in the low cylinder, let it sit overnight, then start it up and use it. Is the exhaust protected from incoming rainwater? That cylinder may have stuck rings, and they may work themselves loose with a bit of TLC. Stuck rings would show up as worse-than-normal blowby and may have happened if the tractor sat outside for a few weeks, or months without running. After you use it for a few days, check the compression again on that cylinder. steve

I squirted some atf into a spark plug hole and the little plastic tube I was using, fell into the cylinder and is still there. I'm still afraid to start the engine as I still cannot retrieve that tube.

 

[stevieb49829]

I squirted some atf into a spark plug hole and the little plastic tube I was using, fell into the cylinder and is still there. I'm still afraid to start the engine as I still cannot retrieve that tube.

Time to go fishing with a piece of copper wire, with a hook on the end. Get the piston almost to the top, and a good flashlight. Be patient. Melted plastic straws probably aren't good for cylinder walls or valve heads/seats. And your compression could get a whole lot worse! steve

 

[Janicholson]

Time to go fishing with a piece of copper wire, with a hook on the end. Get the piston almost to the top, and a good flashlight. Be patient. Melted plastic straws probably aren't good for cylinder walls or valve heads/seats. And your compression could get a whole lot worse! steve

Agree if the tube is a tiny straw from a spray can, it might need a coat hanger wire to double it over out the plug hole. some reading glasses, or a endoscope for a smart phone would be nice. Jim

 

[Fixingfarmer]

 

[Texasmark]

View attachment 69105

Harbor Freight carries them. Also have a magnetic type....not for your case but just general info. There have been times that these two instruments have saved the day for me and I wouldn't be without them.

 

[stevieb49829]

Agree if the tube is a tiny straw from a spray can, it might need a coat hanger wire to double it over out the plug hole. some reading glasses, or a endoscope for a smart phone would be nice. Jim

A medical forceps might help too. Good for retrieving fish hooks out of perch too. steve