12v and Wiring Questions

[JJay48]

One of the first things I purchased for my 8N was a 12v conversion with the Delco 10SI 1 wire alternator. Its still in the box but before too much time passed I wanted to make sure this is the route I want to go. I was second guessing my decision recently after reading some threads and articles.

I had read the 1 wire setup takes some RPM before it charges. I also read the new version does not take as much RPM though. At least according to this article. Is this true?

Ford 8N and the Delco 10-SI Alternator

www.myfordtractors.com

If they do still take a decent amount of rpm to charge I read I could still wire in a dash light and get around this? Someone said they even wired up the headlights to excite the alt and get it charging.

Do most of you replace the amp meter with a volt meter when going 12v? The article also said that was a good idea. I am fine with redoing the wiring that came with the kit as I wanted to put a different wire loom on it anyway.

Basically Ide like to make sure it charges good even at lower rpm. Replacing the Amp meter with a volt meter might also be nice or at least adding a dash light. Should I have went with a 3 wire alt?

I am no wiring expert so bear with me but I have a basic understanding and have some decent tools for troubleshooting. Looking for some opinions on how everyone likes to wire their 8Ns. I will be adding lights front and rear as well with a work light. I know I can follow the basic diagram for the 1 wire setup but if there are some improvements to be made without adding too much bulk to the harness I would like to hear them.

Thanks

 

[JJay48]

Looks like it still has the spade terminals like a 3 wire alternator they just had a grommet over them. Could I wire it up as a 3-wire then if that's the preferred setup.?

 

[JMOR]

Looks like it still has the spade terminals like a 3 wire alternator they just had a grommet over them. Could I wire it up as a 3-wire then if that's the preferred setup.?

Some use internal VR that can also be wire to function as a 3 -wire, BUT others can not. I have several tractors with these Delco alternators, some 1, some 3 wire and I will say that the whole controversy of needing some rpm to initiate charging is WWWAAAAYYYY overblown! No tractor user starts a tractor and runs it at idle, simple as that. Furthermore, once you reach charging rpm, it holds, and will still charge even when rpm drops back to idle.

 

[JJay48]

Some use internal VR that can also be wire to function as a 3 -wire, BUT others can not. I have several tractors with these Delco alternators, some 1, some 3 wire and I will say that the whole controversy of needing some rpm to initiate charging is WWWAAAAYYYY overblown! No tractor user starts a tractor and runs it at idle, simple as that. Furthermore, once you reach charging rpm, it holds, and will still charge even when rpm drops back to idle.

Ok thanks! I may just keep it 1 wire then if that's the case. Still thinking about going with a volt meter over amps though.

 

[Dawgbone]

Looks like it still has the spade terminals like a 3 wire alternator they just had a grommet over them. Could I wire it up as a 3-wire then if that's the preferred setup.?

It worked for me. I had the one wire and had to rev it up pretty high before it would start charging. Bought a pigtail, stuck it in and wired it up. Now it starts charging when it starts. Good luck.

 

[JJay48]

JMOR is the wiring diagram I posted still good if you have electronic ignition?

Thanks

 

[JMOR]

JMOR is the wiring diagram I posted still good if you have electronic ignition?

Thanks

If you have 6v pos ground EI, it is not compatible with 12v neg ground.

 

[JMOR]

It worked for me. I had the one wire and had to rev it up pretty high before it would start charging. Bought a pigtail, stuck it in and wired it up. Now it starts charging when it starts. Good luck.

Like I said, some will, some won't. New unit in picture has B+ on both #1 & #2 & as you can see the two are strapped together.

https://imgur.com/AFvrYEU

 

[JJay48]

Like I said, some will, some won't. New unit in picture has B+ on both #1 & #2 & as you can see the two are strapped together.

https://imgur.com/AFvrYEU

Guess mine is not the new style?

 

[JJay48]

JMOR is the wiring the same if I have the electronic ignition as well?

If you have 6v pos ground EI, it is not compatible with 12v neg ground.

I should have explained better. I am in the middle of rebuilding my 48 8N and I have a 12v conversion kit with the alternator I showed above that includes the 12v front distributor coil. Was trying to decide if I wanted to wire it up 1 wire or 3 wire.

I also have a voltmeter and pertronix electronic ignition on order for 12v. I was wondering if the 12v EI will affect that wiring diagram I posted at all if I do go 1 wire.

Is there a way to test the alternator on the bench to see if it can be used as a 3 wire?

 

[JMOR]

Guess mine is not the new style?

New vs old original in my photo, not meaning a "new style" one wire. There are many makers & some differing deigns.

 

[Jim.ME]

JMOR is the wiring the same if I have the electronic ignition as well?

I should have explained better. I am in the middle of rebuilding my 48 8N and I have a 12v conversion kit with the alternator I showed above that includes the 12v front distributor coil. Was trying to decide if I wanted to wire it up 1 wire or 3 wire.

I also have a voltmeter and pertronix electronic ignition on order for 12v. I was wondering if the 12v EI will affect that wiring diagram I posted at all if I do go 1 wire.

Is there a way to test the alternator on the bench to see if it can be used as a 3 wire?

Check the pulley on your new alternator. You want one that is for the same width belt the generator uses, so the belt fits the crank pulley and water pump pulley correctly. You can also get those wide pulleys in a smaller diameter (like 2-5/8" I think) which gets the alternator speed up at any given engine rpm.

 

[JJay48]

Check the pulley on your new alternator. You want one that is for the same width belt the generator uses, so the belt fits the crank pulley and water pump pulley correctly. You can also get those wide pulleys in a smaller diameter (like 2-5/8" I think) which gets the alternator speed up at any given engine rpm.

Mine is the smaller diameter pulley for the wide belt.

 

[JMOR]

JMOR is the wiring the same if I have the electronic ignition as well?

I should have explained better. I am in the middle of rebuilding my 48 8N and I have a 12v conversion kit with the alternator I showed above that includes the 12v front distributor coil. Was trying to decide if I wanted to wire it up 1 wire or 3 wire.

I also have a voltmeter and pertronix electronic ignition on order for 12v. I was wondering if the 12v EI will affect that wiring diagram I posted at all if I do go 1 wire.

Yes, as the Pertronix module has two wires and one connects inside the distributor, but the other one must come outside and receives power from the ign switch. Depending on distributor, you may remove the vent screen and use hole for wire or if your distributor does not have a vent screen, then drill distributor for a wire exit hole. These instructions will be in the kit. The instructions show wiring connections and will state whether additional resistance is required or not (some units do, some don't). I recommend the
91247 Ignitor II, as it has over-current protection to avoid burn out if you accidentally leave ign key on with engine stalled & it needs no resistor at all as the unit limits coil current. The common 1247 does not have these features. You can see installation procedures here:

PerTronix 91247 Ignitor® II Ford 4 cyl Electronic Ignition Conversion Kit

Electronic Ignition Conversion Kits to replace original mechanical points & troublesome factory ignition. Dependable, maintenance free, and easy to install. Never Replace Points Again. Ignitor II provides increased starting voltage with adaptive dwell control.

pertronixbrands.com

PerTronix 1247 Ignitor® Ford 4 cyl Electronic Ignition Conversion Kit

Electronic Ignition Conversion Kits to replace original mechanical points & troublesome factory ignition. Dependable, maintenance free, and easy to install. Never Replace Points Again. The Original Ignitor is ideal for restorations.

pertronixbrands.com

 

[JJay48]

Yes, as the Pertronix module has two wires and one connects inside the distributor, but the other one must come outside and receives power from the ign switch. Depending on distributor, you may remove the vent screen and use hole for wire or if your distributor does not have a vent screen, then drill distributor for a wire exit hole. These instructions will be in the kit. The instructions show wiring connections and will state whether additional resistance is required or not (some units do, some don't).

Thanks.

I have the same 12v conversion kit and pertronix as he does in this video except I have an 8n and not a 9n. His second wire he just connected on top to the coil wire. He also stated it only took around 650 rpm or so to start charging. Pertronix kit 1247.

 

[JJay48]

I think these are the directions for the one I am getting. The 12v coil I have says its 2.5 Ohms. I have a new stock replacement resistor.

 

[JMOR]

Use your new stock replacement resistor and add wire to supply full battery voltage to module. I modified my earlier drawing to reflect this.

https://imgur.com/HHKU7XG

 

[JJay48]

Use your new stock replacement resistor and add wire to supply full battery voltage to module. I modified my earlier drawing to reflect this.

https://imgur.com/HHKU7XG

Thanks! I figured thats the way it should go. What gauge wire would you use for that?

I wonder how the guy on YouTube got away with connecting it after the resistor.

 

[JMOR]

Thanks! I figured thats the way it should go. What gauge wire would you use for that?

I wonder how the guy on YouTube got away with connecting it after the resistor.

16Ga will be fine. "Got away with it?" Well, a 120 volt bulb will put out some light at 60 volts, too.

 

[JJay48]

16Ga will be fine. "Got away with it?" Well, a 120 volt bulb will put out some light at 60 volts, too.

Ok, 1 more question please. Why is the stock resistor block needed with all my upgraded 12v parts? I guess the coil cant handle the full current?
It also seems odd there are no fuses in the system but I guess the resistor protects from that? Then the lights suppose have their own fuse in the switch.

Thanks