Well pump popping breaker

[rrlund]

Antifreeze?

Puzzled.

You never really mentioned the wire down the hole. I think you have talked about the wire to the pump from your power pole, horizontal feed. You haven’t really said anything about the vertical wire to the pump.

My pickup is in the same boat as your pump, it shuts down to limp mode every so often, infrequent enough they can’t find it, the codes point to generic thing that has been replaced twice and clearly isn’t the actual problem…

Paul

He said he's never seen that wire going down inside go bad. We looked it over while we were pulling it up. He put in all new wire anyway, doesn't half azz anything. I just rolled it up now that it's dried out. I didn't see anything wrong with it either.

 

[TerryfromSWIowa]

The wire in my well rubbed and had to be repaired about 20 years ago, two years ago pump was replaced and a new wire was installed because of another spot that looked suspicious.

 

[rrlund]

The wire in my well rubbed and had to be repaired about 20 years ago, two years ago pump was replaced and a new wire was installed because of another spot that looked suspicious.

The thing that scares me a little is that the wire that goes inside of the pump is only about two feet long. That has to be spliced on to the wire that comes up to the top of the well. That splice is always under water. They use a heat shrink splice on it. If that ever leaked, it would trip the breaker immediately.

 

[buickanddeere]

The thing that scares me a little is that the wire that goes inside of the pump is only about two feet long. That has to be spliced on to the wire that comes up to the top of the well. That splice is always under water. They use a heat shrink splice on it. If that ever leaked, it would trip the breaker immediately.

Actually if the connection was submerged and energized. Most likely there would just be some water boiling around the exposed connection .
Ever see a flooded basement with water over the wall receptacles ? Power stays on and each receptacle makes a bit of steam .

 

[Russ from MN]

The first submersible pump I installed stopped pumping after about 5 years, when we pulled it up it was just one of the wires about 3 feet above the pump. I hadn't tapped the wires to the water line well enough. Shortened everything by 3 feet and put it back down, all was fine. My wife and I pulled it by hand, down 130 feet, we were young then!

 

[rrlund]

Went to get in the shower last night, no water. Turned it back on, pressure started dropping, it went off again. Still on this morning though. The only wire that hasn't been replaced is from a box on the deck, under the house and in to the breaker box in the basement. I'm going this morning to get all new wire to run in one piece from the breaker to the well. I just don't know what to do anymore.

 

[Ericp351]

Trust your time will prove better spent by pulling, inspecting, et cetera, your pump. Ship, sadly (?), has sailed on just posting stuff randomly.

 

[showcrop]

A few years ago, while at a rescue call with the FD as the driver, I was waiting outside and noticed the cover to a below ground well house like yours was open. I looked in and couldn't help but notice the amount of condensation all over many surfaces down there. I don't remember details but I gave the owner a suggestion for mitigating it. Condensation could give you an intermittent problem.

 

[rrlund]

Trust your time will prove better spent by pulling, inspecting, et cetera, your pump. Ship, sadly (?), has sailed on just posting stuff randomly.

I guess you didn't read the part where we put a new pump in it yesterday.

 

[rrlund]

A few years ago, while at a rescue call with the FD as the driver, I was waiting outside and noticed the cover to a below ground well house like yours was open. I looked in and couldn't help but notice the amount of condensation all over many surfaces down there. I don't remember details but I gave the owner a suggestion for mitigating it. Condensation could give you an intermittent problem.

There's no pit. 5 inch well with submersible pump. Brand new yesterday. Bladder tank is buried. That was new December 30.

 

[miangus]

Good to hear all is well. I had a pump a few years ago that would draw high amps but trip the circuit breaker internal to the pump which would reset and allow it to pump a bit more. My well guy put a meter on it and said it was done, probably a swelled armature. He said he would pull it the next day, and I could take a look at it and decide what to do. I said can you just pull it and replace in the same day, he said " yes, but everybody wants to see the pump". I told him I am pretty sure it looks like a piece of junk, which it is. He replaced the pump the drop tube which was steel and the wire. I came home from work and wrote a check. Never did look at the pump, he hauled all the junk away.

 

[DanielW]

I just re-read the part where you mention the pressure switch is atop the well. Is that one of those goofy setups where it's a standard, homeowner-grade pressure switch sitting right atop the cap? I didn't know anyone did that anymore. There was a drilling company around here that did that back in the day (guessing the 1980's/90's). Everyone around here hated theirs as they always gave trouble after a while. It was a pretty stupid idea: The driller just used standard switches that were meant for indoor applications - not IP65 (or anything close to it), so moisture/humidity would get inside the switch and foul up the contacts and make the pivoting contact arm stiff/dry. Most folks put a section of well tile and a cap or sealed section of culvert over top of theirs to protect from rain, but that still doesn't stop humidity & condensation from getting in. If yours is like this and the switch hasn't been replaced, I'd take some emery to the contacts and a bit of lube to the arm in the switch.

I'd think you'd be far better to keep things conventional and mount the tank & switch inside. I'm guessing that there must be a reason they aren't? No basement, or nowhere to put them? In theory, you want the pressure switch sensing line right close to the bladder tank to avoid the pressure surges you get if it's too far away from the tank. But even though it's not proper practice, I'd be tempted to try a quick and cheap retrofit and put a standard pressure switch inside the house on the main line and see how it does with the tank still buried. It'd be pretty easy/cheap to do.

I don't have a pic of one of the local wells that was run like that. But here's a picture of one run in the same style that I took from a thread on this site years ago (might even be yours?). If yours is setup like this, I'd look for a different installer. A standard switch like this should not be in an external environment. You need something water/moisture-proof (IP65 or better).

 

[joeysmith]

I guess you didn't read the part where we put a new pump in it yesterday.

Im curious about your pressure sensing line for the switch
Is it a possibility the fittings or something in that plumbing are restricted with crud or years of corrosion internally?
Causing the pump to slam on/off/on/off occasionally?
That could possibly trip a breaker

 

[rrlund]

Im curious about your pressure sensing line for the switch
Is it a possibility the fittings or something in that plumbing are restricted with crud or years of corrosion internally?
Causing the pump to slam on/off/on/off occasionally?
That could possibly trip a breaker

Brand new yesterday too.

 

[DanielW]

Further to my post about the goofy setups with the switch atop the well: I was just talking to my father and mentioned those setups because he knew the folks with them better than I did. He said another problem was some air getting in the sensing line bladder on the antifreeze side and them being a pain to bleed with antifreeze and get every last bit of air out. Don't think that would cause a tripping breaker though (and it sounds like yours was replaced/bled recently, so definitely not a problem). But poor contact points in the switch and a stiff pivot arm from moisture/humidity/condensation could cause a tripping breaker or the pump to not come on/off correctly.

 

[buickanddeere]

I just re-read the part where you mention the pressure switch is atop the well. Is that one of those goofy setups where it's a standard, homeowner-grade pressure switch sitting right atop the cap? I didn't know anyone did that anymore. There was a drilling company around here that did that back in the day (guessing the 1980's/90's). Everyone around here hated theirs as they always gave trouble after a while. It was a pretty stupid idea: The driller just used standard switches that were meant for indoor applications - not IP65 (or anything close to it), so moisture/humidity would get inside the switch and foul up the contacts and make the pivoting contact arm stiff/dry. Most folks put a section of well tile and a cap or sealed section of culvert over top of theirs to protect from rain, but that still doesn't stop humidity & condensation from getting in. If yours is like this and the switch hasn't been replaced, I'd take some emery to the contacts and a bit of lube to the arm in the switch.

I'd think you'd be far better to keep things conventional and mount the tank & switch inside. I'm guessing that there must be a reason they aren't? No basement, or nowhere to put them? In theory, you want the pressure switch sensing line right close to the bladder tank to avoid the pressure surges you get if it's too far away from the tank. But even though it's not proper practice, I'd be tempted to try a quick and cheap retrofit and put a standard pressure switch inside the house on the main line and see how it does with the tank still buried. It'd be pretty easy/cheap to do.

I don't have a pic of one of the local wells that was run like that. But here's a picture of one run in the same style that I took from a thread on this site years ago (might even be yours?). If yours is setup like this, I'd look for a different installer. A standard switch like this should not be in an external environment. You need something water/moisture-proof (IP65 or better).
View attachment 147218

Why on earth would somebody mount a pressure switch in that configuration ?

 

[buickanddeere]

Further to my post about the goofy setups with the switch atop the well: I was just talking to my father and mentioned those setups because he knew the folks with them better than I did. He said another problem was some air getting in the sensing line bladder on the antifreeze side and them being a pain to bleed with antifreeze and get every last bit of air out. Don't think that would cause a tripping breaker though (and it sounds like yours was replaced/bled recently, so definitely not a problem). But poor contact points in the switch and a stiff pivot arm from moisture/humidity/condensation could cause a tripping breaker or the pump to not come on/off correctly.

I am beginning wonder if this jimmy rigged pressure switch system is chattering ,rapidly cycling the pump on and off ? Causing the over current trip . Wonder too what the cut in and cut off pressures are ?

 

[DanielW]

Why on earth would somebody mount a pressure switch in that configuration ?

This is just a guess, but I suspect it was done where there's no basement (or with a smaller finished basement where there's no room for a tank/switch). Around here in cottage country there were (and still are) a lot of small, 3-season cottages built on block or bedrock with no basement and pretty small footprints, so I can see why they might want the tank outside to save room inside the house. But even then, I don't know why the switch wouldn't be in the same pit as the tank. Or even on the mainline in the house. The bladder/antifreeze setup seems like unnecessary complication.

But I'm certainly no expert, and that's just speculation. There must have been reason for it, as it was done more than a few times around here. But it seems pretty hokey to me. And everyone around here hated theirs. Maybe the switch being atop the cap instead of in the pit is for easy access/service, because if they use that style of basic, open switch, you'd definitely need to service or replace the switch every few years when moisture caused grief. Heck, even on the setups in our houses with the switch and tank inside the basement, we've still had the pivoting arms in the switch get stiff after several years and the contacts get pitted and need a clean-up. I can't imagine that style of switch lasting long in an outdoor setup like that.

Here's a thread on another site discussing that kind of wacky setup. And it sounds like they had exactly the same problems as everyone around here: Pressure switch gone stiff/bad with burned up contacts because it's an open switch in an outdoor environment. I'd be highly suspect of any installer that thought this was an ok place to put a standard pressure switch without at least some additional cap over the well. Those standard pressure switches aren't anywhere close to sealed nor waterproof.

Replacing pressure switch but tank is buried. Can I do this? - DoItYourself.com Community Forums

Replacing pressure switch but tank is buried. Can I do this? - Wells, Sump Pumps and Septic Sewage Systems

www.doityourself.com

 

[Ericp351]

I guess you didn't read the part where we put a new pump in it yesterday.

Yup, missed that. Let,s see #1 time of war. #2, a pump went bad #3, about 60 comments as a pump gets replaced. Perhaps post #75 will include a picture of a dirty plate washed with water from a new pump. Soon the world really will become safe for demarcracy.

 

[MarkB_MI]

I'm wondering if your line voltage is dropping from time to time. Low voltage will cause the pump motor to draw more current.