I’m new to all this “tractoting” business

[TheBartman47]

Another follow up question. I’m very used to wrenching on cars and trucks, but tractors are a different beast. All the bolts are significantly bigger. What do you folks usually use? Impact guns? 1/2 inch drive with breaker bars?

3/4" drive ratchet set and large box-end/open-end wrench set.

 

[Jasoninwyoming]

3/4" drive ratchet set and large box-end/open-end wrench set.

Great to know. I don’t have at 3/4 drive so I’ll need to expand my tools.

 

[scootergmc]

1/2" drive is the heaviest you'll need for most everything, until you run into rusty wallowed hubs and lugs and larger frame mounts. I've had bolts a 1" pneumatic gun wouldn't touch. You do tractoring for very long and you'll need a method for heating stuck fasteners.

 

[Jim.ME]

Another follow up question. I’m very used to wrenching on cars and trucks, but tractors are a different beast. All the bolts are significantly bigger. What do you folks usually use? Impact guns? 1/2 inch drive with breaker bars?

Your 283 doesn't have much for bolts and nuts that can't be handled with a good 1/2" drive set (up to 1-1/4" sockets with ratchet, breaker bar and extensions) and impact, which I would expect you have if you work on trucks some. 3/8" and 1/4" drive sets are handy at times. There are a few places a 3/4" drive might be handy.

Wrenches Open and combination types fall in the same sizes as the sockets.

 

[Powered By IH]

So I have a couple of questions:
1. My front end loader brackets over the bottom of the bell housing (picture included). Do I need to remove that bracket to inspect the clutch clearance?
2. It’s definitely possible that they did something to keep it running for the FEL, but when I take the PTO out of gear, that operates normally.
3. The external linkage has the 3/16 free play adjusted. Is there anything else to adjust?
4. I can’t feel the second stage in the clutch with a different pressure, but in the middle I am able to disengage the drive gears and shift into another, so that part of the clutch feels perfectly

Just a thought too. The MF 175/180 have 2 holes in the clutch release lever. One is for normal operation; the second hole is for what you exactly describe. I would double check and see if your tractor has that, and if it's in the wrong hole.

 

[Jasoninwyoming]

Just a thought too. The MF 175/180 have 2 holes in the clutch release lever. One is for normal operation; the second hole is for what you exactly describe. I would double check and see if your tractor has that, and if it's in the wrong hole.

I don’t think I’m following what you’re suggesting I look at.Would you be able to post a quick drawing or a picture of what you’re talking about so I could better understand?

 

[Jim.ME]

Look at the rod that goes from the clutch pedal to the arm on the clutch shaft at the side of the clutch housing. Does the arm on that shaft have just one hole the rod can be pinned into or two holes the rod could pin into? If it has two holes it should be pinned in the hole that makes the pedal the highest to give more travel for operating the second stage of the clutch.

 

[Powered By IH]

On an MF 180, the release lever has 2 holes, the blue circles are an approximate location for each.

I believe you connect the clevis to the front hole for normal operation.

When you want to keep the PTO constantly running, you connect the pin to the back hole. This makes the release lever travel less, thus keeping the PTO and hydraulics engaged.

@Jim.ME please correct me if I'm wrong.

Fire away more questions if you have them.

 

[Jasoninwyoming]

On an MF 180, the release lever has 2 holes, the blue circles are an approximate location for each.

I believe you connect the clevis to the front hole for normal operation.

When you want to keep the PTO constantly running, you connect the pin to the back hole. This makes the release lever travel less, thus keeping the PTO and hydraulics engaged.

@Jim.ME please correct me if I'm wrong.

Fire away more questions if you have them.

There’s only one hole in the clevis. I attached a picture.

You wouldn’t by chance know the spec on the clutch rod length, would you?

To me it seems like there’s three possible problems, what do you think?
1. The PTO clutch plate is fused to the flywheel.
2. The PTO clutches out of adjustment.
3. The clutch rod length is out of adjustment— I don’t have the service manual yet so I don’t know what that number is supposed to be.

I’ve already adjusted the clutch free play to spec, so I know it’s not that.

I was planning to take the clutch inspection plate off this weekend and see what the three PTO bolts adjustment is measuring and making sure that that’s proper.

 

[Jim.ME]

On an MF 180, the release lever has 2 holes, the blue circles are an approximate location for each.

I believe you connect the clevis to the front hole for normal operation.

When you want to keep the PTO constantly running, you connect the pin to the back hole. This makes the release lever travel less, thus keeping the PTO and hydraulics engaged.

@Jim.ME please correct me if I'm wrong.

Fire away more questions if you have them.

I cannot say for certain on his 283 but more searching in the 283 I found there was an arm, similar to the one on the 180, used on some 283s. Looking at the picture he posted I suggest he pull the pin and see if the clevis is hiding the hole the rod needs to be in to operate both stages of the two-stage clutch. If there is a "hidden" hole the rod needs to be moved to that hole.

This will make the clutch pedal higher giving it more travel to operate the second stage.

 

[showcrop]

The pump only works to operate the loader while the PTO is spinning.

Does the PTO continue to spin when shut off with the lever?

 

[Jim.ME]

Does the PTO continue to spin when shut off with the lever?

I think he answered that in post #15. It does not.

 

[Jim.ME]

There’s only one hole in the clevis. I attached a picture.

You wouldn’t by chance know the spec on the clutch rod length, would you?

To me it seems like there’s three possible problems, what do you think?
1. The PTO clutch plate is fused to the flywheel.
2. The PTO clutches out of adjustment.
3. The clutch rod length is out of adjustment— I don’t have the service manual yet so I don’t know what that number is supposed to be.

I’ve already adjusted the clutch free play to spec, so I know it’s not that.

I was planning to take the clutch inspection plate off this weekend and see what the three PTO bolts adjustment is measuring and making sure that that’s proper.

Are you sure the rod length is not given in your Operator's manual? It and the free play clearance are given in the clutch adjustment info of the 255 manual I have. I gave you the length the 255 calls for in post #16.

 

[showcrop]

I think he answered that in post #15. It does not.

Actually he didn't. He stated "The pump only works to operate the loader while the PTO is spinning" What I am getting at is the PTO spinning when it should not be? I am not familiar with this tractor , but we all know that sometimes discs in a clutch pack get bent from overheating and will not disengage, or cold heavy oil can cause a PTO to turn when it should not.

 

[Jim.ME]

Actually he didn't. He stated "The pump only works to operate the loader while the PTO is spinning" What I am getting at is the PTO spinning when it should not be? I am not familiar with this tractor , but we all know that sometimes discs in a clutch pack get bent from overheating and will not disengage, or cold heavy oil can cause a PTO to turn when it should not.

That is a mechanical PTO, the only clutch is the disc in the two-stage engine clutch pressure plate. I doubt the oil is going to drag enough to operate the hydraulic pump when using the loader if disengaged.

We are trying to figure out if his clutch adjustment is correct. Being a Massey Ferguson some of them had an option of two holes for the pedal rod to connect to in the arm on the throw out bearing shaft. One sets the pedal lower and does not operate the PTO stage of the clutch. The other hole will set the pedal higher and has more travel range to operate the PTO stage of the clutch. His picture looks like his has the second hole and the rod is currently in the hole that will not operate the PTO clutch. Being in the right hole, the correct rod length and free play adjustment are the first things to be confirmed before going deeper.

 

[Jasoninwyoming]

I cannot say for certain on his 283 but more searching in the 283 I found there was an arm, similar to the one on the 180, used on some 283s. Looking at the picture he posted I suggest he pull the pin and see if the clevis is hiding the hole the rod needs to be in to operate both stages of the two-stage clutch. If there is a "hidden" hole the rod needs to be moved to that hole.

This will make the clutch pedal higher giving it more travel to operate the second stage.

View attachment 153371

I will pull the pin and visually inspect that part of the clutch arm.

 

[Jasoninwyoming]

Are you sure the rod length is not given in your Operator's manual? It and the free play clearance are given in the clutch adjustment info of the 255 manual I have. I gave you the length the 255 calls for in post #16.

Let me look through it again today. I went through it closely looking for that spec and I was unable to find it. I’ll circle back with a report.

 

[Jasoninwyoming]

Does the PTO continue to spin when shut off with the lever?

No it does not. When the PTO lever is shut off, the PTO does not operate. When I engage the PTO lever, it operates normally. The problem being, even though I full engage the clutch, it grinds when I’m engaging the PTO with the engine running (even at low idle). If the engine is off, it falls into gear easily as it should.

 

[paul]

I struggle with knowing how tight to make things with an impact gun, and equipment often doesn’t have room, but they are sure helpful along the way for sure for disassembly!

I’ve come to like ratcheting wrenches along with the socket set, and yea 1/2 inch is the socket deal.

But, I’m a poor mechanic, so others likely know a lot better insights.

Dad ran the farm with a set of box end, deeper drop wrenches and bought his first socket set when I was about 5. I still have it, in the red metal box. He carved 2 holes in the sturdy plastic internal holder and added a 1-1/16 and 1-1/8 sockets.

Mostly he used a pliers, crescent wrench, hammer, and torch, mostly in that order….

Paul

 

[Janicholson]

Another follow up question. I’m very used to wrenching on cars and trucks, but tractors are a different beast. All the bolts are significantly bigger. What do you folks usually use? Impact guns? 1/2 inch drive with breaker bars?

1/2" socket set with extensions of 2" 4" 6" 12", deep sockets and normal depth. Ratchet, and flex bar. Ratcheting wrenches are nice and work in tight places. Up to one inch (costly). I have line wrenches to 3/4 inch to keep from rounding flair nuts. Be willing to heat, bend and oil quench wrenches to get a job done. (no brand wrenches are good for this). 30" pry bars are also very useful. as are tapered punches to locate holes when attaching accessories. Jim