Trouble setting timing on D329 international

[oldcl]

I have a 250A loader box blade tractor.Hasent ran in years.Cleaned the injector pump and got it working.When I try to put it back in the engine the key way is at 10 oclock or so.The injector set in the #1 position the keyway is at the top of the shaft. I set the gears at 16 degrees before TDC and the key way in the gear is at 10 oclockl.The key on the injector is strait up.Don't make any sense to me.Help

 

[used red MN]

I have a 250A loader box blade tractor.Hasent ran in years.Cleaned the injector pump and got it working.When I try to put it back in the engine the key way is at 10 oclock or so.The injector set in the #1 position the keyway is at the top of the shaft. I set the gears at 16 degrees before TDC and the key way in the gear is at 10 oclockl.The key on the injector is strait up.Don't make any sense to me.Help

Hello oldcl, welcome to YT! First off the engine is a D239. Have you only removed the injector pump and not any of the front gear train since it ran last. Setting the gears at 16 degrees BTDC means you have the engine and crankshaft set at that point by the timing marks on the crankshaft pulley?

 

[oldcl]

I forgot to mention that it was a D239.I only removed the injector pump.I had to turn the crank several times to get the crank-idler and cam gears in time.I have the pump set at #1 port and the key way is strait up on the shaft.I am 83.I have been working on this thing out in the sun. Don't know that much about diesels.Been a mechanic most of my life.Looks like if I turn the pump off center to install it would be wrong.Thanks for any help you can provide.This tractor hasn't ran in many years.I think someone had messed with the injector and timing and gave up.

 

[RedMVa]

I forgot to mention that it was a D239.I only removed the injector pump.I had to turn the crank several times to get the crank-idler and cam gears in time.I have the pump set at #1 port and the key way is strait up on the shaft.I am 83.I have been working on this thing out in the sun. Don't know that much about diesels.Been a mechanic most of my life.Looks like if I turn the pump off center to install it would be wrong.Thanks for any help you can provide.This tractor hasn't ran in many years.I think someone had messed with the injector and timing and gave up.

Should’ve never moved the crank, but if you have the timing marks lined up, turn the pump to line up with the gear. Side note - once the timing marks are lined up and you start the engine, the marks do not line up for an ungodly amount of revolutions and did I say “ never move the crank after pulling the inj pump”

 

[JimB2]

Hi a couple pages from my manuals on setting timing on D-239 German Diesel engine.
The 250A would be same as 674 farm tractor.

 

[oldcl]

Ok I have pretty much done all this.The problem I have is to install the pump I would have to turn the pump shaft several degrees to get it to line up with drive gear key way.What good does it do to line up everything then have to turn the shaft to get in?That is the problem.The three slots in the drive gear are not enough to make it work.I guess I am asking for a miracle.Thanks so much for sending manual pages.I will go over them several times.I am 83.I have been a mechanic and machinest all my life.Never worked on a lot of diesels.I would like to know why I have to turn the shat after I have everything lined up perfect.Makes no sense to me.I bought a D239 manual.Should be here in a few days.Hope I can get some answers from it.If you think of anything else I would be grateful.Thanks C.L.

 

[JimB2]

Read the note at the bottom of the second photo, to make sure the pump does not have the second scribe line marked "L" for left rotation pumps.

 

[oldcl]

The marks are barely visible.Especially through the window .I will try and do that.

 

[oldcl]

When all the static timing is done--The keyway on the pump gear is at about 10 oclock.The keyway on the pump is strait up.

 

[JimB2]

Normally the keyway on pump gear is about 11 o'clock.
Does the engine start good if you install the pump with the gear at the 10 o'clock and ignore the scribe line?
If it is timed too fast it will kick back on the starter and too slow, hard to start many revs to start and smoke and slobber.

 

[oldcl]

This tractor has not ran in 25 years.It only has about 2000 hours on it.Would not start.I took the pump off thinking it probably just needed cleaning up.I think there was a problem with the pump and they just gave up after tinkering with it.It did start on either but never picked up.The vanes inThe prime pump were all stuck.I have the pump working.I built a fixture on my lathe where I could experiment with it.I am going to try turning the wave plate around and set timing using the other mark.We will see.

 

[MARK ROBKE]

What Jim and Red have said is spot on. I have had a few of these pumps off too, and they gave good info. One thing though, since you have rotated the engine, is it still on #1TDC, or maybe you need to pull the valve cover to verify? Normally, you set the crank at 16*(or the what ever the spec is), pull the timing window off the pump, and it should be lined up. If not lined up, you rotate the engine 1 revolution, and check the window again where it should be lined up. Now the engine is at TDC#1, ok to remove the pump. Then do not rotate the engine. The keyway on the pump will be at 11 o'clock, and all those timing marks on the gears take a lot of revolutions to line up-they only matter when the engine is apart.
All that being said, since you have the pump off, you may want to send it to a pump rebuilder to have it gone thru and calibrated on a pump stand, before reinstalling it. Good luck, Mark.

 

[oldcl]

Thanks to all you good people.One thing I noticed is that when mark is lined up in the window--the cylinder has already fired as near as I can tell.When I line up the mark through the window -the keyway is strait up on the shaft.I don't just want to get it to run-----I want to know why it ran. Some of this makes sense and some of it don't to a old mechanic. I know how to get it to TDC I ran a dirt race car for over 30 years and built hundreds of engines.Diesels just kind of threw me a curv.I am taking everyone's advice very serious.Thanks oldcl

 

[oldcl]

Well I got brave today and put the pump back on the engine.I have it running but I need to adjust the throttle and fuel.The engine hits on all 4 cylinders with no smoke.I gave out. I will mess with it some more tomorrow.At least I got to try the loader.lifted up just fine and dumps.forgot to try the steering and lift. Seems to want to run away.Anyone have any suggestions on how to adjust the two levers.

 

[JimB2]

Did you use the Scribe line in the pump or just set the keyway on the drive shaft to 11 O'clock?
If the engine is surging up and down in RPM that usually indicates lack of fuel flow to the pump or the pump is misadjusted to be running on the START position on the pump, see below.

 

[oldcl]

I think I have used the wrong mark in the window.They are barely visible.I am going to take the pump back off and turn the wave plate 180 degrees. The engine runs but does not act right.I will let you know what happens.

 

[oldcl]

Everybody has tried to help me with this problem.Thanks to you and the pictures you sent the tractor now is running right.The only thing I have to do now is set the throttle and fuel levers.Thanks to everyone. I am a gas mechanic.I had a automachine shop for several years.I have rebuilt diesel blocks but never had much esperience working on them when there was a problem.If I can ever help those that have helped me I am here.