Noisey Gears

[Fabrickator]

Im just finishing a restoration on a ‘57 JD 420U. New engine, clutch & bearing, surfaced flywheel. Starts, idles low and runs up on governor, nothing wrong. When I shift it and let the clutch out I’m getting a lot of final drive gear noise. I filled all lubricants per manual specs but it still sounds like a dry bearing or something. Tranny shits fine, reverser good, PTO and 3-point good.

Does anyone have any ideas what I could be hearing?

 

[MSD]

Did it make that noise before you worked on it or is it just new since then?

 

[Fabrickator]

What I bought was a “field find”. Hadn’t run in many years. When I went to rebuild the engine, the number 2 piston/cylinder was rusted solid. I had to apply some creative pressure to free it up, direct pressure and a baby sledge along with a car-b-que and penetrating oil and diesel.

I left the loader off and restored it to the original tractor.

 

[MSD]

Could be anything in the tranny then. Bearing rusted up or worn out most likely.

 

[Fabrickator]

That’s what I’m thinking. The noise seems to coming out of the differential or final drive. I opened the top of the trans and everything looked OK, no bad forks or chipped gears.

I wish I could hear what it “should” sound like. Not too many around to check out, most of the parade and fairs are done for a while.

 

[Fabrickator]

After sleeping on it, JD, I decided to jack it up, go through the gears and neutral and listen to the gears with my Stethoscope.

I was able to narrow down where it coming from, the main outer axle bearings. Looking at the Internal Parts Diagram it looks like I would need to remove all of the axle casting to rebuild them with new Timken bearings. I was hoping for an outside bad bearing that I could get to.
My only problem is the noise seems to be the same on both sides? What are the chances that both sides went out tougether unless he ran the whole thing out of oil. There are no leaks though?

 

[Duner Wi]

Jack up one rear wheel at a time and listen.

 

[Fabrickator]

Ok, I’ll try that. I got both wheels up right now. There’s a lot of clanking and dry rollers in there.

 

[adediesel]

please give an update to this job. I have an M that sounds like yours.

 

[Fabrickator]

I decided to open the final drive and see if there was anything wrong. The oil look good and no chipped teeth or metal in there on both sides after inspection and magnet in the drain pan. So while I was at it I drained and checked the trans oil. It was contaminated with water (milk shake)so I drained it as well and nothing in there either. I decided to do a complete flush for tranny and final drive with diesel. I ran it on jackstands w/ wheel chocks in every gear for about five minutes each at a high idle speed. I listened again and everything sounded good except 5th gear. I let it sit for a couple hours to settle and then drained the diesel and inspected it again. Still some off color on trans oil but nothing metallic, chips or filings so I’m doing a second flush today before putting new oil back in.

Sheezz, 90w gear oil is $32-65 a gallon now!

 

[Fabrickator]

I did a second, short, 5 min. “rinse” diesel flush today and it came out clean.

I also buttoned up the final drive caps and filled them with what ended up being a little over a quart each side. Whoever designed this never worked on one. To fill them you need to drizzle the 90w into the 3/8” NPT fill holes. I used a 90, with a 2” nipple but it still was very slow constantly burping. All they had to do was put another threaded hole a few inches higher than the fill hole so it doesn’t have to burp every few seconds. With the higher filler hole you could pour or pump the correct amount it until it comes out the level hole.

I’ll fill the trans tomorrow take it for another ride and report back with an update.

I just finished the paint and it turned out great. Rustoleum sprayed at 5:1 with paint thinner. I did all the body work and paint myself. The tin was in really bad condition with dents and cracks.

A while ago I plasma cut the rusted bolts to remove the rear wheel weights. It had doubles per side and I don’t need them for parades or fair events.
I put the weights on Craig’s 4-$80 and never got a bite. I finally gave them to my friend who will use them for grinder/wire wheel stands. I saw an ad somewhere where new 120lb’rs were $240 each!

 

[Powered By IH]

I put the weights on Craig’s 4-$80 and never got a bite.

If you put them on Facebook Marketplace I'm sure you could have sold them.

Facebook Marketplace is the Craigslist of today's era.

At least your friend will find a use for them!

 

[docmirror]

Just a point of reference. I drove a Porsche 928 for maybe 3000 miles with a noisy Timkin bearing. As long as it has some kind of lube, it will go a while before shedding stuff. I have a Ford 901 with a noisy axle and driving it for years. Annoying but will likely run a while.

 

[Fabrickator]

The only thing I can compare it to is my Mahindra 3616 HST. Quiet, smooth.

I won’t be taking it apart unless it’s unlivable. As long as I know there’s no metal floating around. I’ll chalk it up to being almost as old as I am. I’m 73.

Wife bought me a cool shirt

 

[Rbellucci]

Could be the new clutch disc or pilot bearing not fully seated yet, sometimes it quiets down after some run time. Worth checking the throwout bearing clearance too.

 

[ss55]

Ok, I’ll try that. I got both wheels up right now. There’s a lot of clanking and dry rollers in there.

Are there any grease jerks to put some fresh grease into the axle bearings?

 

[Fabrickator]

No, there are no zero fitting on the whole tractor.

 

[Jim.ME]

No, there are no zero fitting on the whole tractor.

You might want to check grease points in the Operator's Manual. There are supposed to be some grease zerks on your tractor. The rear axle does not have any greased bearings, as the later tractors had (which I think ss55 was referring to), because they drive into an oil lubricated final drive.

 

[Fabrickator]

I looked at the manual and yeah, there are a few grease points. Steering knuckles, generator, mines an alt. , and on the 3-point adjusters.

I filled it back with oil and took it for a drive and it sounds and feels much better. I’d say it feels like a lot of backlash, but is otherwise good.

While I took it out down my road it got a high-speed wobble around 15mph and scared me. I’ve never driven this tractor until today. I knew the front end had some problems with sloppy ness. So I found a couple of bad ball joints and bent tie rods. The guy before me did a mod to lengthen the stock steering tie rods/spindles to get more leverage with the weight of the loader. Poor man’s power steering!! I will to return them to stock length with new tie rods. The steering shaft and gear tower are OK

 

[a49deere]

Appears your front wheels are inside out also!