New crank pulley from Steiner muucchh too tight, won't go on 1941 Ford 9n on initial try

[Brian R B]

Hi all, again,

Last Thur Sept 24 I posted about 9N crankshaft pulley removal to address a bad oil leak and got great feedback. The (probably) original pulley was lightly pitted and visibly worn so I got part no ABC021/Made in Taiwan from Steiner Tractor Parts to replace the old one. Also got a caramel cow tail candy from Steiner, which was welcome and tasty. Not bashing Steiner, or anyone here, but the pulley in a hasty and quick attempt on my part to fit on the crank, pulley with a chamfered hole, is unbelievably tight, so much that I walked away fast from possible disaster and avoided tapping/hammering/pounding the pulley with a rubber mallet. Furthermore, it was late in the day. So, when I revisit this in a couple days, the 9N2N8N Forum archives have noted that 1) too tight aftermarket pulleys have been noted for at least one decade(!), 2) heat might help (all I have is a propane torch and the kitchen oven), 3) emory cloth or fine sandpaper on the inside of the pulley might help, 4) using the nut to press on the pulley might help, 5), taking the pulley to a machine shop for a slight boring out is an option, 6) etc., etc., most all of the aforementioned not guaranteed to solve the matter and even risking danger such as munging the crank. So any thoughts on how to proceed would be most welcome. We're kinda disappointed about this and once it gets solve, wonder what might await us nect, such as improper fit between the outside of the pulley and the new rope seals or improperly dimensioned pulley sheave with related belt fitment issues and what that might mean. Oh well.

Thanks for listening,
Brian

 

[Jim.ME]

Have you taken the issue up with Steiner to see if they will do anything about it?

Have you mic'd the crank stub OD and pulley bore to find the amount of interference? Real micrometers, not calipers.

 

[HarryVanderpool]

Serves ya right for not buying from Yesterday's Tractor!!

 

[Hobo,NC]

I have had good luck aligning the key to pully, putting a slight tapper on the U slot on the pully and using a Harmonic balancer installer to press the pully on. Its a common process in my world other than normally I have a key to get it started in alignment and keep it aligned. I would have marked the crank in relation to the key and knew exactly where to start the pully. The reason I put a little tapper on the end of the U slot is if I were off a tad it would self align. I prefer a press fit over a sloppy fit any day of the week.

"The cost of doing business"

 

[Brian R B]

Thanks gents. Some responses:

taken the issue up with Steiner. Thought about that and might call them, wanted to check here first.

mic'd the crank stub OD and pulley bore. All I have are cheapie plastic calipers but am helping a friend put shingles on his shed roof today and he's got all the tools for everything imaginable so I can get the pulley ID measured at least.

not buying from Yesterday's Tractor. Wonder if what they sell is Part ABC021/Made in Taiwan.

Hobo, NC's response. Aforementioned friend might have an installer he can loan me.

I watched Dan and Rachel Gingell on YouTube* and they use a rubber mallet with a steel end to tap on the pulley! The pulley starts going on and then the video switches to the next step and successful pulley seating is implied.

We'll get it done and I will report what happened to me, in the spirit of helping another 9N2N8N traveler.

*Ford Engine Rebuild, Part 4 of 4

(time: 5:25)

 

[Hobo,NC]

I’m working on a bota installing rear axle seals every video skips a procedure that I would like to know how they defeated the lock on the axle nut. I have my doubts she aligned the keyway but maybe her luck is that good. The U is what she called a Knoch : ). In theory you should never drive a crank pully on I will admit I have hammered on more than my share. I have been doing this type of work 53 years I would wanger the first 20 I did not have a tool to press them on.

I know to scribe/paint a witness mark on the crank to align the crank pully I learned the hard way. If you use an installer hopefully it uses a bearing instead of a nut again the pully to push it on. I would think a parts store loaner tool selection would have this took so check that out.

I know you don’t want to buy another tool in my world it’s the cost of doing business.

 

[Eman85]

Anyone that doesn't like cow tails is questionable.
Micrometers will tell you how much interference fit you have. Autozone lends harmonic balancer installers, harbor Freight sells a decent one.

 

[Tall T]

I have had good luck aligning the key to pully, putting a slight tapper on the U slot on the pully and using a Harmonic balancer installer to press the pully on. Its a common process in my world other than normally I have a key to get it started in alignment and keep it aligned. I would have marked the crank in relation to the key and knew exactly where to start the pully. The reason I put a little tapper on the end of the U slot is if I were off a tad it would self align. I prefer a press fit over a sloppy fit any day of the week.

"The cost of doing business"

this may be redundant but . . .
I've experienced that with pulleys and keys, If the key, especially the quarter moon kind, is put in first and the top side of the key and the pulley groove not lubricated the pulley hub can make the key rock upward at the back preventing the pulley's inward travel.
sometimes a long skinny punch can get in behind the pulley to tap the key back down and into place again.

T

 

[TheOldHokie]

Thanks gents. Some responses:

taken the issue up with Steiner. Thought about that and might call them, wanted to check here first.

mic'd the crank stub OD and pulley bore. All I have are cheapie plastic calipers but am helping a friend put shingles on his shed roof today and he's got all the tools for everything imaginable so I can get the pulley ID measured at least.

not buying from Yesterday's Tractor. Wonder if what they sell is Part ABC021/Made in Taiwan.

Hobo, NC's response. Aforementioned friend might have an installer he can loan me.

I watched Dan and Rachel Gingell on YouTube* and they use a rubber mallet with a steel end to tap on the pulley! The pulley starts going on and then the video switches to the next step and successful pulley seating is implied.

We'll get it done and I will report what happened to me, in the spirit of helping another 9N2N8N traveler.

*Ford Engine Rebuild, Part 4 of 4

(time: 5:25)

To get an accurate and reliable measurement of interference you need a micrometer and dial bore gauge or equivalent. The pulley is supposed to be a light interference fit.

TOH

 

[MeanGene1]

Any machine/speed shop that does performance stuff deals with this all the time- a lot of the replacement pulleys and dampeners these days come from the land of almost right and will tend be be on the tight side of tolerances. If you don't have the correct measuring tools, find someone who does and get it right. Anyone who remembers the early small block Chebbies with the press-fit dampeners and no retainer bolts will have horror stories for you. Many people back then would home-loosen them a bit to make installation easier, then later find the dampener self-installed in the radiator

 

[Brian R B]

All done. I talked with the parts vendor (Steiner) last week and they graciously sent a new pulley, and asked me to return the original with a Steiner-supplied UPS label. While on the phone with Steiner, the man at Steiner mic'd his pulley (1.18 inches) and I did mine (1.17 inches) - inside diameter. So while I was waiting for the replacement, I did some tentative messing around and with propane torch heat and WD40 on the crank I was able to get the 1.17 pulley started... Using a big hammer and a block of white oak wood it became evident that the original was going to work after all. What I did not do was enlarge/flare the notch in the pulley, as one person recommended, and as the pulley passed the point of no return it became evident that alignment might be a bit off. (I don't own a puller.) Ultimately, it did fit, but I am not sure if trying to rotate the pulley with a hammer/punch for better alignment helped. It did not do the pulley any favors, meaning in the pulley notch where I positioned the tip of the narrow punch, there was a little deformation which I filed smooth and which was not in contact with the seal when everything was together. The replacement pulley, as seen in the picture of feet/toes and both pulleys, does not have the lip/flange which the original does, meaning (for me) that it was possible to drive it in far enough (not all the way, seated) so that the top rope seal seated on the pulley. One cannot, I think remove or install the timing gear cover when the ***original*** pulley is seated all the way, due to the flange. But note, for me at least, I drove the replacement pulley almost a little bit too far to allow fitting the timing gear cover, because the cover does not just drop and slide straight down, due to the water pump studs sticking out of the front of the engine block. I came up with this scheme (driving the replacement pulley part way on), thinking, possibly without justification, that it might be better not to drive the pulley on the shaft, what with slightly off alignment, etc. And, while fromicating with the timing gear cover, I did the soft metal on that gear no favors by cussing and making contact between gear and cover. Anyway, thanks for the help. Until my next 9N crisis, all the best...