1973 3400 clutch issue

[dsebens]

I m guessing I m going to hear what I don t want to hear but here goes.

It is an 8 speed with live pto. The clutch has very positive engagement with no slippage. When working the clutch it feels like the flywheel might have some hot spots (it s a little grabby).

But lately I ve been noticing it wanting to creep in gear with the clutch fully pushed. It makes it hard to get into gear. The actual engagement and disengagement feels just fine. If I put it in 8th gear and force the clutch to slip a bit it will usually work fine the rest of the time with no dragging

What s the thoughts. Assuming a clutch job is in the future?

 

[Ultradog MN]

Since you didn't say, have you tried
adjusting it?

 

[dsebens]

Sorry, I tried adjusting the linkage but when I pulled the pin I couldn t move the clutch arm by hand to line it up so I just adjusted until I could put the pin back in.

Out of the whole travel free play is probably between 2-1.5 inches from the top maybe.

 

[shaun wallace]

Pilot bearing failing or rust on input shaft/disc splines.

 

[dsebens]

(quoted from post at 09:32:21 02/10/20) Pilot bearing failing or rust on input shaft/disc splines.

That would really explain its symptoms, guess I will be splitting this in the future

 

[dsebens]

So this tractor has a ford loader on it. Whats the opinion during splitting. Keeping in mind that I only have one tractor but could probably get the neighbors loader to help out.

Should I remove the loader then split or should I crib up the loader and the front half of the tractor at the same time and just unbolt the loader from the rear axle and pull the rear half back to split it?

Also if I let the bucket rest on the ground I would assume the rear mount on the loader would want to go towards the ground when unbolted from the axle, right?

 

[shaun wallace]

Lower loader and remove rear mounting, let rear down and roll rear back is simplest way.

 

[dsebens]

So my i&t manual says to leave the steering gear box and arms attached to the rear half. Does that sound right or should I do it a different way

 

[Sean in PA]

The steering gear box is mounted to the top of the transmission bell housing, so it is logical to leave it there when you do an engine-trans split.

 

[dsebens]

(quoted from post at 19:53:45 02/10/20) The steering gear box is mounted to the top of the transmission bell housing, so it is logical to leave it there when you do an engine-trans split.

Right but it s having me leave all the steering linkage attached to the gear box. I assume to save from undoing the hydraulic fittings on the power steering rams.

I ll just follow the manual unless I have to improvise.

 

[Sean in PA]

Right but it s having me leave all the steering linkage attached to the gear box.

No, you would need to disconnect the steering linkage, either at the front spindles, or at the steering arms on the side of the steering gear. To split the tractor between the engine and transmission the front axle needs to stay with the engine and the transmission needs to move away from the engine, so any fixed length hard parts between the transmission (and steering gear on top) and the front axle or other parts of the front of the tractor, need to be disconnected at one end or the other, including the radius rods, drag links and power steering lines. Most folks disconnect everything at the rear end, meaning disconnect the drag links from the arms, the radius rods from the trans housing, and the power steering lines from the control valve on the steering column, as most folks use wedges at the front axle to keep the front from tilting sideways when it is split and leave the front half in place and roll the rear half away, so you don't have to worry about parts dragging on the floor as you roll the rear half away.

 

[dsebens]

I've got it split, the manual is a little confusing on wiring the fingers down. It says to depress them, do they mean to just wire them down to take the slack out or is this step not even needed?

 

[shaun wallace]

Never did that removing pressure plate. Could put little blocks in there before get blots to lose. Just make easier to line up disc when going back.

 

[dsebens]

I have LPTO 8 speed with a triangle drive disc. The drive disc is 10 spline and the PTO disc is 29 spline.

https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/Ford-3000_Clutch-Kit-11-Inch-IPTO_11126113.html

Says it is for IPTO but I feel that is mislabeled right? Wouldn't IPTO have no clutch disk since it is hydraulic?


Also I have a bench brake lathe at work that can turn flywheels, but since this doesn't mount flat can I still turn the flywheel or should I just leave it alone? I don't see any obvious hot spots but they might show up after turning.

 

[Destroked 450]

3400 doesn't have hydraulic pto engagement, it has two stage clutch like a 3000 with mechanical engagement.
Does your tractor had inboard wet disc brakes or outboard drum brakes.
Have you checked the weep hole in the bottom of the clutch housing, if it gets stopped up you could get water and or oil on the clutch disc, that will make one drag, collapsed pressure plate finger would be the other.

 

[dsebens]

I know I have live pto. The kit says for independent pto. My field fix bell housing cotter pin is installed and not much crud in the bell housing. The adjustment screws are all the way in and the fingers were still a little loose so I m not sure what s going on with it.

I read online if you resurface the flywheel to also take the same thousandths off the mounting for the pressure plate.

Is there any measurement of clutch surface to pp mounting bosses to make sure it hasn t been incorrectly turned?

 

[dsebens]

So with me having a 10 spline triangle clutch disk and a 29 spline pto disk do you guys think this is just mislabled?

The triangle clutch it comes with looks to be the right one when looking up on the New Holland parts lookup. I just would hate to order the wrong one and deal with an exchange.

 

[Sean in PA]

The only 3000 tractors that had independent PTO were the ones with the Select-O-Speed transmissions and those used a special torque limiting clutch that it not like a manual transmission clutch. (Yes, I know that the 3550 could have independent PTO with an 8 speed, but that is not a 3000, it is just a model in the 3000 series).

I would call the folks at Yesterday's tractors and ask them if it is a typo. I think that it probably is.

 

[dsebens]

Called YT and they said that one I linked was indeed for IPTO. The correct one is https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/11126076_Dual-Clutch-Kit-with-Triangular-disc_18210.htm

Kind of stinks that it is $170 more but what they hey, it's only money right?

I was able to chuck the flywheel up to our brake lathe and took .007" off the clutch surface to deglaze it and took .007" off the PP mounting surface to maintain the same distance from the clutch surface so it should all be good.

 

[dsebens]

Got the clutch bolted up and ready to go back together. Was just double checking the clutch adjustments, the drive clutch adjustment looks basically right, I need to bring my good dial caliper home from work for confirmation but it is close. The PTO one is at .110" while putting slight downward pressure on the clutch finger to take up slack. Is this the correct way? The book says 50 to 54 thou, should I adjust it or leave it?

 

[dsebens]

(quoted from post at 22:49:46 02/19/20) Got the clutch bolted up and ready to go back together. Was just double checking the clutch adjustments, the drive clutch adjustment looks basically right, I need to bring my good dial caliper home from work for confirmation but it is close. The PTO one is at .110" while putting slight downward pressure on the clutch finger to take up slack. Is this the correct way? The book says 50 to 54 thou, should I adjust it or leave it?

Ended up pulling the steering gear and adjusting the pto clutch. It was way to loose. I had the column off anyway to access the top trans bolt because of the loader so it wasn't any more work really.

 

[dsebens]

Clutch is in, adjusted, and functioning correctly!

The job wasn't "hard" but it was definitely labor intensive!

Thanks for the advice guys.