No Ballast Resistor

[DeanG]

Spent a a lot of seat time as a kind on a 8n. After many years, I finally have one I can call my own - late '50 model with side distributor.
Tractor came to me w/o headlights, which I understand were a dealer option. Planning on adding headlights and a rear work light, but before doing so I'm considering the 12v - grd conversion.
Looked thru the 75 Tips and made note of #30. In looking at my tractor, it is 6v + grd and has a round coil and DOES NOT have a ballast resistor. (I just went and checked after reading #30, again)
If I go to the 12v system, the coil will need to be replaced (Yes/No)?
If I go to the 12v system, since my tractor does not have a ballast resistor, will I need one (Yes/No)? If yes, can you recommend a P/N.

On the same subject of headlights, can someone give me some rough measurements as to where to drill the dog legs?

Appreciate the info. I apologize in advance if this has been discussed ad nauseum, but I looked thru 19 pages of posts in this forum and did not find what I was looking for.

 

[R Geiger]

Ballast resister never needed with side mount distributor. I went with 12 volt coil when I did mine!

 

[Smokeonthewater]

Why 12v?....

My tractor is 12v but only because I got it that way and didn't want to spend the money to convert back to 6v

This post was edited by Smokeonthewater on 07/04/2021 at 10:32 pm.

 

[Smokeonthewater]

...

 

[Bruce (VA)]

The 6v side coil on an 8N never had a ballast resistor.

If you convert it to 12v, go to NAPA and get p/n IC14SB. That's a coil w/ 3.25 ohms of internal resistance, so no external resistor is needed.

If you want to keep your 6v coil on a 12v conversion, to do it correctly, you will need to measure the internal resistance of your 6v coil and then find a ceramic resistor of a value that when added to the value of your coil totals 4 ohms in order to keep coil current below 4 amps.

So, if your 6v coil is 2 ohms, you will need a 2 ohm ceramic resistor.

Or just put any old ceramic resistor in line and hope for the best.
75 Tips

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

I highly suggest you invest in the ESSENTIAL MANUALS if ya wanna be an N owner, and read religiously. If you want to learn about the history of the FORD N tractor and beyond, read, and before you start buying new parts and making changes without a clue on how or why. Scroll thru the archives with any keyword and you'll get a slew of old posts as most questions and answers have been posted before. The FORD N-Series used the front mount distributor from 1939 thru 1949. It required that the Ballast Resistor, p/n 8N-12250, was in the circuit. In early 8N production FORD revamped to the angle (side) mount distributor. It DID NOT use the Ballast Resistor. It's your tractor and you can do whatever you want, but realize that one newbie mistake when they first get their machine is to think it must be switched over to 12V. Why? Is it running now on 6V? Nothing wrong with 12V but also realize many conversions are done incorrectly and this will produce more headaches such as non-starting issues. In addition to the manuals, get a download of WIRING PICTOGRAMS by JMOR. He has all the correct ways to wire these N's whether 6V or 12V. Whether 6V POS/GRN or 12V NEG/GRN, if the system is not wired correctly for that setup, you will have issues. As far as wiring goes, yeah, lighting kits were always dealer optional accessories and many farmers tried to wire their own. Incorrect lighting wiring is also a big cause of electrical issues. The headlights had two punchouts on the dogleg sheet metal where the farmer could mount the lights as they used the Winged Medallion mounting bracket with a rectangular backing plate behind the dogleg. In 1949 FORD made other major changes as well as the side mount DIST and another was they switched the headlights to a round cup and square backing plate that only required one bolt hole. Punchouts may have been eliminated at this point. So, get the manuals and do some more homework before making a decision and certainly before you start buying new parts and swapping things out.

FORD 8N TRACTOR OEM WIRING DIAGRAMS BEFORE S/N 263843:

FORD 8N TRACTOR OEM WIRING DIAGRAMS AFTER S/N 263843:

WIRING PICTOGRAMS by JMOR 12v 8N WITH SIDE MOUNT:

PICTOGRAM FOR 12V USING FRONT MOUNT:

FORD TRACTOR 8N LIGHTING KIT WIRING AFTER 1949:

FORD TRACTOR 8N ESSENTIAL MANUALS:

Tim Daley(MI)

 

[warbaby]

why are these pictures so small?

 

[Ultradog MN]

Lol.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 10:54:03 07/05/21) Lol.

nly offer large & small....no medium or average! :twisted:

 

[DeanG]

First of all, I want to thank all of those that responded.

As for converting to 12v, it really makes no difference to me. The tractor runs fine in its current 6v configuration. So as suggested, why fix what's not broke. The only reason I considered 12v was because it opens up options for lights - LEDs in particular. However, as someone suggested here on another thread LEDs may not be the way to go for lighting when plowing snow. LEDs don't generate enough heat to keep snow from accumulating, whereas standard light heat up and will melt the snow.

Really appreciate the pictures of headlight placement. The doglegs on my tractor lack the knock-outs.

Lastly, I found JMOR's drawings after I posted initially, and I do have 2 of the suggested, essential manuals - they were included when I bought the tractor.

 

[MeanGene1]

Every time the 12V thing comes up, the purists have a cow lol. My present 8N is just like yours, a 50 SD with no lights, only has 1100 hours and is completely original, except that when the charging system quit, I went 12V, and did the same with my 850 that did not charge when I got it. Basically, the 6V system was state of the art- in 1950. Better, simple options are available now. I used the kit from the site for both, which gave me the alt with the correct pulley, and also charges from idle, and the brackets and belt, for a very reasonable price. I did not use the conversion wiring harness from the kits, instead I removed the old system complete, but saved everything in case someone wanted to change it back in the future. I use heavy guage fresh wire everywhere, and a four-post car-type solenoid, as I have done on many from scratch race cars in the past. One can go either way on coil/resister, external resister or internal. Type 35 battery fits very well. Also makes it very easy to hook up lights from accessory then a toggle switch. The tractors now spin very fast and start instantly with 12V on the 6V starters, a trick I learned from my gramps in the 60s when he did it on his old REO and IH trucks. There really is no downside except it is not original, and no more roww-roww-roww lol... We also used to do 8V setups for things that had to start in the NY winters, like the 8N I plowed snow with as a kid- also worked very well when set up correctly, but also sends the purists on tilt

 

[Smokeonthewater]

I'm definitely not a purist, or at least not a hard core one, and although I just polished off a double cheeseburger, I didn't have a cow either... just a simple question since often folks assume that a 12v conversion will be an improvement without really thinking about it... just wanted to encourage him to think on it....

Fwiw... my tractor has plastic lights on the back and a 2 position light switch... 1st click headlights and markers... second click adds flashers... I even put a horn on it... that said, I would prefer to see a generator on the side of my 73 year old tractor...

Couple of these pics also show the headlights I measured for you...
Mine being a 48 SHOULD have the lights in knockouts but being 73 yrs old who knows what is or isn't original... looks right to me but you be the judge on if this is where you want your lights or not.

 

[MeanGene1]

Smokeonthewater- VERY nice looking tractor! One reason I did both of mine the way I did is I have several 50s-60s Ford cars, hot rods n race setups, and they are all set up the same way and work very well that way, and I always have spares on the shelf, solenoids, coils etc.- and although not original, the 12V deal just flat works better than 6V- but just not original. I grew up in my gramps' shops, both an IH dealership, and the home shop where the farm equipment, trucks and lime spreaders were serviced, and stuff was always standardized when possible, nearest parts store was 11 miles away from home. We had 3 REO/ Studebaker deuce n a halfs as lime spreaders, and converted all 3 from the military 24V system to the commercial 12V, and also converted the early 50's REO and IH trucks from 6V to 12V, same size batteries etc. As I said, there is no downside except it is not original- which is why I saved all the original 6V stuff from the tractors in case I sell them to a purist that likes the roww-roww-roww lol

 

[Smokeonthewater]

Thanks

I still say not a purist but I do LIKE that sound lol

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

here we go again

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

There is nothing wrong with a 12V system, I never said that, and then, too, nothing wrong with a 6V system either. OEM manuals will show you how it was originally so you know what you are dealing with. The side mount distributor DID NOT use the Ballast Resistor so NO, you don't need one. If you have a 6V coil still, you will need to add an external 1-OHM ceramic resistor in the circuit if you want 12V. You can delete this item if you simply get a 12V round can coil in place. Since your intent is to add lights, be sure you get 12V lamps, not 6V. If you use 12V and you put 6V lamps in, you will let the smoke out them the moment power is applied. FWIW & FYI: SEALED BEAM headlamps are industry standard part numbers: 6V = 4019 and 12V = 4419. The 6V Taillight bulb is #63 and the 12V one is #67. OEM FORD 8N-15500 Implement Lamp used 6V-RP11 'bayonet style' bulb soldered in place. Non-original Sealed Beam 4 worklight is p/n 4510.

Tim Daley(MI)