AMT 600 roller chains

[oldhawaiitea]

Aloha! I have a very old AMT 600. It s a 5x4. I ve just taken off some old chains and purchased new chains. The new chains don t have a master link, which is problem number one. I am going to return those and get a set that have the connector links.

But I measured the existing chains and they re 70 1/2 inches long. The dealer says the longest chain they have for my machine is 51 inches, which is what I bought.

Is anyone aware of a very early AMT 600 with longer chains, and if so, do you have any idea where I might purchase some?

Mahalo.

 

[Jim.ME]

Welcome to the Forums.

This is what I see in the online parts catalog and suggest you review with your John Deere dealer.

From looking at parts catalog PC2152, for the AMT600, it appears the 37'' and 51'' dimensions are referring to some of the drive line component such as the axles. Both the 37'' and 51'' call for the same drive chains: 2 each AM128449, Roller Chain, (TYPE 50, 5/8") (112 LINKS). It appears a #50 half link may be required for each chain, part number SW50OLUS, a separate purchase from the chain. And the current part number for the connector link (one required for each chain) is SW50COUS, also shown as a separate purchase for each chain. I did not see a kit with the chain, half and connector links as one item.

The catalog shows each chain has 112 links. #50 roller chain should be .625'' pitch per link. 112 times .625 is 70 inches plus .3125 (for the half link) equals 70-5/16'' which is close to your 70-1/2''. Your measurement of the old chain does not take into account wear of the old chain which would make it longer than a new chain, counting the links in your old chain is better than measuring.

Did you lay the old and new out side by side and compare the lengths or number of links/pitches? Here is a link to the parts catalog, open to the page DRIVE SPROCKETS, CHAIN AND AXLES (51") - ST555535

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/83868/referrer/navigation/pgId/42346622

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 17:11:59 09/09/23)
Welcome to the Forums.

This is what I see in the online parts catalog and suggest you review with your John Deere dealer.

From looking at parts catalog PC2152, for the AMT600, it appears the 37'' and 51'' dimensions are referring to some of the drive line component such as the axles. Both the 37'' and 51'' call for the same drive chains: 2 each AM128449, Roller Chain, (TYPE 50, 5/8") (112 LINKS). It appears a #50 half link may be required for each chain, part number SW50OLUS, a separate purchase from the chain. And the current part number for the connector link (one required for each chain) is SW50COUS, also shown as a separate purchase for each chain. I did not see a kit with the chain, half and connector links as one item.

The catalog shows each chain has 112 links. #50 roller chain should be .625'' pitch per link. 112 times .625 is 70 inches plus .3125 (for the half link) equals 70-5/16'' which is close to your 70-1/2''. Your measurement of the old chain does not take into account wear of the old chain which would make it longer than a new chain, counting the links in your old chain is better than measuring.

Did you lay the old and new out side by side and compare the lengths or number of links/pitches? Here is a link to the parts catalog, open to the page DRIVE SPROCKETS, CHAIN AND AXLES (51") - ST555535

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/83868/referrer/navigation/pgId/42346622

I did not do that! I didn t want to get the new chain at all dirty in case I couldn t use it. But thank you so much for your explanation. That makes so much more sense.

 

[coonie minnie]

Consider bulk 50 chain and cut to length.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 05:39:10 09/10/23) Consider bulk 50 chain and cut to length.

Thanks. Where I live we don t have much. Even a trip back to the dealer to return the new chains I bought will be a 1.5 hour drive each way. I haven t gotten much help from them. They re nice and hard working, but i haven t found anyone there who knows any more than I do-and I m completely ignorant.
What I d really love to do is make the new chains work, but I don t see how I can get them over the front sprockets without getting further into dismantling the machine than I m comfortable with. It s old and I worry about breaking hard-to-replace parts, and the service manual calls for tools I ve never heard of.
So I m thinking I ll order new chains online, that separate, and try to get the dealer to take these back when I have time to get back down to Hilo.

 

[Jim.ME]

(quoted from post at 11:42:25 09/10/23)

(quoted from post at 05:39:10 09/10/23) Consider bulk 50 chain and cut to length.

Thanks. Where I live we don t have much. Even a trip back to the dealer to return the new chains I bought will be a 1.5 hour drive each way. I haven t gotten much help from them. They re nice and hard working, but i haven t found anyone there who knows any more than I do-and I m completely ignorant.
What I d really love to do is make the new chains work, but I don t see how I can get them over the front sprockets without getting further into dismantling the machine than I m comfortable with. It s old and I worry about breaking hard-to-replace parts, and the service manual calls for tools I ve never heard of.
So I m thinking I ll order new chains online, that separate, and try to get the dealer to take these back when I have time to get back down to Hilo.

Last night you posted you had not opened and looked at the chain because you didn't want to get it dirty. I have to wonder, have you actually opened one of the chain packages and looked at it to see if it is just a piece of chain about 70 inches long, or if it is an endless loop, since last night's post?

If you got the chain of the current part number I posted (RE28723 was the old part number for it), they should be just straight chain, not an endless loop. Have you looked at one of them, out of the package? Open it carefully in a clean place, lay them out on some newspaper, cardboard, sheet of poly, or such, and check.

I have opened packages to compare to an old part and returned them to the dealer if they are wrong. Minimize package damage when opening and keep them clean. If wrong put them back in the package and return them. Electrical parts are the ones commonly refused for return, if the packaging has been opened.

Call the dealer, tell them your concern, and see what they say about opening a package and comparing the new chain to your old chain. The parts catalog indicates they are just 112 links of chain, and you buy a connecting link and a half link separate. If they are in the package as endless loops, there should be a connecting link already installed (they can be hard to spot), so you wouldn't need to buy the connecting links. Open and look if you haven't already.

Why are you changing the chains? Are they worn out, jumping the sprockets, or breaking? What is the condition of the sprockets? If the teeth on the sprockets have a hook worn in them that will shorten chain life and can cause breakage. If so, they should be changed as well.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 09:57:08 09/10/23)

(quoted from post at 11:42:25 09/10/23)

(quoted from post at 05:39:10 09/10/23) Consider bulk 50 chain and cut to length.

Thanks. Where I live we don t have much. Even a trip back to the dealer to return the new chains I bought will be a 1.5 hour drive each way. I haven t gotten much help from them. They re nice and hard working, but i haven t found anyone there who knows any more than I do-and I m completely ignorant.
What I d really love to do is make the new chains work, but I don t see how I can get them over the front sprockets without getting further into dismantling the machine than I m comfortable with. It s old and I worry about breaking hard-to-replace parts, and the service manual calls for tools I ve never heard of.
So I m thinking I ll order new chains online, that separate, and try to get the dealer to take these back when I have time to get back down to Hilo.

Last night you posted you had not opened and looked at the chain because you didn't want to get it dirty. I have to wonder, have you actually opened one of the chain packages and looked at it to see if it is just a piece of chain about 70 inches long, or if it is an endless loop, since last night's post?

If you got the chain of the current part number I posted (RE28723 was the old part number for it), they should be just straight chain, not an endless loop. Have you looked at one of them, out of the package? Open it carefully in a clean place, lay them out on some newspaper, cardboard, sheet of poly, or such, and check.

I have opened packages to compare to an old part and returned them to the dealer if they are wrong. Minimize package damage when opening and keep them clean. If wrong put them back in the package and return them. Electrical parts are the ones commonly refused for return, if the packaging has been opened.

Call the dealer, tell them your concern, and see what they say about opening a package and comparing the new chain to your old chain. The parts catalog indicates they are just 112 links of chain, and you buy a connecting link and a half link separate. If they are in the package as endless loops, there should be a connecting link already installed (they can be hard to spot), so you wouldn't need to buy the connecting links. Open and look if you haven't already.

Why are you changing the chains? Are they worn out, jumping the sprockets, or breaking? What is the condition of the sprockets? If the teeth on the sprockets have a hook worn in them that will shorten chain life and can cause breakage. If so, they should be changed as well.

I have confirmed the part number AM128449 on the outside of the box. I ve gone practically blind trying to find a connecting link. It should be easier to spot on this new chain, which has a coating of light oil, than on the chain I just took off, which was pretty dirty. I know what the connector link that I took off looks like, and there is nothing like that on the new chain. I have called the dealer to ask whether there is a connecting link that I m just not seeing, maybe some new design, but the man I was able to speak with, who I believe may have been a salesman, said he didn t know, and I needed to talk to the woman I usually deal with. I know how busy she is, and someday she ll call me back, but she s probably going to say she doesn t know either.

Yes, I laid out some clean material and then set the new chain next to the old chain. They are the same length, but the old chain has a connector link, while the chains I just bought from the dealer appear to be continuous.

I m changing the chains because I believe they got stretched by a job last year. We had raised the chain supports to their highest level, and the top and bottom of the chain were rubbing on each other. Also, the chain had worn a groove into the rubber pad of the chain support almost down to the metal L frame.

I had to buy the new type of chain support, with the idler, and figured I would go ahead and change the chains at the same time.

I am quite baffled by what I m seeing. The new chain is really close in length to the old chain, so I m not so sure that switching them is going to do much good. But something has definitely changed in the last few years. The top and bottom of the chain did not used to slap together. So other than the chain support and the chain itself, I m not sure what else I could do.

The sprockets look like they re fine. I don t see any uneven wear on them.

 

[Jim.ME]

When you say the new ones are continuous, I understand that as they are in a loop now, not a chain you can lay out straight like the old one when separated at the master/connecting link? You say they are the same length, are you looking at them in a loop, or straight? I'm just trying to be sure; I'm not misunderstanding. How about posting a picture of them side by side and a couple of the sprockets.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 11:58:30 09/10/23)
When you say the new ones are continuous, I understand that as they are in a loop now, not a chain you can lay out straight like the old one when separated at the master/connecting link? You say they are the same length, are you looking at them in a loop, or straight? I'm just trying to be sure; I'm not misunderstanding. How about posting a picture of them side by side and a couple of the sprockets.

img] file:///var/mobile/Library/SMS/Attachments/11/01/BFC43A56-8A96-4A31-8E76-9BA51047B584/71600553924__6B44D7CB-DBA7-4FCE-945C-E2057DF52255.HEIC[/img]

Not sure whether you will be able to see the photo. I clicked on image, then copied the photo from my phone and got this weird link that I can see from my side. Let me know if you can see it in order to take a photo, I had to double up my existing chain. I ve got tons of pictures of the new ones, because I have tried blowing up the photos, so I can post those once I understand how to do that. Happy to take photos of the sprockets too, but first, let me please know whether you can make any sense of what I just tried to post in terms of an image. Mahalo

Hold on, I gotta make these photo file smaller before I can upload them. But I did see how I upload.

Apparently, there’s no way to do this from my phone. I have to go up to my house and boot up my computer. I will do that now, but it’ll be a few minutes.

This post was edited by oldhawaiitea on 09/10/2023 at 12:12 pm.

 

[wore out]

Grab an old chain and take it to a farm supply store that has good American-made roller chain such as ''Diamond'' on a bulk roll and match up the size and number of links you need and have them cut it for you.

Pick up a couple of connector links and ''half links'' and you're all set, hopefully with some extra $$$ left in your pocket.

Lots of places to buy on-line, as well.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 12:03:43 09/10/23)

(quoted from post at 11:58:30 09/10/23)
When you say the new ones are continuous, I understand that as they are in a loop now, not a chain you can lay out straight like the old one when separated at the master/connecting link? You say they are the same length, are you looking at them in a loop, or straight? I'm just trying to be sure; I'm not misunderstanding. How about posting a picture of them side by side and a couple of the sprockets.

img] file:///var/mobile/Library/SMS/Attachments/11/01/BFC43A56-8A96-4A31-8E76-9BA51047B584/71600553924__6B44D7CB-DBA7-4FCE-945C-E2057DF52255.HEIC[/img]

Not sure whether you will be able to see the photo. I clicked on image, then copied the photo from my phone and got this weird link that I can see from my side. Let me know if you can see it in order to take a photo, I had to double up my existing chain. I ve got tons of pictures of the new ones, because I have tried blowing up the photos, so I can post those once I understand how to do that. Happy to take photos of the sprockets too, but first, let me please know whether you can make any sense of what I just tried to post in terms of an image. Mahalo

Hold on, I gotta make these photo file smaller before I can upload them. But I did see how I upload.

Apparently, there s no way to do this from my phone. I have to go up to my house and boot up my computer. I will do that now, but it ll be a few minutes.

ttps://forumphotos.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/mvphoto109558.jpg[/img]
OK. I can upload one of four. My phone won't take small pictures, and my computer can't reduce the file size enough to comply with this forum's 300K max. I am going to try to take from really far away, then crop, then reduce. For now, this is the only one I have. It's one side of one of the new chains.

OK. Here's my latest attempt. It's hard to get a good picture of the sprockets!


This post was edited by oldhawaiitea on 09/10/2023 at 01:17 pm.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

Our only farm supply store closed about 20 years ago. We now have a little tractor supply in Hilo, which I will check with, but really nothing on this Island.

 

[Jim.ME]

I couldn't open your first picture; I can see this one.

It appears the chain is what I was calling a loop. The parts catalog description could be better. It looked to me like it would be just a length of chain the way they show the chain, master connecting link and half link.

If every connecting link pin has the same rolled over end (as visible in the picture), on both sides of the chain, it would mean they spun the ends of the link they connected the chain ends with to make the loop, similar to what is done on a chainsaw chain that has no detachable connecting link.

If you want to use those chains, you can use a grinder and grind the ends off the pins of a connecting pin link and use a punch to drive them out of the link plate on the side you ground the pin heads off. Then buy and use a connecting link, like your old one to connect the ends after you run the chain on the sprockets. You might want to buy a couple half links as well to save a 3-hour trip, if they are needed. They might not be needed; depends on how much adjustment you have.

Or as coonie minnie posted you could purchase bulk #50 chain and the links mentioned and make them to length using the same procedure of grinding the ends off the pins in a link and taking the chain apart. You would need about 12 feet. 10 feet and 50 feet are commonly sold bulk lengths, some places may have 5-foot lengths. If there are any industrial stores around you, you might find one that will sell buy the foot off a 50-foot roll. I would suggest getting a couple extra connecting links in any case. I am guessing shipping to Hawaii can add up, so I don't know how the cost plays out between the JD chains you have in hand (you should just need to buy the connecting and half links) or finding and buying bulk from another source. If you buy bulk and need to get it in two pieces due to length available, I suggest getting both pieces from one vendor, and of the same brand. The choice is yours.

 

[Jim.ME]

Paint is one program you can use to reduce the size of pictures. I generally use that program and resize by pixels to no more than 860 on the longest side. There are others, that is the one I am familiar with. I think some people email the pictures on their phone to themselves, after selecting a reduced size format for the email.

I hope the chain discussion has helped.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 13:45:48 09/10/23) Paint is one program you can use to reduce the size of pictures. I generally use that program and resize by pixels to no more than 860 on the longest side. There are others, that is the one I am familiar with. I think some people email the pictures on their phone to themselves, after selecting a reduced size format for the email.

I hope the chain discussion has helped.

Thanks! It s pretty much confirmed I haven t lost my mind, and have two choices: order what I really need online right now, and hope I can return the chains I bought from the dealer, or wait and drive down there and have the dealer show me how they think I could possibly mount these on my AMT, and then order the chains I need.
It really amazes me that they changed the design to a continuous loop and kept the same part number as when it was a length connected with a connector link.
I will pay a fortune for shipping, but at least I will have my AMT up and running. Thanks so much.

 

[Jim.ME]

I don't have the service manual. How do they recommend installing the chains? If they strip the axles out of the machine, then reinstall them through the chain, it might go in as a loop.

Or the dealer will come up with the same answer I did; grind the heads off the pins of one link (throw that link away) of the loop chain to open it up, feed it on the sprockets, then use a new removeable master/connecting link to put it back together, using the half link if needed. The loop is just #50 roller chain. I would compare that against cost and shipping of getting different chain.

 

[oldhawaiitea]

the manual assumes you have a length with a connector link. I m concerned about my ability to remove a link from the chain, I bought from the dealer without damaging other links, and I m concerned about replacing it with a half link and a connector link. I don t understand how to connect the half link. The chains cost me $107 each, and I just don t want to ruin one and not be able to return it. So, even though it ll take more time, I think I m going to try to get my hands on the correct chain and return the ones I bought from the dealer.

Thanks so much for your help!

 

[oldhawaiitea]

We don t have bulk chain available here, but I just ordered two 10 foot lengths from Amazon, with connectors. Free shipping, and I m not at all that much if it doesn t work. Mahalo

 

[Jim.ME]

That is fine, just trying to give you the options. Be aware that if you buy bulk chain to make them, you will have to use the same procedure of removing a link to adjust to the length you need.

Using the part number, I found eBay has one aftermarket seller (with a low rating) offering a straight chain replacement that has connecting links. From the pictures most (eBay and Amazon) are now selling it in a loop, duplicating the current JD specification it appears. I have no idea why they would do that for your application, but they are.

Just throwing this out to think about. If you take the new chains back to the dealer and take one of your old chains with you, show them your JD manual that has it as a length of chain and connecting link (as your old one is); you might be able to get the dealer to open the loops up (make then straight like your ''sample'' old one) and set you up with the links to put it back together as the manual describes. The most they can say is no, at best they will take a few minutes and prep it for you.

If you aren't familiar with a half link here is a picture. They are really no trickier to add than a connecting link if you do need to add one. One end is like a straight roller link and the other end is wider and goes over the roller link like a connecting link. Most use a pin, secured by a small cotter pin, to connect to the roller link. The regular connecting link works to connect the roller end to the other chain roller link. It adds 1/2 the length (pitch) of a regular link.

And to be clear on how I was saying to remove a peened over connecting link, in case you have to do that in the end.

Good luck, HTH

 

[oldhawaiitea]

(quoted from post at 16:02:39 09/10/23)
That is fine, just trying to give you the options. Be aware that if you buy bulk chain to make them, you will have to use the same procedure of removing a link to adjust to the length you need.

Using the part number, I found eBay has one aftermarket seller (with a low rating) offering a straight chain replacement that has connecting links. From the pictures most (eBay and Amazon) are now selling it in a loop, duplicating the current JD specification it appears. I have no idea why they would do that for your application, but they are.

Just throwing this out to think about. If you take the new chains back to the dealer and take one of your old chains with you, show them your JD manual that has it as a length of chain and connecting link (as your old one is); you might be able to get the dealer to open the loops up (make then straight like your ''sample'' old one) and set you up with the links to put it back together as the manual describes. The most they can say is no, at best they will take a few minutes and prep it for you.

If you aren't familiar with a half link here is a picture. They are really no trickier to add than a connecting link if you do need to add one. One end is like a straight roller link and the other end is wider and goes over the roller link like a connecting link. Most use a pin, secured by a small cotter pin, to connect to the roller link. The regular connecting link works to connect the roller end to the other chain roller link. It adds 1/2 the length (pitch) of a regular link.

And to be clear on how I was saying to remove a peened over connecting link, in case you have to do that in the end.

Good luck, HTH

Thanks so much. I really appreciate your help.