hydraulics and 3 point

[TJ64]

I believe I have figured this out, but I will run it by the guru's. '51 8n, started giving me fits with a scraper bucket. I got stuck going downhill! it wouldn't break out and lift up....I have cleaned out the chambers previously when I put in the new PTO and have fresh ( and NOT contaminated oil). With my position control lever in the UP position, I Lower the touch control and the arms only come down to 16.5". If I put the position control in draught position the arms drop to 8". Upper stop is about 36". I ordered the upgraded Jubilee piston for the upper cover along with the gaskets. I think I messed up as I now believe I should have also ordered the cam pin and the overpressure valve ( the valve just because I'll have the cover off and why not since I'm in the neighborhood). Also since I'm in there, I wonder if I can get to the shaft pins that bolt thru the axle trumpet.
I haven't put a gauge on front of the pump yet, or done the full inspection/diagnosis as the gaskets wont be here for another hour or so. The pump is working the arms go up and down. It will run the back blade fine, with the control lever in either position. At idle with the arms up if I put my weight on the lift arms I can feel a slight bump, bump, bump like psi is fluctuating. It will NOT hold an implement up when clutch is pushed in. The levers will slowly drop when the tractor is shut off. Which is why I bought the new piston and was going to make adjustments needed in the cover. Am I thinking in Close to the right direction? I'm going to order the pin and overpsi valve and whatever else happens when I open the top this afternoon.

 

[soaked]

Hi TJ64,
Agree, check the cam follower pin, and its cam for wear.

Not dropping the full amount could be bent, or worn parts, wrong spring adjustments...

Can't get to the lower pins from under the top cover. Need to pull the left trumpet to get access to both sides.

Not sure its a good idea to run a new Oring in an old cylinder.

Had a book of Droodles as a kid, and this "determined worm crawling over a razor blade", reminds me of how each piston in the pump shoots out a segment at a time --- at slow idle

 

[TJ64]

Hi TJ64,
Agree, check the cam follower pin, and its cam for wear.

Not dropping the full amount could be bent, or worn parts, wrong spring adjustments...

Can't get to the lower pins from under the top cover. Need to pull the left trumpet to get access to both sides.

Not sure its a good idea to run a new Oring in an old cylinder.

Had a book of Droodles as a kid, and this "determined worm crawling over a razor blade", reminds me of how each piston in the pump shoots out a segment at a time --- at slow idle
View attachment 153432TY! Yes, I was going too look hard at the cylinder as well. Had thoughts of using a dingleberry hone lightly if it don't look aweful, if it does then a new cylinder as well. As far as the lower pin goes, I couldn't quite get there from the PTO either, lol. Thanks again, Soaked!

 

[TJ64]

I have the top cover all done however, looking down into the top of my pump I see that the pistons are scratched up. I was going to rebuild the pump as long as the oil is out but it appears that Farm Tractor Repair is out of stock for the rebuild kits. Looks like I will be changing oil AGAIN when they get more in. Not that it hurts anything but my wallet. Seems like everytime I open her up I get more sludge out of the bottom. I sprayed it out with diesel and mineral spirits the last two times I was in there! Must be working thru the system. Maybe the pump will still work well enough to get me thru?

 

[Kondoge]

drain the oil into a clean drain pan and 5 gal bucket, you should be able to put it back, no? that's what I did when my pump broke.

 

[TJ64]

drain the oil into a clean drain pan and 5 gal bucket, you should be able to put it back, no? that's what I did when my pump broke.

I thought about it, but not for long. It is contaminated, and I just changed it this spring. It is parked inside the barn so contamination is coming from within. I sprayed them all down with fuel one time and mineral spirits the second time. I'm looking at rigging up a solvent tank pump this time. My spray rig, I feel has too fine of a spray. More air psi than solvent.

 

[soaked]

I've caught trans fluid in a cut off plastic garbage can, short enough to slide under without jacking up. Gotta cover it up good till its strained if putting back...

Pistons are submerged when running.
Not sure losses from visible piston scratches looking down. Upper half "ring section" isn't visable.

A worn pump can pick up a load when cold, then fail to lift when hot.

 

[TJ64]

I've caught trans fluid in a cut off plastic garbage can, short enough to slide under without jacking up. Gotta cover it up good till its strained if putting back...

Pistons are submerged when running.
Not sure losses from visible piston scratches looking down. Upper half "ring section" isn't visable.
View attachment 154166
A worn pump can pick up a load when cold, then fail to lift when hot.

 

[TJ64]

Soaked! As always you have made me feel better about my decision. I cut the top 2" off of a 5 gallon bucket and it fits perfect. IF you only drain one section at a time and dump it in between it's good to go. That pic looks about like what I'm seeing (just the exposed parts). I'm gonna give it one more douche and close her up. Top cover was waaay out of adjustment. Funny how when you get everything dialed in those factory marks on the quadrant cover seem to just line right up, lol. I will check back in when I get it done and work it a bit.

 

[soaked]

I'm happy to help, sure hope it runs fine,
and look forward to future posts!
John

 

[TJ64]

My old psi relief/exhaust valve and the new one.....one of these don't look right...

 

[TJ64]

I think I may have bumped the control arm wrestling the top cover back on, or maybe I need to back the big spring off half a turn??? Draft control lever wont stay down, if I push it all the way down it works right. Touch control is fixed and working properly, I have full range of motion, I backed into a clay bank with the scoop and it broke out just fine. Pulled ahead and got a bigger bite and it lifted it perfect and walked off with it. 3 point doesn't drop when I shift, and will stay up even when PTO is disengaged. Actually have to push it down by hand. All in all, I will call it success! Thank you guys again!

 

[soaked]

That's great it works!
Im not seeing prv issue?
There is a detent ball and spring under this almost never opened slotted bolt.

 

[TJ64]

That's great it works!
Im not seeing prv issue?
There is a detent ball and spring under this almost never opened slotted bolt.
View attachment 154254

You know I now have to take that apart and see what that looks like in there, lol!

 

[soaked]

Be careful, not to strip the slot...
To get this apart, took some propane torch heat on the slotted head, then dremmeled the mushrooming end of the rivet flush with the handle, then used a 3/16" punch to drive the rivet out.
The detent depressions on the little shaft on this one are still good, so the handle was firm in up, or down.
Prolly can't do much to fix without pulling the cover...

 

[HarryVanderpool]

Posts like "soaked" are what makes this site so very valuable.

 

[TJ64]

Be careful, not to strip the slot...
To get this apart, took some propane torch heat on the slotted head, then dremmeled the mushrooming end of the rivet flush with the handle, then used a 3/16" punch to drive the rivet out.
The detent depressions on the little shaft on this one are still good, so the handle was firm in up, or down.
Prolly can't do much to fix without pulling the cover...
View attachment 154299

Ahhh! It was working fine (at least it was staying in position) before I replaced the cylinder and piston. I'm wondering if I back off the big spring a half turn or so? The instructions that came with the Zane Thang didn't sound the same as what I previously read or saw in the J&D video. The written instructions had you turn the control spring yoke until it makes contact and the turn it in one more complete turn. Everywhere else it says Snug, but you should be able to still spin the spring by hand. That one extra turn....no can do even with both hands. ( Well one and a half, I have one bum hand at the moment). The reasoning was to keep a slight preload to keep from bending linkages....

 

[soaked]

The Zane Thang is ment for 2n-9n tractors with no position control. Put your good paw on the spring and loosen till snug would be my thought

 

[soaked]

Posts like "soaked" are what makes this site so very valuable.

Thanks Harry!

 

[TJ64]

The Zane Thang is ment for 2n-9n tractors with no position control. Put your good paw on the spring and loosen till snug would be my thought

I was curious about that. Directions said to adjust draft control first and then position control......so I did! Position control works better than it did before, but I have to think the new piston and cylinder have a lot to do with that . Thanx again, John!