Heck yes, I blame ethanol for everything. Water and petroleum don't mix well.
scootergmc
Well-known Member
- Location
- NorCal
Ethanol isn't the problem. Human behavior in dealing with it is. Sounds like you try to avoid it if possible, which is good. For some of us avoidance isn't possible, but I get by just fine.
To clean the main jet I use very small wire drill bits, most chemicals will not remove the build up on main jet. Use something like this from Amazon.It will save you time & $.
Goose
Well-known Member
Explain to me exactly how it plugs the jets.Ethanol is well known for plugging the jet in small engine carbs if left setting. Why are so many people denying it causes problems. I won't put that crap in anything but my vehicles.
When I shut down a generator after use, I drain all the regular gas and replace with REC gas with a touch of 2 cycle oil. Run the generator a bit and shut of the fuel to let it run dry. This is a bit of a pain, but I have had zero issues with generator start or operation using this procedure. I leave the generator setting full of REC gas with the 2-cycle oil added so it is ready to go.Ethanol is well known for plugging the jet in small engine carbs if left setting. Why are so many people denying it causes problems. I won't put that crap in anything but my vehicles.
Ray,IN
Well-known Member
- Location
- S. Indiana
I agree. Simply running a carbed engine until it stops does not empty the float bowl. My portable genset has a drain screw in the bottom of the bowl for storage prep. Every time I've forgotten to use the drain screw, I have to replace the $50 carb before it will run properly.
Ray,IN
Well-known Member
- Location
- S. Indiana
Ethanol attracts water, water is heavier than gas or ethanol, when the carb is unused the ethanol evaporates, leaving only water and gas in the bottom of the bowl. Most genset carbs are cheap cast aluminum, which corrodes and flakes off.
wh
Well-known Member
Well shucks. I guess I need to drain the bowl. Only had one generator since 2007. Bought the other one in 2012 or so. Never did more than turn gas off at shut down and let engine run until it quits. Both are electric start. One 5000 and one 7500. Both start by turning on gas. Count to 10 slowly. Pull choke and hit starter button. Most times they are running with just a bump on the button. Very few times do I have to spin it. I buy good brand gas just regular e10. Have never had a problem. There are cheaper off brands that I do not buy. Thru the years there have been issues with those who purchased the cheap gas. The brand I am referring to is local independent that several times thru the years have had to have peoples cars fixed because of fuel issues. Generally it is a tank of water.
Russ from MN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bemidji MN
I use ethanol gas in all our 4-stroke engines, but the generators that may sit a long time, I drain the ethanol gas out and put some 50-1 (non-ethanol) chain saw mix in and run it a little. The always start and run well the next time I want to use them. The oil leaves the engine lubricated and prevents corrosion in the fuel system.
jimg.allentown
Well-known Member
- Location
- Southeastern PA
Since this seems to be a topic of great discussion, I will add my own observations.
Ethanol is basically a solvent that happens to also be quite combustible. It also has qualities that can lead to intoxication if ingested as a beverage or as a component of a beverage.
Ethanol is also hygroscopic in that it readily attracts moisture from the atmosphere and its surroundings.
As a fuel, ethanol has a generally slower combustion ratethan gasoline, giving it a higher octane rating, and making it useful for boosting the octane ratings of lower rated fuels.
In engines, I have noted some of the following:
Ethanol can and does attack rubber parts in carburetor and fuel systems that are not specifically designed to be used with ethanol. That includes the small fuel lines found on 2-stroke engines. It can also attack some other rubber components like rubber gaskets and diaphragms. The operative word here being "can."
Internally, the pistons, rings, cylinder bore, valves, and exhaust are generally unaffected by the combustion of ethanol. The exception might be if preignition or detonation occurs. Otherwise, it makes no difference to the materials in the combustion chamber.
Ethanol has a lower BTU content than gasoline. As such, it takes a bit more ethanol fuel to accomplish the same work as "pure" gasoline. This is simply a fact of chemistry and physics.
As a solvent, ethanol can dissolve or loosen deposits in fuel systems on older engine fuel systems. These deposits can most times be harmlessly burned in the course of operating the engine. However, ethanol has been known to cause a sticky whitish substance to appear in fuel systems. My guess, and this is only a guess, is that this is caused by a reaction to leftover deposits of tetraethyl lead that was commonly used in fuels prior to 1975. This substance can cause a carburetor to become unusable. I have experienced this with a friend who had it happen to his lawn care equipment. I also suppose that it could have been other additives in older fuel that caused this. In any case, when the ethanol component of the gasoline loosens old deposits, they can accumulate in tiny pasages in carburetors and plug those passages.
I've heard every thing from "ethanol is no good" to "I've been using it for 40 years with no problems" told to me. Personally, I don't care for the E10. It does reduce my fuel mileage a bit, and it is not good for older fuel pumps. More modern vehicles seem to have no problems with it.
There. I said my piece.
Ethanol is basically a solvent that happens to also be quite combustible. It also has qualities that can lead to intoxication if ingested as a beverage or as a component of a beverage.
Ethanol is also hygroscopic in that it readily attracts moisture from the atmosphere and its surroundings.
As a fuel, ethanol has a generally slower combustion ratethan gasoline, giving it a higher octane rating, and making it useful for boosting the octane ratings of lower rated fuels.
In engines, I have noted some of the following:
Ethanol can and does attack rubber parts in carburetor and fuel systems that are not specifically designed to be used with ethanol. That includes the small fuel lines found on 2-stroke engines. It can also attack some other rubber components like rubber gaskets and diaphragms. The operative word here being "can."
Internally, the pistons, rings, cylinder bore, valves, and exhaust are generally unaffected by the combustion of ethanol. The exception might be if preignition or detonation occurs. Otherwise, it makes no difference to the materials in the combustion chamber.
Ethanol has a lower BTU content than gasoline. As such, it takes a bit more ethanol fuel to accomplish the same work as "pure" gasoline. This is simply a fact of chemistry and physics.
As a solvent, ethanol can dissolve or loosen deposits in fuel systems on older engine fuel systems. These deposits can most times be harmlessly burned in the course of operating the engine. However, ethanol has been known to cause a sticky whitish substance to appear in fuel systems. My guess, and this is only a guess, is that this is caused by a reaction to leftover deposits of tetraethyl lead that was commonly used in fuels prior to 1975. This substance can cause a carburetor to become unusable. I have experienced this with a friend who had it happen to his lawn care equipment. I also suppose that it could have been other additives in older fuel that caused this. In any case, when the ethanol component of the gasoline loosens old deposits, they can accumulate in tiny pasages in carburetors and plug those passages.
I've heard every thing from "ethanol is no good" to "I've been using it for 40 years with no problems" told to me. Personally, I don't care for the E10. It does reduce my fuel mileage a bit, and it is not good for older fuel pumps. More modern vehicles seem to have no problems with it.
There. I said my piece.
buickanddeere
Well-known Member
Fussy and little used equipment here is operated on 100LL
Goose
Well-known Member
I love to stir this pot.
A couple of observations,
1. I wonder it the folks who brag that they always shut off the gas and run the engine until it stops realize they aren't emptying the carburetor. All they're doing is running the engine until there isn't enough fuel in the carb for the engine to run. There is still a fair amount of fuel left in the carb.
It appears to me that ethanol gets blamed for a lof of problems that would have happened anyway. An engine is running rough because the spark plugs haven't been replaced for 10 or 15 years and all you hear is, "That dammed ethanol ruined the spark plugs".
Ciao
A couple of observations,
1. I wonder it the folks who brag that they always shut off the gas and run the engine until it stops realize they aren't emptying the carburetor. All they're doing is running the engine until there isn't enough fuel in the carb for the engine to run. There is still a fair amount of fuel left in the carb.
It appears to me that ethanol gets blamed for a lof of problems that would have happened anyway. An engine is running rough because the spark plugs haven't been replaced for 10 or 15 years and all you hear is, "That dammed ethanol ruined the spark plugs".
Ciao
jimg.allentown
Well-known Member
- Location
- Southeastern PA
Were you using 10% ethanol bar and chain oil?
Goose
Well-known Member
According to the owner's manuals of both my Stihl chain saws, Stihl approves 10% ethanol. BTW, how did the caps break?
Bill of TN
Member
- Location
- Near Chattanooga TN
My own unscientific study has lead me to the following conclusion. Run ethanol gas and have more frequent issues. Run 100% gas with no ethanol, and have less frequent issues. Even during the season, when my equipment is utilized more frequently, when running ethanol gas, I have had to replace in line fuel filters several times a season, with a white milky looking substance in them. So, while the cost of fuel decreases with ethanol, the cost of maintenance, becoming more frequent, increases. Time is a valuable commodity as well, so if I have to spend a half a day fixing it then I don't see any payback for running ethanol gas in air cooled engines.
I suggest you validate my conclusion with your own study. Let me know how the ethanol gas works for you. If it works good you you then please shed some light on what I need to do differently.
The way I see it, the folks at the top that set the rules are forcing the equipment manufactures to adopt their rules. Just because you can run ethanol, doesn't mean you should. It means you have complied with the rules.
I suggest you validate my conclusion with your own study. Let me know how the ethanol gas works for you. If it works good you you then please shed some light on what I need to do differently.
The way I see it, the folks at the top that set the rules are forcing the equipment manufactures to adopt their rules. Just because you can run ethanol, doesn't mean you should. It means you have complied with the rules.
scootergmc
Well-known Member
- Location
- NorCal
Which little inline fuel filters? Are you adding the cheap little plastic ones from automotive stores? Most of those are junk, not designed to withstand ethanol fuel, and I've never had good luck with any of them.
wh
Well-known Member
I will say again — I have never had an ethanol gas problem. I do not buy it at the local off brand/plain station. I only buy at named stations. I do put stabil in the tanks of everything in the fall when I park them and fill the tanks. Never turn gas off on tractors or lawnmower. Generators/garden tiller are run with gas off until they quit.
Russ from MN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bemidji MN
We have a Husqvarna lawn tractor with a 15 hp Kawasaki that's 25 years old and used every season with E-10 gas. I have never changed the spark plugs of fuel filter. The arbors are non -greaseable sealed bearings, all original. It starts and runs the same as it did on day one. I have changed a couple of deck drive belts and the blades, and oil and filters as recommended. It will probably start to fail now that I'm bragging about it! But we have never let it sit out in the rain like so many folks do or washed it with water!
The little plastic links broke. This was a long time ago when they blamed it on ethanol and I had to pay a lot for
a stupid gas/oil cap, not happy!
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