Got 12V kit, lost docs, anyone recognize this?

[1 Acre Warrior]

Years ago, I bought a 12V conversion kit. Somewhere along the way, the docs went elsewhere.

Does anyone recognize this kit, and maybe have the instruction sheet?

It came with alternator, resistor, brackets, hardware and this wiring harness.

Also, it looks like this converts to NEG ground -- won't that make the starter turn the wrong way???

 

[Jim.ME]

Guessing this is a N series, but which Ford N tractor? If 8N, is it front mount or side mount distributor? The 9N and 2N are just front mount.

Looks like a Delco 10SI one wire type alternator.

Yes, you will need to convert to 12-volt negative ground. Changing the ground does not change the direction of starter rotation, wipe that off your list of concerns.

For now, here is a picture found online for mounting on an 8N side mount distributor tractor.

 

[1 Acre Warrior]

Guessing this is a N series, but which Ford N tractor? If 8N, is it front mount or side mount distributor? The 9N and 2N are just front mount.

Looks like a Delco 10SI one wire type alternator.

Yes, you will need to convert to 12-volt negative ground. Changing the ground does not change the direction of starter rotation, wipe that off your list of concerns.

For now, here is a picture found online for mounting on an 8N side mount distributor tractor.

View attachment 164408

1951 8N, side distributor.

Yes, I saw that diagram, but it doesn't match the wiring harness that I have.

If the starter turns the same way, I can actually use a 12V battery right away, use a charger, then do the conversion later after psyching out this wiring. Might do that, just to get working again. The tractor has been sitting for months, the 6V battery was already worn out, and I just got new drive tires on -- for all I know, the Firestones that came off could have been original (Sun-Checks-A-Go-Go)!

 

[soaked]

Hi 1,
The wire diagram Jim posted is what came in kits I've bought before for 8n sidemounts.
Your 6 volt coil will likely run for weeks or months on 12 volts.
If want to use your new resistor, best to check its ohms. If ohms are too high, it will have a weak spark when starter is engaged...
Here is where the 12v conversion wires connect

The orange wire goes to the resistor if using a six volt coil. (This is a one wire 10si, with a 3.0 ohm coil)
When hanging the alt, may have to enlarge a hole to 5/16" on the top bracket to "T" bracket connection,
IIRC.

 

[Jim.ME]

1951 8N, side distributor.

Yes, I saw that diagram, but it doesn't match the wiring harness that I have.

If the starter turns the same way, I can actually use a 12V battery right away, use a charger, then do the conversion later after psyching out this wiring. Might do that, just to get working again. The tractor has been sitting for months, the 6V battery was already worn out, and I just got new drive tires on -- for all I know, the Firestones that came off could have been original (Sun-Checks-A-Go-Go)!

Yes, you can just use a 12-volt battery and charge it as needed. Hook the battery up negative ground. Unhook the regulator and generator. Swap the wires on the ammeter terminal from one terminal to the other (If your ammeter is the type that the wire just runs past the ammeter back reverse the way the wire runs). The coil needs to be positive on the ignition switch side and the - terminal needs to go to the distributor. if you do not install a coil would for 12 volts but want to use the 6-volt coil you have, you will need a ballast resistor in the wire from the ignition switch. I suggest installing a coil made for use in a 12-volt system such as a Standard Motor Products #UC 15 or NAPA/Echlin #IC 14 and not use a ballast resistor.

 

[1 Acre Warrior]

Hmmm.

I think I have the harness psyched out, it has:

Red1 (Alt to Ammeter)
White (coil to Term1)
Red2 (solenoid to Term2)
Yellow (solenoid pull-in to start switch)
Blue (ammeter to Term2 providing 12V to Term2)

The ignition switch connects Term1 and Term2

The resistor is 3.3 Ohms

HOWEVER, the short Orange wire seems to be on the wrong end to go to the coil. One end has a ring and the other a spade lug (for the resistor). Does this connect to the White lead somehow?

There is also no other lead with a spade lug for the other end of the resistor. The diagram that got posted indicates that a wire not supplied goes to the other end of the resistor, but what does it connect to?

 

[soaked]

If your gonna run the resistor, the white wire needs a tiny nut and bolt to hook the u shaped terminal to the spade connector on the resistor.( took white off the terminal from the middle pic on post #4 above)
The orange goes to the switched terminal, like this, and to one end of the resistor.

It may start with a 3.3 ohm resistor, it may not. Coil pirmary ohms + 3.3 resistor ohms may not have enough spark to fire up...

 

[1 Acre Warrior]

I thought this might be how to do the wiring, thanks!

Also, I've had cars which had a straight lead to the coil from the starter switch, bypassing the resistor while getting it going -- releasing the switch brought the resistor into line to keep the coil cool while driving.

 

[soaked]

Can do the same with a short jumper with alligator clips on both spades on the resistor

 

[Ray,IN]

Will this help? https://myfordtractors.com/12volt04.shtml

 

[1 Acre Warrior]

Will this help? https://myfordtractors.com/12volt04.shtml

Yep, thanks.

BTW, Reagan was wrong -- the four most terrifying words in the English language are "THAT'S the man, Officer!"

 

[used red MN]

I thought this might be how to do the wiring, thanks!

Also, I've had cars which had a straight lead to the coil from the starter switch, bypassing the resistor while getting it going -- releasing the switch brought the resistor into line to keep the coil cool while driving.

The circuit to provide higher voltage during cranking is usually provided by the starter solenoid. The issue is that since it looks like you are using the stock starter initiation via the gear shift that system uses a ground to engage the solenoid. To my knowledge there is not a solenoid that can be utilized in that configuration that provides the resistor bypass circuit. A work around to this is placing a feed wire for cranking voltage from the starter cable terminal to the coil side of the resistor. However, a diode needs placed in the circuit to allow power to flow to the ignition circuit during cranking, but not back to the starter circuit when the starter is disengaged.

 

[Jim.ME]

They are not mentioned often however there are some 5 terminal solenoids that will work with the original safety start system and provide a resistor bypass. NAPA/Echlin ST83 and Standard Motor Products SS582 are a couple part numbers.

 

[Eman85]

My 51 8N has been 12v since I bought it almost 40 years ago and doesn't have or need the bypass of the resistor for starting. Buy a 12v coil, wire it and let it eat.

 

[used red MN]

They are not mentioned often however there are some 5 terminal solenoids that will work with the original safety start system and provide a resistor bypass. NAPA/Echlin ST83 and Standard Motor Products SS582 are a couple part numbers.

View attachment 164557

Thanks for the information!

 

[used red MN]

My 51 8N has been 12v since I bought it almost 40 years ago and doesn't have or need the bypass of the resistor for starting. Buy a 12v coil, wire it and let it eat.

He asked, I offered an option. Sounds like the correct solenoid would also be an option for him. I appreciate your experience that suggests it is not necessary.

 

[ss55]

He asked, I offered an option. Sounds like the correct solenoid would also be an option for him. I appreciate your experience that suggests it is not necessary.

I see you are located in central Minnesota. A 12 volt coil should still work well for you when temperatures are above zero F and the starting battery is in good condition.

The 6 volt coil with a bypass resistor setup is for an extra hot spark during starting in below zero F weather when the battery voltages are lowest, engine oils are thickest and gas engines are just harder to get started. As engine compression ratios increased, most 12 volt tractors, cars and trucks, including most Fords, used a 6 volt coil with bypass resistor from when 12 volt systems became standard in the late 1950s on into the 1980s. You should be able to find wiring diagrams and parts lists from late 1950s and 1960s Ford gas tractors cars or trucks that used a bypass resistor ( Ford 600, 800, 2000, 3000, 4000, etc. ).

I did not see a new coil, a new solenoid or a resistor in your conversion kit. Cost might be about a wash between buying a new 12 volt coil or buying a new solenoid and bypass resistor.

Give it a try as-is for one winter to see if it works for you. An N series Ford tractor should be low compression and be easy to start in 30 below temperatures. As the 12 volt battery gets weaker a 6 volt coil with a bypass resistor might let your battery continue to start the tractor for an extra year or two before the battery needs to be replaced.

 

[used red MN]

I see you are located in central Minnesota.

Yes, I am in Minnesota. I have no idea where 1 acre warrior that is asking for guidance on his electrical system is located. My hobby tractor a Farmall M resides in my home state of Kansas. I have all the issue with it well in hand, we’ll sort of. Lacking is the time to get down there and address them hands on.