12 volt system

[Bo Whalen]

I tried searching the Ford Forum with no luck. I need a wiring diagram for our '53 Ford 640 which someone in her distant past converted her in a pretty much poor manner. The conversion was from 6V to 12V. The YT shop manual and Master Parts Catalog do not show what I need unless I have overlooked it somewhere. I need to know how the ammeter is wired as there is only one wire from the alternator to the meter and without taking the meter off the panel I can't tell where what is.
HeLp...Bo Whalen

 

[TMo]

Are you using a 4 post ignition switch?

 

[36 Coupe]

Change it back to 6 volts.my 640 starts when I cant.

 

[Bo Whalen]

Looks like it. I see 3 around the sides and one in the middle on a raised post.

Thanks...Bo Whalen

 

[old]

First off what do you have?? No such thing as a 1953 640 since they did not come out till 1955. Only Ford tractor made in 1953 was the Jubilee. That said if you have the correct soliniod and also amp meter etc hard to help you. The way it should work is the big wire from the alternator goes to the hot side of the solenoid and the hot wire going to the amp gauge goes to the amp gauge and that in turn feeds the ignition

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 19:55:28 03/21/11) First off what do you have?? No such thing as a 1953 640 since they did not come out till 1955. Only Ford tractor made in 1953 was the Jubilee. That said if you have the correct soliniod and also amp meter etc hard to help you. The way it should work is the big wire from the alternator goes to the hot side of the solenoid and the hot wire going to the amp gauge goes to the amp gauge and that in turn feeds the ignition

ight want to think about what that ammeter would be reading?? :roll:

 

[GlenIdaho]

You don't say if it is a one wire or three wire aleternator. Here's a diagram courtesy JohninLa who put it together. Hope it helps.
Diagram

 

[Bo Whalen]

you're right Old, darn things a jeep.
the emblem on the front is a circle. in the top area of the circle a bar crosses and has "600" stamped on it. just below the bar is an oval with the word Ford written as in longhand. the oval sits on top of a scene with a stalk of wheat with two sets of leaves on each side. on the sides of the stalk it depicts long empty rows.
as for what it is, you tell me.

GlenIdaho-it is a one wire alternator with what looks to be about 16-18awg and runs to the upper right terminal looking at the back of the ignition switch which operates same as an auto. the lug it is wired to has another wire there which goes to the coil. 12v coil has external wire going to the distributor. I have made no attempt to trace out everything but will start tomorrow.

as for the ammeter it reads amps!!! actually, the only movement I have seen is a slight movement to negative when I turned the key to start the engine and only got a click. there is a wire from the ignition switch to the ammeter and two more wires on it one of which goes to the hot side of the relay. the third wire is taped off on the loose end. don't know where it should go but will find out or someone who knows will be nice enough to tell me. the water temp wire is connected to the meter and to the engine block but does not work. what do you check first? buy a new meter or a new sending unit or see if thee wire can be replaced. I suspect the whole thing is a package. sending unit and wire maybe even with a special terminating plug at the meter. who knows. I'd bet YT knows.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 21:24:40 03/21/11) you're right Old, darn things a jeep.
the emblem on the front is a circle. in the top area of the circle a bar crosses and has "600" stamped on it. just below the bar is an oval with the word Ford written as in longhand. the oval sits on top of a scene with a stalk of wheat with two sets of leaves on each side. on the sides of the stalk it depicts long empty rows.
as for what it is, you tell me.

GlenIdaho-it is a one wire alternator with what looks to be about 16-18awg and runs to the upper right terminal looking at the back of the ignition switch which operates same as an auto. the lug it is wired to has another wire there which goes to the coil. 12v coil has external wire going to the distributor. I have made no attempt to trace out everything but will start tomorrow.

as for the ammeter it reads amps!!! actually, the only movement I have seen is a slight movement to negative when I turned the key to start the engine and only got a click. there is a wire from the ignition switch to the ammeter and two more wires on it one of which goes to the hot side of the relay. the third wire is taped off on the loose end. don't know where it should go but will find out or someone who knows will be nice enough to tell me. the water temp wire is connected to the meter and to the engine block but does not work. what do you check first? buy a new meter or a new sending unit or see if thee wire can be replaced. I suspect the whole thing is a package. sending unit and wire maybe even with a special terminating plug at the meter. who knows. I'd bet YT knows.

ot to say that your wiring can't be made to function, but it sure sounds a long way from factory. As for temperature gauge, a 640 would have been non-electric capillary tube type gauge.

 

[TMo]

Assuming you have a internally regulated alternator (basically the voltage regulator is contained inside) and the current rating of the ammeter is compatible with the alternator output:

1. Run wire from alternator to (+) post of ammeter
2. Run another wire from the same post to bat post on ignition switch
3. Run wire from the other post of ammeter to hot post on solenoid

*use 10 gauge wire
**have your battery cables disconnect while doing this
*** Test it: with the ignition switch in off position ammeter should obviously read zero. Then, turn the ignition switch to on position (not start position) and the ammeter should deflect a little towards negative (-). If the ammeter deflects the opposite way, disconnect the battery cables and swap the wires at the back of the ammeter, reconnect the battery cables and try again.

If I am forgetting something or incorrect about aneything, Soundguy will let you know

 

[GlenIdaho]

Here's another diagram for a 1 wire alternator, again courtesy of JohninLa.

Just so you know, you can't always go by the hood emblems. After many years some get replaced by whatever is handy or unintentionally the wrong one. Go to the flat of the trans just aft of the starter and you'll find two rows of numbers, the model number and serial number. It will say 620, 630, 640, 650, 660. if it is a 600 series tractor. When you have the serial number go to the left column of this page and scroll down to serial numbers, then click on and follow the path to find the year of your tractor. One disclaimer though, sometimes the trans gets switched out from another tractor so you have to start looking at specific parts and equipment to determine what it truly is.

Here's a link to John Smith's site which has some great info on Fords and will help you ID it.
http://www.oldfordtractors.com/idhistory.htm
1 wire Diagram

 

[Geo-TH,In]

I replaced the alternator on my IHC with a 63 amp delco. Old alternator worked fine, it had bad bearings. The new alternator would not work with the old diode. I replaced the diode with an idiot light and it works fine. However, the new alternator takes a few seconds to wake up before charging. Also need to rev the engine to wake it up. Go figure, I have to do the same issue with my Jubilee.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 20:06:54 03/22/11) I replaced the alternator on my IHC with a 63 amp delco. Old alternator worked fine, it had bad bearings. The new alternator would not work with the old diode. I replaced the diode with an idiot light and it works fine. However, the new alternator takes a few seconds to wake up before charging. Also need to rev the engine to wake it up. Go figure, I have to do the same issue with my Jubilee.

omething isn't right in the land of OZ....that behavior is not normal.

 

[Bo Whalen]

I am going to start re-wiring the tractor tomorrow. I thought I would use 12 ga. strand wire and crimp connectors. Anyone think I need to solder them as well???
This machine is wired a little differently than the schematic I got from John in LA but to me it looks the same electrically. Even so, except for the terminal block, I may wire it the same way just using each component as the block.

May I have your opinions, please?
Thanks...Bo Whalen