1936 unstyled B newbie question

[Brianjbell]

All, long time lurker, first time owner. Just got a 1936 JD Unstyled B, it's sat for a while but in overall good condition. I've noticed that it seems to get very warm when running (and it's in the high 30s-low 40s here in NC at the moment). The temp gauge reads between 190-220 on it. The upper radiator pipe is hot to the touch (won't keep my hand on it long) and the bottom isn't even warm. I don't see that this unit has a thermostat, but wanted to be certain. The radiator core was replaced a while back, is unobstructed and looks great. Tractor has antifreeze in it for obvious reasons, I know water cools better. Shutters on the radiator are wide open as well. Am I worrying for nothing? I know these are thermosiphon based cooling systems and the thermostat is at the hottest point in the engine, just don't want to do any damage. The temp comes up over time, no boiling over, spewing coolant, etc. For what it's worth, the temp gauge looks to be the factor original (or a replacement from many moons ago) as well. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

 

[Paul_IN]

Welcome to the group of antique and vintage tractor fans!
In my opinion it’s a bit unusual your B is running at a good temperature without being under some load and with shutters open. I would not worry about it now. Wait until hot summer weather or if you work the tractor some to see if it boils in the top tank.
There is no thermostat on your tractor. I believe most newer replacement radiator cores have narrower tubes than original and this is a detriment to effective thermosiphon system operation. But again, wait and see how it performs in hot weather or under load.

 

[Jim.ME]

Check temperatures of different metal areas and down through the radiator core with a handheld temp gun. Your gauge may not be reading right. I doubt you can keep your hand on a 140-degree pipe for long.

 

[Mark Poss]

Sounds like you may have an anti freeze block. Your tractor has a thermo- siphon system. I had the same issue with my 35 B some years ago. I put anti freeze in and added water thinking they would mix but they won’t. You must mix them together before you put into the radiator.

 

[John in MD]

Run straight water, that's what the engine was designed to do. Just remember to drain after each use in cold weather. That was recommendation by dealers when tractor was new.

 

[Mark-Ia]

If your B has cheap made overseas temp gauge that could be the problem showing hot when running. The best gauge are american made by EverGreen Restoration.

 

[Fixingfarmer]

No thermostat no waterpump

Both my 36 and 38 stay below 175 until it hits 90 degree outside air temp is when they start heating up and they usually need a load to get there. It’s somewhat concerning yours doesn’t take a load to get there. I couldn’t do 3 acres of mowing above 95 degrees I had to take a break but up to 75 or so smooth sailing with the 6 foot mower.

I’d do some more investigation does the level drop?

It can be a sign of cylinder head trouble if the radiator is all fresh and full that’s where I’d be leaning….getting it checked for cracks would be on the list

You might be south enough to not need any antifreeze but you would know your location with the cold snap we had this year you could have a freeze problem. Maybe you could even could water down some 50/50 just to get freeze protection to 0 or so.

There was a local G that froze when the lp man didn’t fill a farmers shop when he went on vacation. 50 bucks in antifreeze is about 1/100 of what a complete radiator and block and head for that unit cost by the time my labor was done. But again I don’t live where it’s sunny like yourself.

 

[used red MN]

Run straight water, that's what the engine was designed to do. Just remember to drain after each use in cold weather. That was recommendation by dealers when tractor was new.

In my opinion that’s a very poor suggestion. Many of these tractors run fine with antifreeze. The main reason many didn’t use antifreeze because it was a money saving tactic. Horses didn’t need antifreeze so why would this tractor? My bet is on a gauge that is giving an incorrect reading.

 

[John in MD]

It may be a poor suggestion but that's what they did.

 

[Rich'sToys]

Run straight water, that's what the engine was designed to do. Just remember to drain after each use in cold weather. That was recommendation by dealers when tractor was new.

I would agree to use antifreeze and not just water. All it takes is one time to forget to drain it and you'll have a much bigger problem on your hands.

 

[J.Wondergem]

I would agree to use antifreeze and not just water. All it takes is one time to forget to drain it and you'll have a much bigger problem on your hands.

When I still had my own truck, The engine builder said to run 80 percent antifreeze and water softener when i was running the west coast in the summer. They said the antifreeze would run cooler than water and the water softener would make the water weater.

 

[John in MD]

I would agree to use antifreeze and not just water. All it takes is one time to forget to drain it and you'll have a much bigger problem on your hands.

Life was tougher back then, if you forgot the first time, I bet you didn't forget again. I do agree with using antifreeze now but that wasn't an option when that B came out. Check an original Owner's Manual section on winter use and storage.

 

[UnstyledB]

When I still had my own truck, The engine builder said to run 80 percent antifreeze and water softener when i was running the west coast in the summer. They said the antifreeze would run cooler than water and the water softener would make the water weater.

Plain water is more efficient at cooling than antifreeze. An engine cooled with water will run cooler than one with antifreeze.

 

[ss55]

In my opinion that’s a very poor suggestion. Many of these tractors run fine with antifreeze. The main reason many didn’t use antifreeze because it was a money saving tactic. Horses didn’t need antifreeze so why would this tractor? My bet is on a gauge that is giving an incorrect reading.

Life was tougher back then, if you forgot the first time, I bet you didn't forget again. I do agree with using antifreeze now but that wasn't an option when that B came out. Check an original Owner's Manual section on winter use and storage.

Yeah, glycol antifreeze was not available to civilians until after WW2. Alcohol antifreeze boiled off the alcohol first before the water so it was not permanent or very reliable. I am not sure how the strength of alcohol antifreeze was tested back in those days, a hydrometer?

 

[Watthour]

Having had a pair of '36 Bs, the glycol did not affect the cooling efficiency enough to matter when just putzing around the acreage, not really doing much work beyond pulling a wagon, even at nearly 100°F in July. It certainly did keep the block and head intact when the temperatures got down to -30°T, and kept the rust levels in the radiators at a minimum.

 

[J.Wondergem]

Plain water is more efficient at cooling than antifreeze. An engine cooled with water will run cooler than one with antifreeze.

It would have to be proved to me as my truck ran cooler in the mountains with it . Maybe it was the softener, but the engine people where right.

 

[TheBartman47]

Water does have a better heat transfer than antifreeze, but 50/50 antifreeze/water raises the boiling point (stays liquid at higher temperatures), plus prevents rust and lubricates the water pump.

 

[J.Wondergem]

Water does have a better heat transfer than antifreeze, but 50/50 antifreeze/water raises the boiling point (stays liquid at higher temperatures), plus prevents rust and lubricates the water pump.

I'll agree with straight antifreeze, which is no good by itself.

 

[Brianjbell]

No thermostat no waterpump

Both my 36 and 38 stay below 175 until it hits 90 degree outside air temp is when they start heating up and they usually need a load to get there. It’s somewhat concerning yours doesn’t take a load to get there. I couldn’t do 3 acres of mowing above 95 degrees I had to take a break but up to 75 or so smooth sailing with the 6 foot mower.

I’d do some more investigation does the level drop?

It can be a sign of cylinder head trouble if the radiator is all fresh and full that’s where I’d be leaning….getting it checked for cracks would be on the list

You might be south enough to not need any antifreeze but you would know your location with the cold snap we had this year you could have a freeze problem. Maybe you could even could water down some 50/50 just to get freeze protection to 0 or so.

There was a local G that froze when the lp man didn’t fill a farmers shop when he went on vacation. 50 bucks in antifreeze is about 1/100 of what a complete radiator and block and head for that unit cost by the time my labor was done. But again I don’t live where it’s sunny like yourself.

Level hasn't budged, don't think it's the head, no other issues of cracked head. Will keep an eye on it though. Also going to test to see what the actual concentration is.

 

[Brianjbell]

In my opinion that’s a very poor suggestion. Many of these tractors run fine with antifreeze. The main reason many didn’t use antifreeze because it was a money saving tactic. Horses didn’t need antifreeze so why would this tractor? My bet is on a gauge that is giving an incorrect reading.

I'm hoping this is in fact what's going on. I'm still looking for my laser thermometer to actually test. The gauge looks to be the factory one, or a very old NOS replacement from ages ago.