196X Ford YYYY

[AGSC2021]

Hey yall,

I know this is a common topic, but I'm needing a little help identifying what I've got here. I bought this tractor earlier in the year and was told it was a 1964 Ford 4000. Based on the problems I've had with spare parts, I'm a little skeptical.

I believe I can make 1301-S D on the starter mount making it 1962? Is the model information within that SN or is it located elsewhere on the body?

This old girl needs some work, and I need to go to square one and have a form grasp on the year and model.

 

[AGSC2021]

I forgot to include:

4 cyl. Diesel
4 sp. Transmission
Live PTO

 

[Larry NCKS]

(quoted from post at 22:31:32 12/07/21) I forgot to include:

4 cyl. Diesel
4 sp. Transmission
Live PTO

If it's a 1962 4 speed, it's not a live PTO.

1301-S D is not the SN. It's the model number. I'd bet it's not 1301, but rather an 1801. It's an 1801 with a 4 speed and a Sherman auxiliary transmission and is a Diesel.

The SN is, or was, right there with that model #, immediately underneath it. On a diesel either or both is apt to have been eroded away by leaking battery acid over the years.

This post was edited by Larry NCKS on 12/08/2021 at 03:27 am.

 

[Sean in PA]

Larry, 1801 was a series, not a model, and it would not have been stamped 1801. An 1801 series tractor with a 4 speed and PTO diesel engine and Sherman would have been stamped 1841.

AGSC2021, the first number might have been eaten away by battery acid as Larry said, so it might be 41301-S D, which would be a 4000 light industrial model with a 4 speed plus a Sherman auxiliary transmission and a diesel engine.

Also, as Larry said, if it's got a 4 speed transmission it cannot have a live PTO.

 

[Larry NCKS]

(quoted from post at 06:51:53 12/08/21) Larry, 1801 was a series, not a model, and it would not have been stamped 1801. An 1801 series tractor with a 4 speed and PTO diesel engine and Sherman would have been stamped 1841.

You are correct. I was thinking that 3rd numeral shouldn't be a 0 when I wrote that. I also wasn't thinking that if the SN was washed out, that the 4 could also be washed off the front of the model #.

 

[AGSC2021]

I think I can make out a 4 stamped ahead
of the rest. The SN looks like a gone'r. Is
there anywhere else I can pull a SN to get
a good estimation for the year? Maybe a
casting code on the block?

Thanks for all your help!

 

[Sean in PA]

I think I can make out a 4 stamped ahead
of the rest. The SN looks like a gone'r. Is
there anywhere else I can pull a SN to get
a good estimation for the year? Maybe a
casting code on the block?

Thanks for all your help!

The 4130 light industrial 4000 (last digit is not part of the actual model number, it just says which trans and PTO options it has) was only made in 1963 and 1964. The 4000 light industrial for the two prior years, 1961 and 1962 had a zero (0) in the second position, so they were 4030, not 4130. The 4000 light industrial was not made in any other years.

 

[AGSC2021]

Excellent.

So either a '63 or '64. Would any other
parts be marked to determine which year? I
presume it probably doesn't make a big
difference because of the similarities, but
it'd be nice to know.

This unit has 4 speeds and a lever with
forward, neutral, and reverse. So 4
forward, and 4 reverse speeds. The tractor
has a loader, and it sounds like that was
the common configuration for FEL and fork
lifts. The lever is very sloppy and has
trouble fully engaging forward and reverse
so I want to make sure I'm not missing
anything here.

And since a live PTO is not an option, am I
correct in assuming the PTO is independent?
This is making me think because, I've only
been able to engage the PTO when the
auxiliary transmission was in forward or
reverse and once the clutch was depressed.

AG

 

[Larry NCKS]

(quoted from post at 17:36:11 12/08/21) Excellent.

And since a live PTO is not an option, am I
correct in assuming the PTO is independent?

No. You are not correct. This is a transmission driven PTO. If it's in gear, it stops and goes same as the trasmission does. It is run by the same clutch the transmission is.

An independent PTO is one that does not depend on the transmission or the clutch to operate. While parts of it may be housed within the transmission case, as long the engine is runnig it does what it is told to do no matter what the clutch and transmission are doing.

 

[Sean in PA]

So either a '63 or '64. Would any other
parts be marked to determine which year?

Yes, there should be date codes on all of the major components, the engine, the transmission, the rear axle center housing and trumpets, and the hydraulic lift top cover. They are usually a single numeral followed by a letter followed by one or two more numerals.

 

[Royse]

To clarify what Larry was saying, it is NON live PTO.
You have to depress the clutch to shift it in or out of operation.
Tractor needs to be setting still to do so correctly.
The PTO only works when the clutch is up. Tractor can be moving
or in neutral and setting in still, but the clutch has to be engaged.
If you can find an operator's manual, that would save you some
money on repairs in the long run because it also shows you how
to make the correct adjustments, fluid changes, grease points, etc.

 

[AGSC2021]

3D19 on the engine block.

Does this mean the block was cast april,
1963? If so, is it reasonable to assume
this is a 1963 model and not '64.

I can't say this enough, but thank you for
all of the support.im just a first time
tractor owner trying to muddle my way
through this.

AG

 

[Sean in PA]

Engine block was cast, or engine was assembled, April 19 1963. Depends on where you found that number and what it looks like as to which was done on that date, but yes, it is most likely a 1963 4000 light industrial. Not much changed from 1963 to 1964 in terms of different part numbers or any mechanical procedures in the service manual, so why bother trying to be that specific?