4440 transmission pump questions

[Harry in Ky]

We have this 4440 quad shift tractor back from the "so called" repair shop that (a year and a half ago) installed an engine from a combine into it. Among a long list of issues still to be resolved and things that need to be finished up is the problem of no oil flow from the transmission pump. I have an I&T manual which really has very little detail on how the pump is driven and studying various pages of the parts diagrams doesn't help me piece together what actually makes the pump turn. We have a reprint of the tech manual on order but it's still a few days away, and most likely the detailed diagrams will be blurry black and white copies of copies so that may or may not be the solution I'm hoping for.

My main question here today is this. What could these people have missed or done wrong when assembling the flywheel, clutch, ETC and installing all that back into the tractor that could leave the transmission pump out of the loop? Since I don't know what actually drives it I have no way of determining that.

 

[Tx Jim]

Quad-range trans pump is driven by a hex shaft that goes from a hex interior plug in crankshaft back through trans pump to a bush in a hex plug covered by 3pt centerlink attaching bracket. I wonder if plug with hex center was not installed?? One can remove centerlink bracket & hex plug then rotate engine crankshaft to determine if hex shaft rotates with CS.

 

[Harry in Ky]

This hex center plug is a separate part that fits into the crankshaft how? It makes sense that a combine engine might not have that part installed. It would need to be swapped out while both engines are on the floor?

 

[Harry in Ky]

Shop.Deere.com

Product Details Page.

shop.deere.com

Might items 29, 30, and 31 here be on the list of possibles for this problem?

 

[Fixingfarmer]

When split the first step (or near the top there might be something else first) is to pull that hexagonal drive shaft out the back of the tractor there’s a bracket I believe for the three point then a plug. it’s just a piece of hex shaft about 4 foot long or so. It will be bent if they did anything else before that splitting wise.

You might be able to pull it out and look with a light in there and see all the way I’m not sure I’ve always just reinstalled it by feel till it back in right.

You would think they would have installed everything off the old engine I’m betting they didn’t remove the shaft before splitting. If you can get it out and take a look see if it’s bent or twisted

 

[Harry in Ky]

I hadn't seen the tractor for over a year and a half until today. After what I saw of the job they did and the (un)finished product as it is, I have zero faith that they did much of anything correctly. Details are sketchy at best. The owner dealt with these people so I have only his side of the stories and he doesn't remember all the answers or what questions he asked. The tractor wasn't in bad shape back then, other than a tired engine. Lot's of blow by, oil consumption, ETC. Then one day it developed water in the oil. He asked me if I wanted to overhaul it, but I declined. Next thing I heard he had found this independent shop out in the sticks somewhere and this guy said he could do it. Then I heard about the option of swapping in a running combine engine instead so that became the order of the day. That was a year ago. Then time went by and the project got nowhere. Next they had it running but hydraulic pump was bad so he needed to get a new one. How did that happen? The hydraulics were working fine when it left here. The pump was a couple years old and was a John Deere reman unit I had put in myself. So they acquired a new pump from somewhere, but (what a surprise) the new pump was also no good. So then they more or less abandoned the project. That was some months back and the tractor was finally retrieved a couple days ago, apparently minus a LOT of the old parts.

So this is where we are.
1

 

[Fixingfarmer]

Hydraulic pump is fed by transmission pump.

Pop that shaft out (or make an attempt) and see what you have if you can get it out it might be an easier fix than you think

 

[Harry in Ky]

I agree checking the shaft from the back would be a logical next step, but if it's not turning, what then? How will pulling it out help if it's not being driven from the front side?

 

[Fixingfarmer]

I agree checking the shaft from the back would be a logical next step, but if it's not turning, what then? How will pulling it out help if it's not being driven from the front side?

It won’t but you can see what you are up against in about 10 minutes

If it comes out you can insert a new one if the coupler hex on the flywheel is there

 

[Tx Jim]

I agree checking the shaft from the back would be a logical next step, but if it's not turning, what then? How will pulling it out help if it's not being driven from the front side?

RE10713 is the trans pump drive fitting. https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/8957/referrer/search/pgId/498797 https://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/threads/deere-30-series-pilot-bushing-hex-drive.1698022/

Remove 3 pt centerlink attaching bracket & hex plug, attach good batteries, have someone engage starter when viewing if hex shaft rotates with engine crankshaft.

If trans pump isn't operating then tractor will have no hydraulic pressure even if front hyd pump is good..

 

[Harry in Ky]

I think it's a safe bet these "country boys" weren't aware of this part of the operation. We'll get into that tomorrow and see what happens. I have no idea what happened to the removed engine and half the missing accessories at this point. I think I should plan on locating a replacement.

 

[Tx Jim]

If tractor requires splitting & I think that this will be true be sure to pull hex trans pump driveshaft out the rear of trans case before splitting tractor.

 

[Harry in Ky]

I'm searching for part number RE10713 and it comes up as available but JD parts site says it won't fit this application. The photo doesn't look like what I think it should be. Any thoughts?

RE10713: Clutch Shaft Adapter Bushing | RE10713

Adapter Fitting

shop.deere.com

 

[Harry in Ky]

I've found some other photos of the part in question and it appears to be a sort of tapered plug type of thing that apparently is just driven into a bore in the end of the crankshaft? This part number seems to be involved, but it doesn't show in the 4440 parts diagrams.

There is an old copy of the Deere parts manual for the tractor out in the shop. I'm going to search through that next time out there and see what I can find.

 

[matthies]

I've found some other photos of the part in question and it appears to be a sort of tapered plug type of thing that apparently is just driven into a bore in the end of the crankshaft? This part number seems to be involved, but it doesn't show in the 4440 parts diagrams.

There is an old copy of the Deere parts manual for the tractor out in the shop. I'm going to search through that next time out there and see what I can find.

It's shown with the trans/pto clutch sycro/quad.

 

[Tx Jim]

The part item 3 is shown in the following link that I posted in an earlier thread. An older part # for this part is AR54728
https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/8957/referrer/search/pgId/498797

 

[Harry in Ky]

Can't get that link to open. Just got off the phone with local dealer. He said the new part number appears to be two parts and they have it on order for me. We'll see what shows up. Thanks to all.

 

[Scott 730]

Can't get that link to open. Just got off the phone with local dealer. He said the new part number appears to be two parts and they have it on order for me. We'll see what shows up. Thanks to all.

Why are you ordering parts before teardown? Have you verified if the shaft turns with the engine?

 

[Tx Jim]

Can't get that link to open. Just got off the phone with local dealer. He said the new part number appears to be two parts and they have it on order for me. We'll see what shows up. Thanks to all.

I can't understand why link opens for me when I'm on this forum but not for you. My computer has decided not to allow me to cut/paste a photo on this forum or I would have posted a parts catalog photo.

 

[Scott 730]

I can't understand why link opens for me when I'm on this forum but not for you.

Link works fine for me.