560 Hydraulics explained

[WHFarms]

I have a 560 that won’t lift a 10 ft disc. It could be the cylinder on the disc, the pump, the valve or something plugged.

Can someone explain the how the 560 hydraulics work. I do not have a loader. The fast hitch has been removed and plumbed back into itself with a hose. I have couplings on the front side of the valve on both the left and right side. There is three hydraulic levers. There is some linkage by my left foot that you need to fiddle with or the pump whines to the point you go crazy.

I would honestly disconnect everything except 1 remote and then plump that to the back. It just looks rather complex for something that should be fairly simple.

I haven’t troubleshot anything. I know there is a screen that needs checked, a valve spring and steel ball, and some other items just wanted to understand what it all is for before I tear into it.

 

[Janicholson]

I have a 560 that won’t lift a 10 ft disc. It could be the cylinder on the disc, the pump, the valve or something plugged.

Can someone explain the how the 560 hydralics work. I do not have a loader. The fast hitch has been removed and plumbed back into itself with a hose. I have couplings on the front side of the valve on both the left and right side. There is three hydralic levers. There is some linkage by my left foot that you need to fiddle with or the pump whines to the point you go crazy.

I would honestly disconnect everything except 1 remote and then plump that to the back. It just looks rather complex for something that should be fairly simple.

I haven’t troubleshot anything. I know there is a screen that needs checked, a valve spring and steel ball, and some other items just wanted to understand what it all is for before I tear into it.

On the valves there is a flat sided knob that has a roll pin that points to S (single acting) D Double acting. If the disc is single acting (one hose it must be in S if it is double acting (lifts the wheels) and 2 hoses, it should be in D. Jim

 

[used red MN]

I suspect he has a Teledepth system for that Fast hitch that was removed. I don’t know how that system worked, maybe someone familiar with that could chime in. The Fast hitch outlets could simply be plugged off, they really don’t need a hose loop. I assume your using hoses connected to the front remote ports up under the fuel tank is this correct? Both hoses to the disc connecting to a pair on one side?

 

[rustred]

I have a 560 that won’t lift a 10 ft disc. It could be the cylinder on the disc, the pump, the valve or something plugged.

Can someone explain the how the 560 hydralics work. I do not have a loader. The fast hitch has been removed and plumbed back into itself with a hose. I have couplings on the front side of the valve on both the left and right side. There is three hydralic levers. There is some linkage by my left foot that you need to fiddle with or the pump whines to the point you go crazy.

I would honestly disconnect everything except 1 remote and then plump that to the back. It just looks rather complex for something that should be fairly simple.

I haven’t troubleshot anything. I know there is a screen that needs checked, a valve spring and steel ball, and some other items just wanted to understand what it all is for before I tear into it.

is the oil level full? as that is what pump whine means. does it attempt to try and lift? the filters are on the right side in that big cover on the side of the trans. dont know what u have by your left foot other than the TA lever. post a picture . are you connecting the cyl to one block? each of them levers operates one block., plus thats easy to see just by looking at the linkage. a 3" cylinder works good on these tractors fro lifting. if you hyd. are weak a 2 1/2 cyl. struggles at times, but thats only a 10 ft disc. so it cant be that heavy. i use a 3inch on my 660 with a 14 ft disc. same hydraulic's.

 

[used red MN]

is the oil level full? as that is what pump whine means. does it attempt to try and lift? the filters are on the right side in that big cover on the side of the trans. dont know what u have by your left foot other than the TA lever. post a picture . are you connecting the cyl to one block? each of them levers operates one block., plus thats easy to see just by looking at the linkage. a 3" cylinder works good on these tractors fro lifting. if you hyd. are weak a 2 1/2 cyl. struggles at times, but thats only a 10 ft disc. so it cant be that heavy. i use a 3inch on my 660 with a 14 ft disc. same hydraulic's.

My guess is his tractor was equipped with a Tel-A-Depth system as shown in Drawbar and Hitches section, subsection 256, 258 or 258A in CNHI Farmall 560 parts catalog. I did not look at the diagrams real close, not sure if it is the 460/560 models that had them. One of the designs had small gears (about 3/4” dia.) in it that turned the input rotation/movement from the linkage 90 degrees. If that valving for the Fast hitch is held in the center or neutral, the other hydraulics should work fine. I have never been around a tractor equipped with this. I am thinking that valve or linkage is down by his left foot like he is saying.

 

[WHFarms]

I suspect he has a Teledepth system for that Fast hitch that was removed. I don’t know how that system worked, maybe someone familiar with that could chime in. The Fast hitch outlets could simply be plugged off, they really don’t need a hose loop. I assume your using hoses connected to the front remote ports up under the fuel tank is this correct? Both hoses to the disc connecting to a pair on one side?

Correct. Both hoses where connected to the front remotes on the same side of the tractor. It is indeed a double acting cylinder.

 

[WHFarms]

is the oil level full? as that is what pump whine means. does it attempt to try and lift? the filters are on the right side in that big cover on the side of the trans. dont know what u have by your left foot other than the TA lever. post a picture . are you connecting the cyl to one block? each of them levers operates one block., plus thats easy to see just by looking at the linkage. a 3" cylinder works good on these tractors fro lifting. if you hyd. are weak a 2 1/2 cyl. struggles at times, but thats only a 10 ft disc. so it cant be that heavy. i use a 3inch on my 660 with a 14 ft disc. same hydraulic's.

The oil level is correct. The filters where all changed in the past few months when we overhauled the engine. It has fresh hytran oil. The disc itself is super light. It is just an old IH 10' disc we use on water ways and ditches. I need to do some troubleshooting. When I looked over the WWW it just wasnt real clear how the whole system was designed. I will try to get a picture.

 

[Hayfarmer]

I have a 560 that won’t lift a 10 ft disc. It could be the cylinder on the disc, the pump, the valve or something plugged.

Can someone explain the how the 560 hydralics work. I do not have a loader. The fast hitch has been removed and plumbed back into itself with a hose. I have couplings on the front side of the valve on both the left and right side. There is three hydralic levers. There is some linkage by my left foot that you need to fiddle with or the pump whines to the point you go crazy.

I would honestly disconnect everything except 1 remote and then plump that to the back. It just looks rather complex for something that should be fairly simple.

I haven’t troubleshot anything. I know there is a screen that needs checked, a valve spring and steel ball, and some other items just wanted to understand what it all is for before I tear into it.

I fought with hydraulic pressure on 560 for several years until I went into rear and totally cleaned out reservoir. Just because you changed filter a while ago don't be sure it isn't plugged. If your disc cylinder had crap in it it could be plugged again. Do you have power steering and does it work ok? The power steering pump piggy backs on hydraulic pump and if filter plugs it will usually affects that first. There is also a pressure control/safety valve under panels ahead of your feet. It could have a broken spring or problems also.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

The oil level is correct. The filters where all changed in the past few months when we overhauled the engine. It has fresh hytran oil. The disc itself is super light. It is just an old IH 10' disc we use on water ways and ditches. I need to do some troubleshooting. When I looked over the WWW it just wasnt real clear how the whole system was designed. I will try to get a picture.

The linkage by your foot is the feedback linkage for the aforementioned Tel-a-Depth system. When you moved the lever on the far right to position the hitch, the hitch would move the linkage through a bunch of rods and bellcranks until it got to the commanded position. The linkage would then shut off the hydraulic pressure to the hitch and hold it in place.

With the hitch gone the linkage isn't being held in position. You can kick it with your foot, or move the lever on the far right, and cause the system to go on demand. THAT is the whine that you hear.

It's been a while but if I'm not mistaken the fast hitch control valve is on the outside of the stack on the left. Loosen the four (or is it three?) bolts holding the stack together, remove the side cover, remove the fast hitch control valve, and replace the side cover. You will need spacers or shorter bolts to get things to tighten up. That will eliminate the fast hitch valve as the source of your problem.

Don't feel bad that you can't find information on how the system was designed. You won't find much information on ANY tractor hydraulic systems.

 

[Janicholson]

The linkage by your foot is the feedback linkage for the aforementioned Tel-a-Depth system. When you moved the lever on the far right to position the hitch, the hitch would move the linkage through a bunch of rods and bellcranks until it got to the commanded position. The linkage would then shut off the hydraulic pressure to the hitch and hold it in place.

With the hitch gone the linkage isn't being held in position. You can kick it with your foot, or move the lever on the far right, and cause the system to go on demand. THAT is the whine that you hear.

It's been a while but if I'm not mistaken the fast hitch control valve is on the outside of the stack on the left. Loosen the four (or is it three?) bolts holding the stack together, remove the side cover, remove the fast hitch control valve, and replace the side cover. You will need spacers or shorter bolts to get things to tighten up. That will eliminate the fast hitch valve as the source of your problem.

Don't feel bad that you can't find information on how the system was designed. You won't find much information on ANY tractor hydraulic systems.

Could it be simpler to remove the entire system except the valve at the quadrant? That might allow the rear cylinder control to be used as an auxiliary control/source. Jim

 

[Blackstack]

The linkage by your foot is the feedback linkage for the aforementioned Tel-a-Depth system. When you moved the lever on the far right to position the hitch, the hitch would move the linkage through a bunch of rods and bellcranks until it got to the commanded position. The linkage would then shut off the hydraulic pressure to the hitch and hold it in place.

With the hitch gone the linkage isn't being held in position. You can kick it with your foot, or move the lever on the far right, and cause the system to go on demand. THAT is the whine that you hear.

It's been a while but if I'm not mistaken the fast hitch control valve is on the outside of the stack on the left. Loosen the four (or is it three?) bolts holding the stack together, remove the side cover, remove the fast hitch control valve, and replace the side cover. You will need spacers or shorter bolts to get things to tighten up. That will eliminate the fast hitch valve as the source of your problem.

Don't feel bad that you can't find information on how the system was designed. You won't find much information on ANY tractor hydraulic systems.

Regarding the Tele-Depth-System; this is exactly the solution I was going to offer, but he said he has the 2 fast hitch ports connected with a hose. This would explain why he has no lifting power to the other remote but wouldn't explain the whine as nothing is being dead headed. The small gears in the remote for the Fast Hitch have a habit of breaking and is the reason most Tele-Depth-Systems are removed in the first place. You can replace that remote with a conventional remote. Also, on my 460 something is broken inside of one of my conventional remotes where the dial to set single acting or double acting doesn't work as intended. It has a sweet spot somewhere in between single acting and double acting that makes it work correctly as a double acting remote. I have to adjust it occasionally as it will slip into a single acting mode and I have a double acting loader. I don't know how common this problem is but it could be your problem too.

To the OP: Does the motor labor at all at idle when you're trying to lift the disk?

 

[Janicholson]

Regarding the Tele-Depth-System; this is exactly the solution I was going to offer, but he said he has the 2 fast hitch ports connected with a hose. This would explain why he has no lifting power to the other remote but wouldn't explain the whine as nothing is being dead headed. The small gears in the remote for the Fast Hitch have a habit of breaking and is the reason most Tele-Depth-Systems are removed in the first place. You can replace that remote with a conventional remote. Also, on my 460 something is broken inside of one of my conventional remotes where the dial to set single acting or double acting doesn't work as intended. It has a sweet spot somewhere in between single acting and double acting that makes it work correctly as a double acting remote. I have to adjust it occasionally as it will slip into a single acting mode and I have a double acting loader. I don't know how common this problem is but it could be your problem too.

To the OP: Does the motor labor at all at idle when you're trying to lift the disk?

Clean off the control knob with brake clean or? and epoxy to roll pin in that position. It might not need much to make it stay. Jim

 

[Blackstack]

Clean off the control knob with brake clean or? and epoxy to roll pin in that position. It might not need much to make it stay. Jim

No thanks.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

Could it be simpler to remove the entire system except the valve at the quadrant? That might allow the rear cylinder control to be used as an auxiliary control/source. Jim

No, because the equalization mechanism is INSIDE the valve. It does not operate like a normal valve.

 

[Rotten Ralph]

I just got a disc mower with a single acting cylinder and have never moved the control knobs. I know they are in double act mode but do they match the lever positions? In other words left knob to left lever and right knob to center lever??

 

[used red MN]

Hello Ralph welcome to YT! Yes they are in order and match the remote lever locations.

 

[rustred]

It’s self explanatory , the control lever linkage each goes to one hyd. Block. Look how the linkage is in the same order with the blocks. Not being a smart azz either , just so u can see that. Three levers equals 3 blocks on some tractors.

 

[Rotten Ralph]

Hello Ralph welcome to YT! Yes they are in order and match the remote lever locations.

OK thanks a lot. I thought it should be but I'm always nervous about moving something that might have been in the same spot for 60 years!!

 

[Absent Minded Farmer]

I just got a disc mower with a single acting cylinder and have never moved the control knobs. I know they are in double act mode but do they match the lever positions? In other words left knob to left lever and right knob to center lever??

The knob on the right is for the right lever, the knob in the middle is for the left lever & the knob on the left is the Tel-A-Depth valve lever on the right of the stack.

Mike

 

[Rotten Ralph]

Thanks to you all. Exactly what Blackstack is talking about is what I'm afraid is going to happen since I don't know if these have ever been moved! We're gonna find out here shortly tho. Since I have found all you guru's a couple more questions if I may. My drawbar has started to leak off and I read it could be the valve under the seat?? Any answers and what I might need to fix it? Also I use this tractor to feed in winter and the hydraulics are either slow or don't work at all until the tractor warms up. Right now they work good. One guy told me it was my oil but after reading over on RP for a few years I hate to even kick that beehive!!