67 Ford 2000 Fuel Pump Alignment??

[Mattoney01]

Good Sunday to everyone! Take a lot at these pictures and let me know whether you think the fuel pump is in time. The previous owner of the tractor said he took the tractor to a local mechanic to get the fuel pump rebuilt. I m not sure why he did that. I ve kinda thought the tractor may have never been placed back in time correctly due to a bit of a rough idle, some white smoke and a slight mis at an higher rpm range. If I had to guess probably around PTO speed. (TACH not working) He did say the tractor was hard to start but I ve fixed that problem. All of those are signs of a mistimed fuel pump but a quick valve adjustment cleared the hard start problem. I ve replaced all the injectors, fuel filters, cleaned the air filter trying to chase this issue but it hasn t helped the exact problem.

The owners manual states when the notch on the fuel pump mounting flange is even with 0 mark on the timing cover then the pump is in time. However, if you take a look at the pictures the original timing mark on the fuel pump is gone. It looks to me the fella that worked on the pump made this line himself and stuck it back on there lining things up the best he could. The owners manual shows the original line in the center of the hole. What do you guys think?

 

[Bern]

As long as the mark on the pump lines up with the zero on the cover, your static timing is correct, at least
as much as you can determine without sending the pump away to a pump shop for internal calibration.

If the engine misfires at higher speeds, that usually indicates that the internal advance mechanism in the
pump is stuck, and is not dynamically advancing the timing as the RPMs increase. The best and easiest way to
verify this is with a diesel timing light. If you don't have one of those, manually advance the pump about
5-10 degrees (as a test only!) by rotating the top of the pump towards you (which is down on the scale on
the timing cover). If the misfire clears up, you can safely conclude that your advance mechanism is stuck.
At that point you'll need to assess your mechanical abilities to see whether or not you feel qualified to
tear into the pump to free it up (note: most people have no business tearing into one of those pumps).

 

[Mattoney01]

Thanks for the information. When I was looking at it earlier I thought about rotating the pump just slightly down the scale. To me it looks like it may be out of time slightly as the line on the pump, which I believe that gentleman made himself, is slightly above the 0. I would think the factory timing mark would be dead center on the mounting flange of the pump. If it is then I believe it s just slightly mis aligned but I don t really have anyway to know as the timing mark on this pump is gone. The top and bottom mounted bolts are easy to get out but the inner bolt, closer to the block, is blocked by cylinder 3 s fuel line. Likey I ll have to remove that line from the pump to give me enough room to get the bolt out. Looks like it s going to be tight! But, I ll give it a shot and report back. Thanks again.

 

[Majorman]

When that range of tractors first came out, some of them had something
that Fords called an Irregular Exhaust Beat, something that was also
suffered by Perkins engines in Massey Ferguson tractors and on the Claas
combines of the time.
Fords did a campaign change and we mechanics had to go round and install
Anti Flutter Valves or Pressurisation Valves in the injector lines. These
replaced the banjo bolts where the injector lines leave the pump. If your
tractor has plain bolt heads, then it has no Anti Flutter valves. These
have a longer head.
The IEB is not harmful just annoying. It occurs exactly as you say as the
revs increase around PTO speed.

 

[Dieseltech]

I've seldom seen a stuck advance piston, but it can happen. What I DO see often is worn transfer pump blades and liner which should be replaced anytime pump is apart.
When the blade length wears over time the pressure drops internally, which also upsets the advance piston curve movement. Since pump design is constant end, variable
beginning of injection the only correct way to see the advance piston move is with the pump advance degree tool used on the tests stand. That tool works well on CAV DPA
Cummins and Perkins applications on engine, but can't be used on engine on Ford three or four-cylinder engines as the test gage plug is next to engine block.

 

[Dieseltech]

CAV/LUCAS/DELPHI three cylinder pumps can suffer IEB with the wrong choice transfer pump blade rotor installed too.

 

[Bern]

You don't have to take the mounting bolts out to change the timing. Simply loosen them 1/2 turn and rotate
the pump just like you would the distributor on an older gas engine.

Give it a few degrees of advance and see if your misfire goes away.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 09:15:15 07/17/22) When that range of tractors first came out, some of them had something
that Fords called an Irregular Exhaust Beat, something that was also
suffered by Perkins engines in Massey Ferguson tractors and on the Claas
combines of the time.
Fords did a campaign change and we mechanics had to go round and install
Anti Flutter Valves or Pressurisation Valves in the injector lines. These
replaced the banjo bolts where the injector lines leave the pump. If your
tractor has plain bolt heads, then it has no Anti Flutter valves. These
have a longer head.
The IEB is not harmful just annoying. It occurs exactly as you say as the
revs increase around PTO speed.

Wow that s really interesting! I ll have to check that out when I get home. I don t notice any type of performance struggle when it does it so maybe I m worrying over nothing. Thanks for sharing that.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 11:37:24 07/17/22)

(quoted from post at 09:15:15 07/17/22) When that range of tractors first came out, some of them had something
that Fords called an Irregular Exhaust Beat, something that was also
suffered by Perkins engines in Massey Ferguson tractors and on the Claas
combines of the time.
Fords did a campaign change and we mechanics had to go round and install
Anti Flutter Valves or Pressurisation Valves in the injector lines. These
replaced the banjo bolts where the injector lines leave the pump. If your
tractor has plain bolt heads, then it has no Anti Flutter valves. These
have a longer head.
The IEB is not harmful just annoying. It occurs exactly as you say as the
revs increase around PTO speed.

Wow that s really interesting! I ll have to check that out when I get home. I don t notice any type of performance struggle when it does it so maybe I m worrying over nothing. Thanks for sharing that.

These look to me to be regular sized bolts.

 

[Majorman]

You can see the banjo bolts on this pump are different to yours. These are
what Ford got us to fit.

Dieseltech is also spot on with his diagnosis too. I spent many
frustrating hours trying to sort out the problem on a Perkins 6.354 on a
combine harvester, removing and refitting the injection pump and using the
test rig to try and find the problem. It always came up OK on the rig but
gave problems on the engine. Eventually found the problem was on the fuel
lift pump not the injection pump. The operating pin had worn so that the
lift pump was not delivering a full stroke, new pin and the problem was
cured.

No lift pump on your tractor though.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 14:52:08 07/17/22)
<img src=https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cvphotos/cvphoto130796.jpg>

You can see the banjo bolts on this pump are different to yours. These are
what Ford got us to fit.

Dieseltech is also spot on with his diagnosis too. I spent many
frustrating hours trying to sort out the problem on a Perkins 6.354 on a
combine harvester, removing and refitting the injection pump and using the
test rig to try and find the problem. It always came up OK on the rig but
gave problems on the engine. Eventually found the problem was on the fuel
lift pump not the injection pump. The operating pin had worn so that the
lift pump was not delivering a full stroke, new pin and the problem was
cured.

No lift pump on your tractor though.

Thanks for the info. I tried to get the bolt closer to the engine block loose enough today and didn t have any luck. I don t really want to remove the fuel line and it really boils down to I don t have the right tool for the job. I really need a ratcheting wrench to get it done. I was able to loosen it tho but the fuel line stops progress. I loosened the other 2 hoping that the 3rd was loose enough but the fuel pump is on there tight! It didn t even consider budging lol. I m going to sleep on it and try it again another day and see if a slight adjustment will help. If it doesn t, I m going to chalk it up to the issue you discussed earlier and go on about my day. It doesn t seem to bother the tractor any when it seems to miss but it does begin to white smoke when it misses which leads me to believe it s a fueling issue. Was is common to see white smoke when you were fixing these?

 

[Bern]

The white smoke while it misses definitely leads me to believe that it's a timing issue.

I do believe the 3rd bolt you're fighting can be accessed with an extension and a socket from the backside.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 06:10:13 07/18/22) The white smoke while it misses definitely leads me to believe that it's a timing issue.

I do believe the 3rd bolt you're fighting can be accessed with an extension and a socket from the backside.

You were right! I was able to get an extension through there to loosen the bolt up. How easy should this be to adjust? I loosened all three bolts and I was able to very slightly move the pump but it still had a lot of resistance. I ll post a before and after picture of it to see if it was moved any at all but I don t think it moved very much. I have a pretty strong grip and with both hands for leverage I couldn t get it to really go anywhere. I wouldn t say I cranking on it but I was using some good force. Does anything else need to be loosened besides the 3 bolts holding the pump on?

I started it up I m not so sure it was actually any different. The miss was still there but it really did seem that it wasn t smoking as bad. I even moved the tractor to a better spot to really get a better angle. Maybe I m on the right track but before I really tug on it anymore I d like a little more feedback. I ll post before and after pics. Thank you all for the feedback.

 

[Dieseltech]

You may need to move the pump a bit more to help clear the white smoke.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 02:18:21 07/19/22) You may need to move the pump a bit more to help clear the white smoke.

Even with the bolts loose should there be some resistance when trying to rotate the pump? Mine was pretty hard to rotate in both directions. I want to make sure that s normal before trying to move any further.

 

[Bern]

Yes, that is normal because of the injection lines. If you were to take the injection lines off it would
spin freely. I use a big channel locks to assist with the rotation. Try turning it at least 3-5 degrees.

 

[Eman85]

You have the lines attached so that is probably the resistance. I'll say it just because I didn't see where anyone else did. Don't have the pump loose or try to adjust with the engine running.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 06:38:44 07/19/22) Yes, that is normal because of the injection lines. If you were to take the injection lines off it would
spin freely. I use a big channel locks to assist with the rotation. Try turning it at least 3-5 degrees.

You know, when I woke up this morning I thought the injector lines were probably the culprits. After looking at a spec sheet of the pump it shows a mark on the gear that "mates" with a mark on the gear of the tractor. I would assume that it would be virtually impossible for anyone to not install the pump back on the tractor correctly. I m going to give it some more force and try to get it to rotate more. Even with the little bit I moved it yesterday I do feel like it wasn t as bad but maybe I m just being too optimistic lol. I ll follow up and thank you all for the responses.

 

[Bern]

Indeed, timing those pumps is pretty much idiot proof. I suspect you'll note a significant change if you
rotate it a few degrees.

 

[Mattoney01]

(quoted from post at 06:28:13 07/20/22) Indeed, timing those pumps is pretty much idiot proof. I suspect you'll note a significant change if you
rotate it a few degrees.

You are 100% right. It did make a big difference. I rotated it more yesterday evening and the misfire and smoke has cleared up. I rotated overall probably 4 degrees total. Thanks for your help.