841 with double clutch?

[ccasaus2k1]

I have someone who wants to sell me an 1960 841 with a double clutch. I checked the parts manual and it says the double clutch wasn't available. I saw the pictures of it, and verified the serial number and model number, but he claims it has a double clutch. Was that a factory option? Who's confused?

 

[Ultradog MN]

If you have in fact verified with the serial number that it is an 841 then it can not have a double clutch. Seller is confused.
Ask him how many speeds the tranny has. An 841 should have a 4 speed tranny.

 

[souNdguy]

the middle digit of the model id is the trans / clutch type.

841 is a 4 spd trans with single clutch

851 is a 5 spd trans with single clutch

861 is a 5 spd trans with double clutch

soundguy

 

[ccasaus2k1]

He said the model number was 341, the pictures show an 801 and the shifter is a 4 speed which the owner verified. He claimed to have run a baler with it, which is why I am looking at an 801 with double clutch. After revisiting the pictures it does appear to have a lever for a Sherman, but the owner did not mention that. All told does $3600 sound unreasonable? Owner did mention it probably will need an overhaul, it's a gas engine, tires are about 40%, and sheetmetal is in ok shape. He also said it's been parked for a while.

 

[ccasaus2k1]

You guys tell me here's a picture.

 

[8N'r--WI]

CC---what Sounder and UD have said is all true...

BUT...about 3-4 months ago, I located (at a reputable tractor dealership) what they advertised as a Ford 840 with Live PTO (double clutch).

I had salesman and the manager (both farmers and more familiar with tractors than I) confirm more than once, the serial number, model number, and the fact that it had LIVE PTO in it. I even asked one of them to go out and push the clutch in halfway, shift the tractor, and verify the PTO was still turning.....

I negotiated the deal and was planning on going up the following weekend to pick up the tractor and I got a phone call from the owner of the dealership, apologizing for the mistake...The tractor DID NOT have the double clutch...which brings me to the info I will share with you...

While I was "scratching my head" and contacting some of the folks I knew, that were more familiar with these 100 Series Tractors, I was told by two separate authorities, that a 2-stage clutch COULD be put into the 841 and 851, but at CONSIDERABLE EXPENSE and a lot of pain!!!

One of the guys said there was a discussion posted on this site or the other one that talked about it.....

The other guy, a retired Ford Tractor Mechanic, told me he personally had put a 2-stage clutch in a 841....

I am still guessing, that the one you are looking at, does not have the Live PTO,,,,but go check it out...you never know...

Tim (bought an 860 instead)

 

[awhtx]

It's an 841 with a Sherman combo. It positively cannot have a double clutch. Maybe he's calling the Sherman a double clutch because he doesn't know better.
It's not worth $3600 in my area. With a worn engine and worn tires it's a $1500 tractor or less.

 

[awhtx]

Your retired Ford mechanic has dementia. He never put a double clutch in a 4 speed- it's impossible to do so. It is possible to change a X5X to X6X configuration but you will need about 25 parts in addition to the clutch and flywheel to do so.

 

[Fordfarmer]

While it wouldn't be an ideal tractor for the job, it most certainly could run a baler. You do NOT need live PTO to run a baler. It's nice to have, but not a must have.
Where are you located? Ultra and I both have tractors for sale that would handle a baler very nicely (3-cyl. 4000 diesel and 5000 gas), for not too much more than his asking price. He's in eastern MN, I'm in western WI.

 

[old]

I agree wit h AWHTX and to top it off it is even painted the wrong color it should be gray over red and to me that knocks the price down a lot plus if the engine needs work your looking at $1500 plus to rebuild the engine so maybe $1000-1500 if even that much

 

[ccasaus2k1]

I'm in NM and this one is just down the road. I already have an 851 so this wouldn't be an upgrade without the double clutch.

 

[souNdguy]

twice as high... with a worn engine that needs a rebuild I agree with the others.. it's a 1500$ machine.. even with the sherman.

as AWHTX said.. it is possible, thru alot of work to turn a *5* into a *6*.. but not a *4*

only way to do that might be with a pinion clutch and a hand lever like was used on a NAA with 'live pto' kit.. essentially adding a drivetrain clutch..

soundguy

 

[Jim.UT]

I run a baler with an 850 so I agree with whoever said you CAN bale without live PTO.

 

[Dean]

Yes, a double clutch/live PTO set up can be installed into an 841, and it will involve a considerable expense as it will necessitate the installation of a live PTO 5 speed transmission as well.

Dean

 

[Tony Jacobs]

Hello Tim Daley , All of your seperate authorities and tractor mechanics are wrong as everyone else here on the board has said it is not possible to put a double clutch in a 4 speed tractor . But what you are doing is confusing the LIVE PTO and DOUBLE CLUTCH which one does require the other . It is possible that someone years ago put a DEARBORN LIVE PTO SETUP from an NAA into a newer 4 speed tractor which IS POSSIBLE WITHOUT A DOUBLE CLUTCH . So that 840 that you looked at could have had LIVE PTO but NOT a DOUBLE CLUTCH and no one knew that it did, since you said it was advertised as LIVE PTO which is possible. Thanks Tony