8N Battery Question

[Paul L.]

Hello!

I have a 1952 8N, converted to 12volt. It runs fine. However, when I don't run it for a few weeks the battery seems to be drained and it won't turn over.
Just one or two clicks and nothing. I put the battery charger on it and once charged everything is fine. The tractor does sit outside during the summer when
not in use, and is covered with a tarp if that makes any difference.

My question is...is this normal for the battery to drain like that, or do I have some issue that drains the battery prematurely? How would I even check to see
if I have something draining the battery out?

This is not a huge issue, but is frustrating.

Thanks!

Paul L
Michigan

 

[lha]

My 9n is 6v,but still sits for weeks,sometimes months and will start on the first rev of the crankshaft. Maybe there is a parasitic draw somewhere in the electrical system. I run a Deka battery and just went to the second in about 17 years.

 

[Lynn Patrick]

I put a battery dis-connect on all my tractors, so if they have to sit for any time I don't have to worry about any draw.
I have had a couple of 12v conversions that did drain the battery & blamed it on failure of the diode used.

This post was edited by Lynn Patrick on 09/01/2021 at 04:32 pm.

 

[Colin King]

You are probably leaking voltage from the battery back through the alternator because of a faulty diode. You can install an inline diode in your alternator output wire. NAPA p/n 276-1661. Use a heat gun and heat shrink tubing to cover your splice where the diode was installed.

Colin

 

[kossuth]

(quoted from post at 19:48:49 09/01/21) You are probably leaking voltage from the battery back through the alternator because of a faulty diode. You can install an inline diode in your alternator output wire. NAPA p/n 276-1661. Use a heat gun and heat shrink tubing to cover your splice where the diode was installed.

Colin

his or you have something else pulling current like a bad light switch or ignition switch.

 

[Phil N]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/283338243372?hash=item41f8467d2c:g:jSAAAOSw~VBcO93A

Click on above and put on a battery disconnect. There is also a style for side terminal batteries.

 

[jimtrs]

(quoted from post at 17:43:37 09/01/21) ..... How would I even check to see
if I have something draining the battery out?

There are multiple ways a battery can be discharged when the tractor is off.

To see if you have a drain when off, disconnect the ground cable from the battery, and insert a small test light between the disconnected cable and the battery post the cable came off of. If there is a current draw the lamp will light. If you do have a draw, disconnect one electric Item at a time until the test light goes out (re-connecting each item if it didn't make a change). When it does go out, you found the item causing the drain.
As said, some will just disconnect the battery ground when the tractor is off to avoid draining a battery, until the problem can be isolated and fixed.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 22:48:49 09/01/21) You are probably leaking voltage from the battery back through the alternator because of a faulty diode. You can install an inline diode in your alternator output wire. NAPA p/n 276-1661. Use a heat gun and heat shrink tubing to cover your splice where the diode was installed.

Colin

ollin, I wonder where that advice comes from? 276-1661 is a Radio Shack part number for a 6 ampere diode. It could never survive in the alternator output lead, since alt output current can be 10X that rating. Secondly, diodes installations with those 10SI alternators is not in the alt output lead, but rather in the Excite #1 lead. It is good to try and help, but bad "info/advice" is sometimes worse than no info/advice at all.

 

[Jim L WA]

The first thing I would do is, check the battery with a hydrometer to see if it might have a bad cell or two. Or take it to an auto supply and have it tested. You might not have a parasitic draw at all (outside of the battery).

 

[Colin King]

JMOR, Interestingly, that advice came from my NAPA shop and it's part of their kit that they sell for the 6V-12V conversion w/10SI alternator. I have one on my 961D. I am not questioning your experience and knowledge, but this is farm country here, and I would be very surprised if NAPA were selling this if it were incorrect. If they were, they'd get into trouble quick.

Respectfully,
Colin

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 22:01:23 09/02/21) JMOR, Interestingly, that advice came from my NAPA shop and it's part of their kit that they sell for the 6V-12V conversion w/10SI alternator. I have one on my 961D. I am not questioning your experience and knowledge, but this is farm country here, and I would be very surprised if NAPA were selling this if it were incorrect. If they were, they'd get into trouble quick.

Respectfully,
Colin

ou just misunderstood what they were telling you.

 

[Den N Ms]

That little 1/4 watt maybe 6 amp diode will not live in the output side of a 10SI alternator ,it will pop! They are used on the #1 excite lead from the ignition switch.That alternator can put out 30-60 amps at start up.

 

[Jim.ME]

Can you post a picture of the printed instructions (legible) so we can see the wording of the instruction to do that? Is this a kit all NAPA stores can sell or a "kit" your local NAPA guys put together for people? If it is an across the board NAPA kit, what is the part number of the kit? The diode 276-1661 part number only comes up as the Radio Shack diode that has been used for years in the excite wire. I can not find that number as a NAPA part number. Just trying to get all the info for future reference.

 

[rvirgil_KS]

Some one wire alternators have been known to drain a battery over time.

You could disconnect the alternator output wire and see if battery still drains.

As mentioned, a disconnect switch in the battery ground cable would be one remedy.

 

[Caryc]

A simple cut off switch works for me. I have one on both my tractors.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 11:42:28 09/03/21)
A simple cut off switch works for me. I have one on both my tractors.

hat is especially good for tractors that are not run for several months, as even the 3-wire standard Delco 10-SI has a drain via the Sense terminal (#2). It is microamperes & theoretically should take a year or more to drain a perfect battery, but..............

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley]

Simple solution: Get a good float charger. It will keep the battery fully charged when not in use so it is when you are ready to go. The DELTRAN BATTERY TENDER is a very good band and I've had them for years now. 5 year warranty and mine are going on 7. Wally World has them, about $35. The battery is the heart of any tractor. The battery must sustain a full charge under load (meet specific gravity) in order to fully operate the ignition and charging systems functions. Simply connecting a basic trickle charger each time you want to start your tractor will not work. Get the battery tested at a reliable shop on their test machine -it is usually at no charge (pun intended). If it tests weak or bad, replace it. Buy a good brand like DEKA, INTERSTATE, EXIDE, or DURACELL. You might think you are saving money on a cheap, bargain house brand but those usually have 2 years or less on average lifespan. 12V is GRP 25 or GRP 35. ZGood, correct battery cables are also required. Finally, regardless if you use a GEN or an ALT, if yo do not also use a fan belt tensioning device with it, the system will never charge the battery and your'll have a dead battery every time. Just because you have a 12V battery doesn't mean it is wired correctly for that setup.

Tim Daley(MI)

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley]

Also note that Radio Shack is no longer in business anyway. Most of the Radio Supply outlets I bought from when I built kit such as Lafayette Radio, Allied Radio (later
Radio Shack), Olsen, RSE, Heathkit, et al are long out of business now. Kids just didn't become interested in learning electronics, only how to play them.

Tim Daley(MI)

 

[Caryc]

Radio Shack still sells by a website.

 

[Colin King]

Yes, you are correct. I did the job almost 6 years ago and my memory failed me. I checked the morning before last when I was using the tractor to haul manure and the diode is on the excite wire.

 

[Eman85]

No, it is not normal for a good battery to drain down unless something is draining it.
A battery disconnect isn't a bad idea but checking the system and understanding it and fixing it is a better idea.
Does the tractor have an alternator conversion on it?

 

[Paul L.]

Hi All,

Just an update here.....

First, thanks for all the responses and great suggestions on what I need to look for. I tested the battery, and it was completely dead! I purchased a new battery today, along with a Battery disconnect switch. That was a great suggestion for sure! I have those installed now. I figured this was a good safety net, which will then allow me time to identify if and where I have further electronic issues. My 8N does have an alternator, and I am starting to wonder if that is working properly. So, next weekend I will test that to verify.

This electronic stuff is pretty new to me. Mechanical issues I have no trouble fixing, but am not so confident when it comes to the electrical side. With help from this forum and the great members who read these posts and share their knowledge, I know i will get over the hurdles!

Thanks again!

Paul
Michigan

 

[Caryc]

Easy to test your alternator. Start up your tractor and put it to about half throttle. Now take a volt meter and put the red lead on your positive batt terminal and the black lead on your neg. batt terminal. I forget now but you should get maybe reading 13+ volts. Now try the same thing with your tractor at idle and see what you get.