Case 1690 David Brown pushing coolant out upper hose

[motoOzarks]

I posted this in the Case forum but there is limited traffic there.....

Case 1690 David Brown pushing coolant out the upper hose and coming out the overflow. More rpm shoots more out faster.

No smoke of any kind out exhaust. No blowby. Starts good.

What's the most likely cause ? What do I hit with a hammer?

thanks

 

[caterpillar guy]

Sounds like leak from combustion be it a head gasket from one cylinder or some other way. I would not run it till I checked it further. If it hydro locks a cylinder it could get real expensive real quick. Bent rods or valves or push rods for a few.

 

[motoOzarks]

I'm hoping since it had nice green antifreeze that it's not a freeze damage issue.

 

[showcrop]

I posted this in the Case forum but there is limited traffic there.....

Case 1690 David Brown pushing coolant out the upper hose and coming out the overflow. More rpm shoots more out faster.

No smoke of any kind out exhaust. No blowby. Starts good.

What's the most likely cause ? What do I hit with a hammer?

thanks

What overflow? Are you referring to a pressure release radiator cap? Or a pressure release cap on the expansion tank?

 

[jon f mn]

Those had an issue with the heads and coolant flow, but I don't know what it is. I'll ask around and see if I can get an answer. Seems like it was some kind of seal between the heads that was the problem.

 

[jon f mn]

Has this motor had recent work? One common reason for head gasket failure is not doing a proper re-torque after installing heads. Sounds like a head gasket failure by the symptoms described. They did have an issue with the heads leaking water on the early years of those, so if the updates haven't been done they should be done while apart. That engine is a doubled 885 motor, so parts are not hazard to find.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

You can get kits to test for combustion gases in your coolant.

The way it sounds you've got a pretty severe combustion leak. It's not going to be a "hit it with a hammer" or "twist a screwdriver" type of fix.

 

[motoOzarks]

It does not look like it has had any recent work on the heads or otherwise.

 

[motoOzarks]

What overflow? Are you referring to a pressure release radiator cap? Or a pressure release cap on the expansion tank?

That's what prompted me to post and ask as this tractor has no radiator cap
The factory radiator has a screw in plastic fill plug on the radiator top, with an overflow tube separate from it out the side of the top radiator tank to a factory plastic overflow tank that has a plastic lid similar to most under hood overflow or windshield wiper jugs. It also has an overflow tube on that plastic lid but it's not a pressure activated deal just a way for overflow to escape.
The flow from the upper radiator hose into the radiator, looking through the screw plug, is just that, it's not bubbly or in surges just a smooth flow like you would expect from a water pump to deliver. The flow is a drizzle at idle and a stream with rpm and the reaction is as you would expect from a water pump.
I've only ran the motor 3 times for a few minutes as I have replaced a couple steering hoses to bleed air. I have not had it up to operating temp.

 

[motoOzarks]

Those had an issue with the heads and coolant flow, but I don't know what it is. I'll ask around and see if I can get an answer. Seems like it was some kind of seal between the heads that was the problem.

There is piping (small hose) between the heads for coolant. I have seen no evidence of leakage.

 

[CDN 400]

Take the fan belt off so the water pump isn't turning and try it. If it does it without the water pump turning its compression in the cooling system and the head will be coming off.

 

[showcrop]

That's what prompted me to post and ask as this tractor has no radiator cap
The factory radiator has a screw in plastic fill plug on the radiator top, with an overflow tube separate from it out the side of the top radiator tank to a factory plastic overflow tank that has a plastic lid similar to most under hood overflow or windshield wiper jugs. It also has an overflow tube on that plastic lid but it's not a pressure activated deal just a way for overflow to escape.
The flow from the upper radiator hose into the radiator, looking through the screw plug, is just that, it's not bubbly or in surges just a smooth flow like you would expect from a water pump to deliver. The flow is a drizzle at idle and a stream with rpm and the reaction is as you would expect from a water pump.
I've only ran the motor 3 times for a few minutes as I have replaced a couple steering hoses to bleed air. I have not had it up to operating temp.

This sounds like a totally different scenario from your OP. "pushing coolant out the upper hose and coming out the overflow." sounds like it is going out onto the ground. "flow from the upper radiator hose into the radiator, looking through the screw plug, is just that, it's not bubbly or in surges just a smooth flow as you would expect" sounds like completely normal. Which is it?

 

[motoOzarks]

This sounds like a totally different scenario from your OP. "pushing coolant out the upper hose and coming out the overflow." sounds like it is going out onto the ground. "flow from the upper radiator hose into the radiator, looking through the screw plug, is just that, it's not bubbly or in surges just a smooth flow as you would expect" sounds like completely normal. Which is it?

It's both actually
It pushes thru the hose into the radiator out the overflow onto the ground

 

[motoOzarks]

I looked online at parts diagrams
The recovery tank in the diagrams has a 7 lb cap on it
Mine has none and is not made for one

So I guess I need to find a recovery tank that takes a pressure cap or solder a regular radiator neck on this deal....

 

[showcrop]

I looked online at parts diagrams
The recovery tank in the diagrams has a 7 lb cap on it
Mine has none and is not made for one

So I guess I need to find a recovery tank that takes a pressure cap or solder a regular radiator neck on this deal....

I used to have a 1490. I remember that plastic plug on top of the radiator, and I know that it had a regular recovery tank with release cap. I think that I would want to put a more conventional recovery tank on it. It shouldn't be any worse than bending up something for a bracket to hold it.

 

[motoOzarks]

A follow up

I fitted a regular radiator tank neck to the radiator with a 7 lb cap and have an overflow hose as is normal. I will mount and attach the overflow tank when I get the chance.
I suspected the thermostat had been removed as it was pushing coolant out even when first started, really as soon as the starter cranked a bit. I put a new one in it.
It now maintains 180 degrees on gauge although I haven't put it under any stress on a hot day at this point.

The overflow tank that was mounted, the one I claimed was factory, was not. The install was done quite well, painted, then covered in dust and such it fooled me.

When I removed the hood to first get at the radiator I also removed the framework with it. When reinstalling everything I separated the hood from the framework and found the original plastic overflow/fill tank with a neck that would accept a standard radiator cap. It was hiding up under there and I never noticed it. It did not have a cap on it or a hose to it. No telling how long this thing has been run with no thermostat or pressure cap. It's probably run like a toaster, ahhh the joy of used tractors........

 

[motoOzarks]

Take the fan belt off so the water pump isn't turning and try it. If it does it without the water pump turning its compression in the cooling system and the head will be coming off.

excellent advice.....I lost the need to confirm what was happening when I replaced the neck on the radiator and put in a thermostat.
I've not noticed any bubbling since but will watch as I get more time on the machine.......

 

[Janicholson]

A follow up

I fitted a regular radiator tank neck to the radiator with a 7 lb cap and have an overflow hose as is normal. I will mount and attach the overflow tank when I get the chance.
I suspected the thermostat had been removed as it was pushing coolant out even when first started, really as soon as the starter cranked a bit. I put a new one in it.
It now maintains 180 degrees on gauge although I haven't put it under any stress on a hot day at this point.

The overflow tank that was mounted, the one I claimed was factory, was not. The install was done quite well, painted, then covered in dust and such it fooled me.

When I removed the hood to first get at the radiator I also removed the framework with it. When reinstalling everything I separated the hood from the framework and found the original plastic overflow/fill tank with a neck that would accept a standard radiator cap. It was hiding up under there and I never noticed it. It did not have a cap on it or a hose to it. No telling how long this thing has been run with no thermostat or pressure cap. It's probably run like a toaster, ahhh the joy of used tractors........

Good solution. A internally collapsed lower hose can also make flow issues. the lining becomes a heart valve like flap. Jim

 

[showcrop]

excellent advice.....I lost the need to confirm what was happening when I replaced the neck on the radiator and put in a thermostat.
I've not noticed any bubbling since but will watch as I get more time on the machine.......

Congratulations! Thanks for posting back.